DSS plea...
 

Good pick up KD! :D

I generally disagree with the above sentiments.
If the deal gets rejected escalation is the only logical consequence because all the things currently in place (TB, CC) have not worked since 2014 (?) Our timing would have to be very lucky if the TB was to make the crucial difference in the next few months, if it has not made the difference since it's inception..

To vote "YES" because you have had enough, want some peace and generally think this is as much as we can get, makes sense and is the low risk, low return option.
To vote "NO" because you think you can create more leverage through action to get an improved deal makes sense but you got to be prepared to do stuff that are rather uncomfortable.
To vote "NO" but not to be prepared to back the keyboard warriordom up with action and think by doing more of the same for a few more weeks and hope the company will suddenly give in and us having the negotiating edge is naive in the extreme ! To vote "NO" and not be prepared to escalate makes no sense at all and you better abstain from the vote.

I have to disagree, while a C&T mass resignation would have been brutal for cx a slow wither on the vine has occurred and will only get worse, and as many have said the company will NEVER allow this to happen again, we either drag this out till the company concedes control of our lifestyles permanently or we concede and never have the power to bring them to the table ever again. QF went through this a couple of years ago, while they didn't win much the pilots got control of their lives and there's wasn't even as crap as ours.

Agree with Avinthenews - THAT is what this is all about.

25-30 years ago when the pay/package side of things was more attractive, nobody cared too much about the lifestyle control - particular when the EFP threshold was at 70 hours.

Now that the pay/workload balance has shifted so substantially, and inexorably, over the years, the ultimate goal HAS to be more (if not complete) work/lifestyle control - however you choose to define that.

And thus not to succumb to being thankful for some crumbs that have been arrogantly dusted off the table.

MorningCoffee....feeling the panic rise a bit are you mate? This management (and snake in the grass GC) has committed to a devils bargain, and it is now going to hoist them on their own petard. There is effectively nothing of value in the proposal, and in return we effectively neuter the AOA, and give management all the tools necessary to turn us into a HK Express with a slightly prettier paint job (and even that is arguable...). Couldn't care less how long the TB and CC have to stay. It will at least be a better option that lying down and giving up the the likes this current management and associated sycophants. Looking forward to Friday....

If you recall all the contracts that CX has produced they all came with assurances that each one would be the last cut. Each time it was a lie.
I don't understand how anyone can vote yes.

As is everyone else on here saying vote no.

Even I was surprised at the hypocrisy from the vote No (but remain as spineless as possible) crowd.

Exactly. Vote NO will mean we keep the status quo for now and continue to apply pressure which gives leverage in a new negotiation. This pressure can be eased or increased at will but ONLY if we vote NO, now.

I get the feeling the company does not care if we vote Yes. It would be great for them and the bonuses if we did.... But realistically did they ever really believe the majority would vote Yes?

Don’t give them intel!!!!
 

I find it funny how he thinks he will remain as the chairman after a NO vote

Latest ds email about what will happen if we vote yes..

"the TA includes an obligation for negotiation for pay".... that and 2 dollars gets me on the hong kong island tram...
Why don't they give us a number and THEN we will vote....what's the rush guys?

"we have received assurances that these will be dealt with expeditiously" (about vacancy bid and reduced roster option)
'Assurances' don't mean jack in this company, how many 'assurances' have we had in the past?

Colleagues,

As most of you are aware, I no longer have a direct "stake" in the game. However, I still respect and honour my colleagues who have been so badly mistreated by this management over far too many years. I can say without equivocation that this is the most momentous vote in the history of the AOA. It is also a vote where it is plainly obvious that the company is desperate to force through one last attempt to neuter and render powerless that same AOA. Even though the company desperately needs a co-operative and pliant workforce, their arrogance sees them once again attempting to bully, intimidate, manipulate and deceive.

There is absolutely nothing in the offer that is worth you giving away the leverage you currently have. It is a fact that the TB and CC are slowly but surely crippling the organisation. It is also a fact that a turning point in the pilot/demand ratio in the industry has finally reduced below 1:1, and many more pilots in CX have either already left, or are making plans to do so. Both those facts combine to put CX management in a place where they are thrashing around, confused and panicked seeing their usual game plan no longer working.

All you have to do now is vote NO, remain stubbornly wedded to the TB and CC and watch as management is left with no choice but to finally begin restoring conditions and work practices to industry norms. Ask yourselves one simple question: "if this was an offer to the pilot groups of BA, QF, UA, DL, AA, LH, AF etc, etc,...would their pilot groups have a single "yes" vote?" . If the obvious answer is NO, then why would a single CX pilot vote for it either?.

Let this insulting, damaging and career ending proposal die the death it deserves. Let the company threaten and intimidate. Ultimately it is healthier for every single one of you to see the true nature of the beast that you work for. You will then know whether there is truly hope for a career in CX or not. With that information you can properly plan and secure the remaining years of your careers. The truth is a far better reality to deal with than lies, deception and false hope. The only way to truly find out the value of the future in CX is to throw this appalling offer back in their faces and insist that they provide you with a proper contract, with industry leading conditions and work rules. Anything less and you have squandered your careers.

I wish everyone the best, and truly hope to see a career at CX returned to the status it once deserved. Traf.

To follow on as Traf's message, there are only two choices in this farce...

1. Vote "yes" and you are wholeheartedly agreeing to yourself and all your colleagues getting shafted in a career debasing agreement..

OR

2. Vote "NO" and, AT THE VERY LEAST, you can save your dignity knowing that you didn't just drop your knickers bend over and say "please ram this piece of garbage up my rear sir" !!

Voting for #2 is, without any question whatsoever, THE ONLY option if you believe, one way or the other, there "may" be "some" chance of improving conditions in the future. Period.

May the Force be with you.

MC, you really need to give it up mate. However, I personally enjoy seeing the evidence of management panic that you portray. As for the management "finding a workaround for the TB", good luck to them. They will be lucky to have any C and T's left, what with many of them leaving over the next year or so. You and your management can barely scrape together enough training capacity to sustain the required regulatory events, never mind being able to actually train upgrades and Commands. Perhaps if you didn't have to replace literally hundreds of pilots that your policies have chased out the door, you could actually focus on growing the airline...you know, like normal companies try to do. Instead, your pathological desire to attack the pilot workforce has led the airline to a place where, in the midst of a worldwide pilot shortage, you find most of your highly trained and experienced crew are saying adios. CX only succeeded in spite of itself all these years, and now that they have competition and are forced to actually demonstrate skilled management, you find you simply are inadequate on all levels. Your only response is to blame the pilots for everything. Don't worry, pretty soon there won't be many of us around to blame. Congrats. Oh, enjoy the vote results later today.. Cheers.

MM,

He's talking about the latest rumour of age 67 retirement. Again, just like the zoologist promised, this will reduce time to command, as well as "getting around the TB".

Luv it!