COS 17
 

The latest COS is making its way around the third floor to be reviewed before being sent to us. I want you to know the fleet offices are NOT on our side no matter what newsletters say.

NO, I will NOT be signing another COS with this company and neither should anyone, enough is enough. You know it won't be an improvement and housing will be going in October as part of the new Cos. We will be blamed for the CMP meltdown. It's very simple, there isn't enough crew to make it work. It's a trick and they are using it against us in all this Time To Win, Project Altitude talk.

We all need to be well aware of what's coming. They will test us and see whom is willing to sell us out again. It's a divide and conquer tactic. Don't fall for it.

WE REALLY NEED TO ALL BE UNITED NOW AGAINST ANOTHER BLATANT ATTACK ON OUR COSs. THIS WILL AFFECT EVERYONE ON ALL BASES.

:ugh:

Totally agree. It's time for action.

How about CC and a training ban?

Enough is enough.

Why would a new COS be shown around the 3rd floor? There is nothing from a Flt Ops perspective in the COS so sounds like a load of BS to me.
Visionary, you may need a new set of specs.

Really
 

New COS definition of a work month - "normally", to ensure proper rest and an adequate normal family lifestyle, crew members will be rostered for 95 hours a month however due to unforeseen circumstances and/or commercial necessity, crew members "may" be rostered for up to 115 hrs per month. If this should occur, rostering managers will, without fail, ensure this does not occur for more than 4 consecutive months or for a total of 9 months in any one calendar year.
To offset for this type occurrence, crew members will receive overtime pay at the threshold of 105 hrs in any 1 month period..

I am labouring under an illusion that I have a contract and that that contract cannot be amended without my agreement to any amendment .

Why should I agree to a new COS which would significantly reduce my life expectancy?

Hilarious. The company can barely operate their fleet as it is. Resignations are mounting by the month. Basically, there are two letters in the alphabet that sum up my response to any change of my cos. You can probably guess what they are. A desperate bunch, and I will quite happily say goodbye if need be. No one here has a 'career', so there is really nothing to lose.

Sickness would go though the roof., and no one would sign

Really? Suspect STW would jump at it, especially if it included a 0.5% increase in pay for only an additional 20 hours work per month. Whats not to like?

Starbear, I can smell your full pants up to my hotel suite.

5% plus housing and zero more hours don't sound so bad now, ey?

You guys didn't like the fine print of the last offer, hope you like the big print of the next offer more....

Oooo....
So this ties in with the latest rule change a very apathetic GC are trying to sell us?
Take a look at this howler in the forum
Nonsense!

The only thing that I'm concerned about right now is that in the last 2 union newsletters, I haven't seen STW's name on the Union resignation list.

May I remind you of the thread circa 6 weeks ago where Sam threw his toys out the pram and announced his resignation. Seems its just more Hot Air from his backside.

You will have the career you deserve 370.

I have always found it baffling -- completely baffling -- that in these high falutin' management schools folks never seem to learn that a workforce divided amongst itself will lose money. It might do OK for awhile in an externally protected market but the day of reckoning always comes. Fix the blame generates useless words. Fix the problem generates solutions.

Divide and conquer might work for some things, but never results in a particularly efficient workforce. And when competition kicks in, efficiency is what counts. Keeping it better than the other guy; having a quality product where folks enforce the high standards of the place and organization they love. Working as a team with justifiable pride in what they do and keeping it great.

Your job can either be something you trudge to simply to pay the bills, or something that is a fun and grateful part of your life. If it's the former, the organization loses its identity and kinda muddles along. Nothing particularly good gets done to make things better and fix things, and 'not my department' starts to kick in as the pipes start to leak and the floors accumulate trash. If it's the latter, the sky's the limit (hey, THERE's a slogan !) in productivity and potential. And folks WANT to be there and are actually happy.

Do you care if the guy who assembled your iPhone loves his job?

Do you think your iPhone would be a better iPhone if the worker was happy while he assembled it?

Do you think the factory owner cares as long as the worker shows up and does what he has been told?

Please pay attention
 

On the other side of flight crew delivery (called something else now) is the COS admin team! The are responsible for, guess??? THE COS(s)! The fleet offices are whom we answer to. Re-read my post, go to the third floor to see what I am talking about. Man alive. Attention to detail gets you a 1 on your ERAS and Level 1 ICAO English fire wall.

Now, Here's what I think is coming. Take a chair, and pay goddam attention.
-The COS 99ers have been told they can go at 55. They want to stay, including a negotiating AOA guy, but has been told BYE! This is what they think of people leaving, THEY DON'T CARE. We really want them to but they don't. 30% cost cuts in flight ops, remember.
-Next, COS08ers can stay but ARAPA will be cancelled unless you sign the RPs or cancelled anyway. You'll get a new "allowance".
-Next, sign COS 17 which will include HKPA, probably an increase for most but the old timers will see a cut, to basically what rental is now. It will also include RPs.

This will be how they get around sign or be fired. You heard it here first.

Don't shoot the messenger.

Have at it. Flame away.

Quote "-The COS 99ers have been told they can go at 55. They want to stay..."

Well, I'm a COS99 and I don't want to stay past 55. I'm looking forward to leaving. But thanks for telling me what I want to do with my life. Cheers.

Seriously!

Some management fishing and the usual suspects start bleating like a heard of goats.

Just for you Visionary:

- On the current teetering operation, Cathay are making shed loads of cash. Shed loads.
- Housing is an allowance to attract special skilled employee groups: like pilots, to Hong Kong and KEEP them there. The CURRENT policy is failing to do that
- Between now and the end of next year, Cathay will lose as many captains as they can train. And if latest numbers are correct, FOs as well.
- We cant attract close to the amount of DE FOs or even SOs that are needed.
- Training has effectively stopped

A new COS to cut the conditions even further and accelerate the drop?? Even they aren't that stupid.

Yup this is basically what I hear aswell, it won't be quite as obvious at first but this is the end game for them right now. Shrink the airline till the expensive folks and fuel is gone, then rapidly expand again on cheap labor. They are using the fuel hedge to cry wolf and cancel their expensive mistakes. Something in the ballpark of 900million hkd is what Anna wants to carve out of fop.

well...AT, a couple of other managers and their bonuses should just about cover it...

I guess I was not clear enough. I meant some of the COS 99ers, not all. Not meant to offend Despot75. Mr Did, It's not they are stupid, again, they don't care.

The offices are now called "flight crew employees relations" and "Flight crew people services", for what it's worth.

Probably shouldn't feed the trolls but

Absolutely, Absolutely, and Absolutely (and the 'do what he is told' without heeded feedback in the other direction from time to time isn't the right thing to do and will result in the ultimate failure of the company; especially when faced with competition--not sure where you get this mindset of a static autocratic organization working well).

At least if I'm going to depend on the iPhone to do anything important or last over the long term. Or do cool new stuff. Or even work. One of the reasons I'm careful where I source my stuff if it's in a critical component and only turn to trusted sources for this. The trusted sources have excellent customer service, don't dwell in excuses, and if there is ever a problem make it right. When I talk to them I get the impression they love what they do and are grateful to be a part of the team--and are genuinely 'can do' and happy.

I'm willing to pay more for this as well. Had too many cheap parts from apathetic companies (especially bolts and optics when subject to hard usage) fail over the long term and had to write it off; my time in dealing with them to make things right would exceed the time required to buy something good from someone good. One of lifes' experiences.

And you usually don't have to pay a huge amount more but do need to be selective. Like a check ride you can often get the impression of who you're dealing with in the first 5 minutes or so.

The world saw this with Japanese quality in the 80s and 90s. American workers and car makers stood stagnant and mediocre. Meanwhile Japanese quality in cars went from poor to excellent -- with justifiable pride in their product and contribution to their team-- and they grabbed the market share and boomed.

At least until they naively trusted folks from other places and assumed they'd do things like pay them back or that the swamp land wasn't really swamp land. Or that ethics in folks from other places were the same as theirs.

But their cars still work pretty damn well--at least mine do. And they seem to try to do things on time. And care about it. Even if the pay isn't huge.

So, yes, it is important. And if you ain't moving you're dying.

That is the company behind your Iphone:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foxconn_suicides

Will you now stop buying it?

Will they sell less because the workers in the factory are unhappy?

Of course not.

Same goes for the shirt you are wearing right now, the house you live in, the fish on your plate, the list is endless.

You care who produced it, at what cost or working conditions ?

Don't fool yourself, nobody cares, neither you, nor anybody else.

I am personally mighty grateful that my perspective on life seems to be significantly different than your own.

Must be hell going through life like that. Good luck to 'ya.

Shep69. Couldn't agree more with that assessment.

I think you are living in denial.

Be honest to yourself: how much do you really care about the production of goods?

To buy something with a bad feeling is not enough. Your " perspective on life" is irrelevant as long as you still buy the product. Only when you don't buy it you made a significant choice.

Shep, this is not meant as a personal challenge or attack, in the end I cannot know your individual consumer behaviour, nor can you proof it here, nor is it relevant. Fact is 99.9 % of the people don't really care.This is about the world we live in, not about the world we want it to be.

I have to cringe everytime I hear colleagues arguing morally when it comes to our pay, working conditions. As if anyone of us would want more money or better conditions because that would make the world a better place, or would secure the future of the company. Ridiculous. It is about our own advantage, pure and simple, and ironically there is nothing wrong with that. Why don't you admit it? Put away the emotions, look at the choices we have, and choose the best. Don't get lost in ideologies.

We live in a time where people show "solidarity" by liking or sharing a facebook site, or they buy an organic fair trade coffee once a month. I once saw a WWF bumper sticker on a SUV.

But in the end you still do buy that new Iphone, you still buy clothes at high street shops, you go to Starbucks, you eat meat and fish, etc

When did you ever not buy a product that was important to you because you wasn't sure the production standards meet your ethical requirements? Or because the wage of the worker was too low? How much do you pay your maid? How often do you let her fly home to see her kids?
You never booked a flight with a budget airline? How much do you think earns the women at the till of your supermarket? You ever cared who is losing a job when shopping online? You ever worried about the wage of the driver when ordering an Uber?

In economic terms:

When did you delibaretely pay more than the market price other than for occasional minor purchases ?

When did you really put your money where your mouth is?

I once listened to a colleague complaining about the declining industry standards who then a minute later told me happily he will fly to Boracay on Cebu Pacific!

In the end you are looking for own advantage wherever you can, you guys care about wages or production only when it is your own employer, when it concerns yourself.

Shep, your argument that an "unhappy" workforce is unsustainable is only true if "unhappy" means employees either don't show up or sabotage their work.

Do you still show up for work?
Do you sabotage ?

As long as the result is within limits, the happyness of the worker is irrelevant. If the consumer doesn't care, why should the employer?

Adam Smith and Gordon Gekko thought this is no problem. I don't know what the answer is , but to simply deny your own responsibility and your own involvement isn't for sure.

And to make it very clear, without much hope of getting my message through I admit:

I am NOT on their side, I could not care less for this company, I have no clue if there will a COS 17 , all I know is that we declined a contract for more money because some lawyer did not like the fine print. Which they never do, that is their business model! Some of you declined it because it did not "feel" right, because you wanted to "show them". Like Brexit or Trump, you voted against something without considering the consequences, you let your emotions control your life.

All I want is as much as possible for me. For MY time sitting in this ****ty metal tube and wasting my life.

Stop this silly crusade, and don't lose target.

This is business.

This is a really easy bunch to wind up!