AT. Why the pretense?
 

Dear Anna,

I usually post on the AOA forums, but considering the totalitarian nature of the present regime, I will do so here. Thank you for so quickly stripping away the facade of cooperation and understanding that you originally presented us with. At least now we can deal with you on the basis of your true character (!). No other first world airline would so gratuitously disregard the overwhelming opposition to your dismissal of the RP's. Those RP's were bought and paid for by the efforts and sacrifices of many years of professional dedication and effort. As pilots, we gave up specific things to purchase the RP's. We now expect them to be immediately returned to us. Further, you stand in complete disregard of 50 years of safety developments also bought and paid for with the lives of many of our colleagues throughout modern first world aviation experience. You will be held to account. For now, and speaking solely for myself, you can be assured that I will do all I individually can to resist and foil your misguided, self-centered and misinformed plans. The rest of my colleagues can make their own mind up. I see you for exactly who and what you are. It's not a pleasant sight.

I really hope something beyond foot stomping and yammering is done about this.

Nothing will be done
Too many vested interests on the GC including commuters and Gday workers and basing issues
A GC whom is parlayed by denial , they have no plan whatsoever
Add to that the fact that as whole the pilot body is spineless and self centred ( take the aussie pilot who says we have more to lose than the CC )
Add also to that , we dont have a leg to stand on in the courts
Its all over ladies and gents all over

"Why the pretense?"

... because some of us are dumb enough to believe it. PH comes to mind.

At least AT gets things done….lots of 3 man crews already on the roster, to and from europe!

Though lets me honest, the presence of these 3 man crews has nothing to with a well thought out plan!

Just because you see a 3 man roster (or other changes) doesn't mean anything is getting done. Wonder how many of these will actually be flown with the folks rostered to do so (or at all).

How efficient is a perennially unstable roster ? How efficient are multiple changes today only to create 4 gaps in the roster later in the week ? How efficient are wild swings of flight time into overtime and people being sat because they time out (or PXd home) ? How efficient is seeing (legitimate) unfit days go from 1 or 2 to 35 (that's a month of lost productivity on top of everything else). How efficient are last minute ASR-Fs from body clock swaps ? How efficient is phones that ring unanswered or PX/PTing everyone all over the place ? How efficient is burning FTLs on reserve ? How efficient is positioning someone who lives in Vancouver but LA based on reserve from LA back to Vancouver (and giving them a hotel room and allowances) only to operate out of Vancouver later ?

THESE type of things could have very real productivity gains.

Shep,

the mention of 3 man crew already appearing was meant very tongue in cheek. It is, though, different, now that they don't have to find a 4th crew member for each flight crewed 'legally' with 3.

I think the GC has a very tough job.

The company has pushed and now they have to chose what actions to take.

Mind you they are dealing with a very hostile company when it comes to these things AND, a pilot group who has a reputation to be less than unified because of self serving individuals and company promoted division.

What will YOU do if the option for serious action is presented???

Fume on PPrune?

Yammer nicely about how you are a bit upset???

Or man up and support the union???


We will get exactly what we are willing to accept.

Sorry, Hugh. Sometimes I miss things when I don't sleep......

I think the big problem is the paradigm has shifted from "how can I help the team succeed" to "how can I make this thing work for me" The two CAN go hand in hand but at present are completely opposites with a great deal of hostility.

When 99.5% of your operational subject matter experts tell you your RPs are out to lunch you have a problem.

It's a great management strategy if you like inefficiency and to lose money and assets. They've taken what can be one of the best jobs and best deals on the planet and somehow wound up pizzing everyone off.

The fact that China is bleeding capital (that may have never been there) won't help them. It's hard to buy cars with no money. And it's hard to shuffle around airplanes and missions without liquid assets.

Agreed with everything else you say but let's not get carried away.. Signing on 10 minutes early isn't giving crew control any advantages. Whether you're sitting twiddling your thumb or just having a look at the paper work 10 minutes early doesn't make any difference at all.

Flap 10
 

Maybe, or maybe not.

The point is that we are in CC, so don't start work early!

"warned and risk their benefits and/or membership by non-compliance"

not a lot seems to have happened to the new trainers….or are we using the convenience of 'they applied before the ban' to forget about them?

Have a list too……it'll haunt them in the end!

Report them to the union?
 

Has ANY member been booted from the union for failing to follow CC?

I think not.

Curtain,

From AFTL

Actual Reporting Times

For all duties, the Scheduled Reporting Time or the time at which the crew member actually reports for duty, whichever is the later.

If you want to sound intelligent at least know your AFTL.

The requirement for not signing on early has a lot more to do with being called out of reserve. In that scenario, yes, I use the full 2 hours 15 minutes because the actual reporting time does count.

I am not a minion, I am a free thinking man, go ahead let the GC kick me out because I signed on 10 minutes early for my published flight..I dare them! You'll find the membership numbers dwindling pretty fast. :ugh::ugh::mad::mad:

Dan, please use the term "scab" only for someone who has crossed a picket line. It's not to be used lightly...

Flap (or Flaps, which is it?) maybe you haven't been around long enough, but, as far as I remember, the requirement for not signing in early is because the company does not give us enough time to adequately accomplish our pre-flight duties. Signing in on time and taking the appropriate amount of time to accomplish your pre-flight duties will necessitate a departure delay.

Got it?

Oval,

I've been here long enough thank you very much, maybe too long!! Last time I checked we weren't in MSS. You do know what I mean by that right?

We are in Contract Compliance period. I have not seen any directives from the HKAOA to attempt to delay departures. Even if you sign on at precisely the sign on time, you are still required to complete all your preflight duties on time. We've been signing on at STD-70 in HKG now for several years, long before CC was implemented.

As I said, let's not get carried away. I challenge anyone to give me a valid example of how signing on 10 minutes early on your published flight jeopardizes CC.

Sorry that doesn't cut it as a valid example. you would have to speak to Crew Control via phone in the first place. If the flight dispatcher notifies you of a message, then you tell the dispatcher you'll call them in few minutes. It ain't difficult. Crew Controllers aren't on the dispatch floor hunting you down. If they were, no matter if you were sitting in the lounge area, or standing at the counter it would be of no help.

Believe me I detest management as much as you do and I do more than my share. What I also don't like is super militant individuals acting like goons without any concept of how things work. Anyway enough ranting.

:ugh::ugh: You do realize we get absolutely no credit for that time at flight dispatch right? regardless if you show up on time or early.

The lack of progress is because of buffoons like yourself that think CC is going to be a game changer. You want progress let's strike, I am hardened up and ready, are you?

Sorry, Flap10, but you're wrong.

Follow the CC instructions: they're easily understood.

Yep, more well meaning lists. I have no wish to insult you or your fellow's motives, and I truly hope it's working for you.
Please.
Just relax, do your job. No more.