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Remember the 10 year ARAPA offer?

Fragrant Harbour A forum for the large number of pilots (expats and locals) based with the various airlines in Hong Kong. Air Traffic Controllers are also warmly welcomed into the forum.

Remember the 10 year ARAPA offer?

Old 18th Mar 2020, 05:12
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Hong Kong
Age: 52
Posts: 34
Remember the 10 year ARAPA offer?

Was just wondering if those who ridiculed and insulted me over the last years still think it was a good idea to decline the ARAPA guarantee (after first declining the offered payrise)?
Sam Ting Wong is offline  
Old 20th Mar 2020, 02:39
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Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: HKG 'visitor'
Posts: 287
Thanks STW, well done on forecasting the CoViD-19 outbreak and economic fall-out. Fortunate to have your foresight. Keep it up.
spleener is offline  
Old 20th Mar 2020, 03:33
  #3 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Asia
Posts: 515
It was 9 years but yes, can’t believe we didn’t lock it in.

Nobody predicted a nuclear “SARS Mach2” but it was time for a recession.

STW, how is retirement down in Cape Town?
AQIS Boigu is offline  
Old 20th Mar 2020, 05:16
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Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Vermont
Posts: 38
I just wonder if you think it was a good idea to turn down the offer for 25 years housing in return for SLS in 2008.
Oh wait....WE DIDN’T and they broke their promise....
Who could have predicted that???
I’m sure that was a one off and they would have honoured their commitment in your example...oh wait....
Moron!
Piet Lood is online now  
Old 20th Mar 2020, 13:23
  #5 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: planet ****witt
Age: 34
Posts: 38
Good to see that STW only cared about his self interests. Makes sense why the AOA is a complete failure with reps who are out of touch. Maybe next time focus on getting a deal that not only helps you but is fair to all groups. Remember when you were the majority and you said you know what you signed. Call it Karma.
reazasassain is online now  
Old 20th Mar 2020, 20:56
  #6 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: CLK
Posts: 308
Yes STW, I still think it was a good idea. The whole package was a bad deal.
Farman Biplane is offline  
Old 26th Mar 2020, 01:22
  #7 (permalink)  
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Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Hong Kong
Age: 52
Posts: 34
The airline industry is cyclical, always was, always will be. Next time it is a war, an oil crisis, you name it.

Nevertheless, when the sun shines almost nobody wants to accept that.

We would have millions more in the bank ( as a result of 5% more pay) plus an ARAPA guarantee.

I was right all the way.
Sam Ting Wong is offline  
Old 26th Mar 2020, 04:46
  #8 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Vermont
Posts: 38
Nope you weren’t.
you conveniently keep forgetting about clause 8.
They could have reneged on the ARAPA deal the very next day (or during a crisis) and there would have been NOTHING you could have done about it.
Repeating “I was right, I was right”, doesn’t make it so.
We will never know, will we, because the majority has spoken.
Fact is, if the company wouldn’t have lied, cheated and stolen as much as she has, she would have had a bigger chance of survival, as more people would have been willing to help out during this crisis and beyond.
Guess more people were not needed nor wanted, so they will reap what they have sown.
Piet Lood is online now  
Old 26th Mar 2020, 04:59
  #9 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Cesspit
Posts: 296
Originally Posted by Sam Ting Wong View Post
The airline industry is cyclical, always was, always will be. Next time it is a war, an oil crisis, you name it.

Nevertheless, when the sun shines almost nobody wants to accept that.

We would have millions more in the bank ( as a result of 5% more pay) plus an ARAPA guarantee.

I was right all the way.
You can’t possibly be right when you’re confused.

The 5% pay rise was offered with the 2016 proposal but came with a 3 year roll over of ARAPA so it would have expired in 2019.
The 9 year ARAPA offer came in 2018 but with a 1% pay rise.

I’m not saying that the pilot body erred in not taking the offers and you’re absolutely right that in aviation we only get limited windows of opportunity to apply some negotiating leverage. But that doesn’t mean we should cherry pick parts of offers and attach them to parts of other offers to make a prettier picture.
Progress Wanchai is offline  
Old 26th Mar 2020, 05:27
  #10 (permalink)  
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Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Hong Kong
Age: 52
Posts: 34
You are correct. It would be either the 5% or the ARAPA 10 years.

Still better compared to what we have today though.

Last edited by Sam Ting Wong; 26th Mar 2020 at 12:23.
Sam Ting Wong is offline  

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