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Well that was a big waste of time

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Well that was a big waste of time

Old 13th Nov 2017, 10:14
  #1 (permalink)  
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 170
Well that was a big waste of time

Negotiations over company wont reward us at a later date if we give concessions now.....i.e. we werent doing 1999/2000 again when we gave and the company made record profits which we saw none of.

Pack those bags guy this show is ******* over
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Old 13th Nov 2017, 10:24
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Join Date: Jan 2008
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I'm shocked at your surprise
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Old 13th Nov 2017, 10:28
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Join Date: Feb 2017
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Hopefully the chairman gets his management position he is trying so hard for.
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Old 13th Nov 2017, 11:15
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Join Date: Mar 2000
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Originally Posted by Brokeidiot View Post
Hopefully the chairman gets his management position he is trying so hard for.
I don't think that's the case, show some appreciation for the hard work done here.
You didn't have to lift a finger did you?
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Old 13th Nov 2017, 11:16
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Join Date: May 2007
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Unlikely, he may get a gig at RAI/Glazner....
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Old 13th Nov 2017, 11:40
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Join Date: Feb 2017
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Originally Posted by Oasis View Post
I don't think that's the case, show some appreciation for the hard work done here.
You didn't have to lift a finger did you?
You obviously didnít read the email did you! Hard work at trying to give the company concessions... sure yeah I am over joyed with gratitude!

Where was the mandate from membership to seek concessions I must of missed that survey.
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Old 13th Nov 2017, 11:56
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Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: hong kong
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So
It could be a very interesting xmas
Good luck punters traveling CX.
A company completely unwilling to give any concessions what so ever in the return to profits AND unwilling to provide any evidence to as to wtf the plan is to improve yield .
Mmmm , hillarious . Full Mexican stand off in progress.
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Old 13th Nov 2017, 12:04
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Join Date: May 2010
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Brokeidiot:

Must HAVE. Must HAVE.
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Old 13th Nov 2017, 12:49
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Hong Kong
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as I've said before, this is reminding me more and more of the days when MG was president. An AOA completely working for the benefit of the company, not the members.

Nevertheless, as a responsible employee group, we are prepared to provide immediate financial assistance to Cathay Pacific to assist our management in navigating the current situation
I mean really, WTF? Where have you been the past two decades Daryl?

Last edited by Dragon69; 13th Nov 2017 at 12:59.
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Old 13th Nov 2017, 21:52
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Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Polar Route
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The irony in all of this is that the “sign or be fired” contract will very likely blow up in CX’s face. HKAOA’s CC and TB will continue. Attrition of trainers and other experienced pilots will accelerate and growth plans will be stymied. All that will be left are already cheap C scalers with low or no experience and other losers who can’t find work elsewhere. CX will be on the fast track to a hull loss and the only way to retain (or obtain) experience will be through bases or expensive DEC contracts. Another own goal from CX directors. Well played Swires!
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Old 13th Nov 2017, 23:33
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Join Date: Apr 2007
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Of course the company rebuffed the offer. You can't just give them everything they want as a first offer. You have to haggle.
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Old 13th Nov 2017, 23:45
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no wasnt surprised but had a sliver of hope that maybe they would negotiate in some sort of faith considering the doom they seemed to selling. Doom is still on the books due their mismanagement.....

But naw cant make a tiger changes it stripes.....as for the package atm we aint far off to the baseline of saying "why stay here?".....they want us gone and get the stupid 300 hour club their commands because they would fly for free to fly a big shiny jet. You run into them all the time and how they actually take it that they arent worth more.
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Old 14th Nov 2017, 01:06
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Join Date: Nov 2015
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They will continue with the demise of our terms and conditions
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Old 14th Nov 2017, 01:12
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: uk
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The Association should take immediate steps to ensure that the current (company induced) situation is made very public and very clearly both internally and externally, before the management Pravda gets in first with their pet local newspapers and IntraCX etc.

(Company PR machine is always well ahead of the employees' )
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Old 14th Nov 2017, 01:31
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Join Date: Nov 2015
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Originally Posted by Flex88 View Post
They will continue with the demise of our terms and conditions
What's even more Sad is they want, for financial reasons (i.e. their profit), the demise of what, at one time, was a honoured and highly respected "Profession" and "they" with the knowing assistance of some of our finest 3rd floor " Leadership" over the past 25 years have more or less succeeded..

They see you/us as nothing more than overpaid whining Uber drivers.
Soon, when you get to your destination, the "app" that you use for that trip will make a deposit in your bank account. No Tip, no pension, no housing and "State" proffered health care only...

That my colleagues, is EXACTLY what they want and have been pushing for.

Bugle player - please play Taps..
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Old 14th Nov 2017, 02:54
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Join Date: Nov 2015
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Chip, chip, chip, chip

(HPE - a way to spend money and achieve absolutely nothing except bragging rights for CX to say "we tried sooooo hard)

Chip, chip, chip, chip....
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Old 14th Nov 2017, 12:52
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: All Over
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The first rule of talking a crazy man off the ledge is don't let him take you with him.

Guess you could say the same for a miscreant.

Have a look around. Pilot shortage (real--maybe for the first time in a career), booming industry.

Anyone who would be even contemplating the C word or tossing it around is de-facto nuts.

When one is told things that are true and not so true from time to time, one cannot rely on the credibility of the source. Some folks are masters at blurring the distinction between wholly true and not so true. Lies, damned lies, and statistics and so forth.

Bottom line here is no one should be giving an inch and IMHO those advocating giving yards away are likely those dwelling in not so true land and in not looking out for ya land. I'd be really careful buying into ANY of this. Given the experience level of most people here, OTHER airlines have no problems running their operation profitably with better pay and conditions for their pilots. So if WE have problems doing the same it's either a false premise to begin with or mismanagement of assets.

Neither of which we are responsible for and neither of which we can fix.

And neither of which do we 'own' at this point. So our part in the equation is still the same--be paid at a level commensurate with what we are doing and have decent working conditions.

And most majors pay better. With REAL work rules. That can't be changed on a whim.

Look in the mirror and ask yourself the question if it's right to fritter away what you still have left toward an entity that's just going to ask for more and more, while continuing to behave as it has unabated. Toward which you can have no influence whatsoever in driving decisions of huge magnitude. And who may not be telling you the truth. How will you look at yourself in 10 years if you roll over and buy into this nonsense ?

CX bases in some of the most expensive cities in the world. There is a HUGE difference in the cost of living in HKG compared to that of Des Moines. Or even in the cost of living between San Francisco and Columbus, Ohio. IF it wants to base pilots in expensive places it needs to pay at a rate commensurate with where it is--same as if you'd buy a house there. How many realtors sell houses at a huge loss in San Francisco simply because their prospective buyers whine that houses are really expensive there ? If you can't pay the market price for where you want to be, it's likely that the helpful realtors will suggest you live somewhere else that is more within your price range. Pilots MAY be able to do the airline a favor by commuting, but this still has cost and scheduling constraints associated with it. Basing options to reduce costs have been on the table for years and years; largely shunned and used simply for a fleeting carrot and to keep a presence in a country.

So the solutions have been well presented and ignored. It is not the role of a pilot body to attempt to make up for this shortfall if it indeed really exists.

And one can be an enabler of bad behavior if one always gives his brother in law a 'loan' and makes up his shortfalls. It shouldn't surprise him that his BIL has been unemployed for 10 years and isn't looking real hard--and continues to lose at the track.

Last edited by Shep69; 14th Nov 2017 at 14:09.
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Old 14th Nov 2017, 13:41
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What's comical is how the chairman in one update states that no airline has cost cut themselves into profitability, and then in the very next update offers concessions. What am I missing?
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Old 14th Nov 2017, 14:35
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Join Date: Feb 2017
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Ask Oasis seems he good friends with the man in question or actually the man himself.
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Old 14th Nov 2017, 14:47
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Originally Posted by Dragon69 View Post
What's comical is how the chairman in one update states that no airline has cost cut themselves into profitability, and then in the very next update offers concessions. What am I missing?
The facts.
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