What to choose?
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What to choose?
Hello,
I am considering to apply with the following companies:
Air macau
Hong kong Express
Air hong kong ( cargo)
My story: european guy flying small biz jet without any outlook in europe. Ik would like to upgrade my CV but if i believe other forum members, these 3 carriers are to avoid. However i am not in the position to be picky.
My feeling would be Air hong kong to be the least "worst".
I would like to hear your opinions. If you have flown with one of those 3, lets hear your voice and experience.
Thanks in advance.
I am considering to apply with the following companies:
Air macau
Hong kong Express
Air hong kong ( cargo)
My story: european guy flying small biz jet without any outlook in europe. Ik would like to upgrade my CV but if i believe other forum members, these 3 carriers are to avoid. However i am not in the position to be picky.
My feeling would be Air hong kong to be the least "worst".
I would like to hear your opinions. If you have flown with one of those 3, lets hear your voice and experience.
Thanks in advance.
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A saying comes to mind: "It's better to be on the ground wishing you were in the air, instead of being in the air wishing you were on the ground". To put that in perspective: "It's better to be in Europe wishing you were in HK, instead of being in HK wishing you were in Europe". Basically, ALL the HK carriers are crap, including CX. Stay where you are and keep looking for an airline job at home. Ultimately you and any family you have will be far happier.
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Tx for the reply.
For some part i agree with you. HK is not the place to be for me, just because,of the pollution. But then again, i can not be picky. I will probably face unemployment this year and finding something else with my qualifications on small biz jet is almost zero.
For the good order, i am single but having a mortgage of around 700 eur a month( something to keep in my mind). I noticed that Air hong kong has a base in Penang, Malaysia, so lifestyle would not be that expensive overthere.
In europe there are virtually no options for me. I applied with many operators but no interest of all, if i even get a answer! That's why i think i have to look further and trying to get a decent typerating otherwise future is not looking too bright for me.
For some part i agree with you. HK is not the place to be for me, just because,of the pollution. But then again, i can not be picky. I will probably face unemployment this year and finding something else with my qualifications on small biz jet is almost zero.
For the good order, i am single but having a mortgage of around 700 eur a month( something to keep in my mind). I noticed that Air hong kong has a base in Penang, Malaysia, so lifestyle would not be that expensive overthere.
In europe there are virtually no options for me. I applied with many operators but no interest of all, if i even get a answer! That's why i think i have to look further and trying to get a decent typerating otherwise future is not looking too bright for me.
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...If you don't meet the requirements for a biz jet, how can you meet the requirements for an airliner...? Of course, this is HK, where baby pilots are fertilized. No disrespect meant, but you are part of the problem, not the solution, to our profession. I wish you all the best, but anything you succeed in doing here in HK will result in yet another drop in the value of the profession, and yet another hurdle for the rest of us to overcome to preserve and protect our conditions and value. Fact.
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Sorry mngmt mole but that is an absolute disgraceful thing to say. Why should someone who is looking for the next step up in their career fight your battle? Why should someone who admits they will probably be out of a job this year not take a job because it undermines your earnings?
If your so into fighting this fight why not quit your well paying job with all your valuable experience, let them know you are doing it because you don't agree with the lower conditions new pilots are joining under.
If your so into fighting this fight why not quit your well paying job with all your valuable experience, let them know you are doing it because you don't agree with the lower conditions new pilots are joining under.
No disrespect meant, but you are part of the problem, not the solution, to our profession.
It's people like you that are responsible for the ever decreasing conditions of service...
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Ummm, I didn't say he had 'to fight my fight for me'. I was just pointing out the fact that the low time, inexperienced pilots who will work for almost any conditions are the reason this profession is in such dire straights. If you can't understand that, then you too are part of the problem. Pretending otherwise doesn't change the facts. Your indignation is noted.
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Really, mgmt mole? How about Republic Airlines in the USA filing for bankruptcy after not being able to attract/retain enough pilots on its measly salary?
Republic Airways Files for Bankruptcy After Pilot Shortage - Bloomberg Business
After all, despite the despicable way most airlines in Hong Kong are managed, the money IS generally better, for new hires, than elsewhere...
You must have been one of those guys who were all into that "recruitment ban" crap where you took upgrades to fill the positions of fired Cathay pilots rather than STRIKING but pointed the finger at new hires who joined to fill YOUR spot!
Republic Airways Files for Bankruptcy After Pilot Shortage - Bloomberg Business
After all, despite the despicable way most airlines in Hong Kong are managed, the money IS generally better, for new hires, than elsewhere...
You must have been one of those guys who were all into that "recruitment ban" crap where you took upgrades to fill the positions of fired Cathay pilots rather than STRIKING but pointed the finger at new hires who joined to fill YOUR spot!
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Oval...sure, the money is 'better' in HK...until you factor in the local cost of living. Then you realize that even earning 'double' what you earned back home makes you even worse of here. You still aren't addressing the fact that I raise: low time pilots willing to work for almost nothing are destroying the value of the profession.
Mr. Mole, did you join CX on B Scale? If you did, you were among the first to put pressure on my A Scale, and you commenced the 'undermining of the profession' in Hong Kong.
If you were A Scale, please ignore my comment as far as being applicable to your own case is concerned.
If you were A Scale, please ignore my comment as far as being applicable to your own case is concerned.
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No, A scale. I wouldn't sell myself short. Next question (and try not to make assumptions without the facts next time. And no, I won't ignore your comment, because it was designed to undermine the main point I was making, which you ignored).
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Dart, interesting that you would prefer to try and undermine my credibility, instead of supporting the fact that I raised. I guess we deserve the misery we are now dealing with, as no one seems to want to acknowledge the obvious.
No one's undermining your credibility. It was just 'due diligence'. Undermining of conditions in Hong Kong has been going on since the first B Scaler joined Cathay Pacific. Many of them have put their hands up for training, checking, and 'management'.
The parade of wannabes joining on lesser conditions has been going on for decades, and it is my belief that 'fly for free' or even 'pay to fly' is not beyond the realm of possibility until jets get parked for lack of pilots to fly them. Then, the market will have decided.
In the meantime, poor dboy is just one of thousands.
The parade of wannabes joining on lesser conditions has been going on for decades, and it is my belief that 'fly for free' or even 'pay to fly' is not beyond the realm of possibility until jets get parked for lack of pilots to fly them. Then, the market will have decided.
In the meantime, poor dboy is just one of thousands.
Last edited by Captain Dart; 12th Mar 2016 at 20:52.
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You are correct. It's like a wavering arrow, that will only end in one place: front page news, misery for hundreds of families and a business who's reputation is irrevocably shredded. Our esteemed management will then have real blood on their hands. Ivan can then parade his 'deer in the headlight' look yet again on Bloomberg, perhaps trying to convince viewers that such a tragedy is as good for business as our fuel hedging strategy.
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The root cause of declining conditions is the seniority system.
Unfortunately it'll never change. It makes senior crew stay put under non inflationary matching conditions and forces new hires to accept whatever is available to get on the seniority system and the cycle continues and will continue to.
Unless by some miracle seniority is deemed illegal and allows crews to be free agents jumping ship at a whim. (lifestyle / location / shiny jet / shiny 4 bars / $$$).
Imagine the cost having pilots leaving every few years the training machine would be out of control and the only thing stopping a pilot from leaving would be improving conditions (and even that wouldn't stop some deciding HK sucks and leaving) I'm afraid ticket prices would go up as crew costs would skyrocket.
I'm suprised airlines aren't more aggressive in reducing conditions however perhaps they realise the golden seniority goose can run for decades if they don't break it.
Unfortunately it'll never change. It makes senior crew stay put under non inflationary matching conditions and forces new hires to accept whatever is available to get on the seniority system and the cycle continues and will continue to.
Unless by some miracle seniority is deemed illegal and allows crews to be free agents jumping ship at a whim. (lifestyle / location / shiny jet / shiny 4 bars / $$$).
Imagine the cost having pilots leaving every few years the training machine would be out of control and the only thing stopping a pilot from leaving would be improving conditions (and even that wouldn't stop some deciding HK sucks and leaving) I'm afraid ticket prices would go up as crew costs would skyrocket.
I'm suprised airlines aren't more aggressive in reducing conditions however perhaps they realise the golden seniority goose can run for decades if they don't break it.
Last edited by CCA; 13th Mar 2016 at 04:17.
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Dboy
Did you consider any of the Middle East carriers? They've got more aircraft on order than most airlines already have in their total fleets. Surely you will at least be considered by one of them....
Did you consider any of the Middle East carriers? They've got more aircraft on order than most airlines already have in their total fleets. Surely you will at least be considered by one of them....
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@broadband, tx for your input.
I am not eligable to apply with them. I am still stuck with that damned frozen atpl thing. Never got the chance to unfreeze it although i got the hours. My current employer never wanted to pay for it. And i need to do it in the States because of the sim.
Thats why these above mentioned air carriers are accepting frozen atpl's and i wanted to know which is the least "worst". I see here that some people have a problem with that. I dont want to start a debate about terms and conditions cause i am also not in the position to do that. Like i said, i can not afford to be picky.
My guess was the air hong kong was the best option since they have a base in Penang from what i've read. Bond is about 3 years. But then again they operate the "old" A300, which is almost not flying anymore in the EU.
Hong kong Express, well they operate the A320 which is more job secure in the EU. No idea about the bond.
Air Macau, well, 50.000 usd bond and contract for 5 years and reduced salary......
I was hoping to get in touch with people wo have experience with one of those 3.
My experience: 4000tt, 3600h on small biz jet.
Tx
I am not eligable to apply with them. I am still stuck with that damned frozen atpl thing. Never got the chance to unfreeze it although i got the hours. My current employer never wanted to pay for it. And i need to do it in the States because of the sim.
Thats why these above mentioned air carriers are accepting frozen atpl's and i wanted to know which is the least "worst". I see here that some people have a problem with that. I dont want to start a debate about terms and conditions cause i am also not in the position to do that. Like i said, i can not afford to be picky.
My guess was the air hong kong was the best option since they have a base in Penang from what i've read. Bond is about 3 years. But then again they operate the "old" A300, which is almost not flying anymore in the EU.
Hong kong Express, well they operate the A320 which is more job secure in the EU. No idea about the bond.
Air Macau, well, 50.000 usd bond and contract for 5 years and reduced salary......
I was hoping to get in touch with people wo have experience with one of those 3.
My experience: 4000tt, 3600h on small biz jet.
Tx