Momentum is building for industrial action
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Momentum is building for industrial action
Looks like the boys and gals of the CX pilot ranks have just about had enough!!!
I think CX management were betting on divide and conquer with the onshoring, it will fail! Years and years of abuse, lies, terminations and lawsuits. How much more? It is needed!!!
CX pilot's can set the stage not only for ourselves but for others as well!!! Someone needs to break through the gates, "We could build a large wooden badger". I do not know if anyone has been reading about what is going on at JAL to the JAL pilot's but it is typical to try and break the will of a group. CX pilot's need to do this in a big way, full press releases etc...
I think CX management were betting on divide and conquer with the onshoring, it will fail! Years and years of abuse, lies, terminations and lawsuits. How much more? It is needed!!! CX pilot's can set the stage not only for ourselves but for others as well!!! Someone needs to break through the gates, "We could build a large wooden badger". I do not know if anyone has been reading about what is going on at JAL to the JAL pilot's but it is typical to try and break the will of a group. CX pilot's need to do this in a big way, full press releases etc...
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HKAOA Update - 12 October
Regardless of what Saturn may or may not be smoking...
The AOA has published yet another compelling argument behind our Pay Claim 2010. Negative comments such as the above serve no productive purpose other than to further convince management that it can continue to drag its feet and disrespect its pilot group. Why would they respect us? Many pilots do not even respect themselves. Just look at so many of your posts...
Self-respecting pilots join the association or its respective TUs. They pay dues and await word from elected leadership with regard to collective action. They express their opinions on union forums rather than in public. Self-respecting pilots respect each other by being part of something greater than themselves. In doing so, they create synergy by which much more is possible than through individual actions alone.
To those of you who do not understand this and participate accordingly, I can only feel sorry for you and all your fellow pilots whom you harm each day. You are worse than selfish; you are stupid and obtuse. Management relies upon your naiveté to achieve their self-serving goals of "cost management" which translates primarily into executive bonuses more than any real cost savings for the company.
To those of you outside the AOA, you really are missing the boat. You hurt all CX pilots and, by default, yourselves with your non-membership. The AOA EXCO and its respective TUs are doing a splendid job on a multi-faceted task with limited resources. If you joined and participated, you would see this. Be part of the solution, not part of the problem!
The AOA has published yet another compelling argument behind our Pay Claim 2010. Negative comments such as the above serve no productive purpose other than to further convince management that it can continue to drag its feet and disrespect its pilot group. Why would they respect us? Many pilots do not even respect themselves. Just look at so many of your posts...
Self-respecting pilots join the association or its respective TUs. They pay dues and await word from elected leadership with regard to collective action. They express their opinions on union forums rather than in public. Self-respecting pilots respect each other by being part of something greater than themselves. In doing so, they create synergy by which much more is possible than through individual actions alone.
To those of you who do not understand this and participate accordingly, I can only feel sorry for you and all your fellow pilots whom you harm each day. You are worse than selfish; you are stupid and obtuse. Management relies upon your naiveté to achieve their self-serving goals of "cost management" which translates primarily into executive bonuses more than any real cost savings for the company.
To those of you outside the AOA, you really are missing the boat. You hurt all CX pilots and, by default, yourselves with your non-membership. The AOA EXCO and its respective TUs are doing a splendid job on a multi-faceted task with limited resources. If you joined and participated, you would see this. Be part of the solution, not part of the problem!
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With the company's desire to divide and conquer, how long will it be before a 'union only' proposal is made? The AOA has been adamant that they would not entertain individual arrangements but with onshoring, the Company must deal with each TU seperately. It's not a big stretch to see the day when then Company has a N.A. deal, Oz deal, HK deal, ....member/non-member deal. With the mud slinging by some of the non-members, the cracks that might show up will not be between A-scale/ B-scale or DEFO/SO/CEP.
Last edited by bm330; 12th Oct 2010 at 22:56. Reason: sp
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CX would be lucky to keep any pilots. Most would go to other airlines; which was not an easy option during the 49er dispute. The benefit of this is that pilot cost would go down because they wouldn't have any!
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Most would go to other airlines
CX is, by most any measure, still a quite good job, and I expect few would be willing to cash in their chips over some hothead's industrial action ideas.
IE: talk is cheap, actual action a bit more difficult.
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Obtuse pilots
Has the AOA actually done anything to recruit pilots to the union? Being proactive in recruiting new members ( and others that resigned for whatever reason) might be helpful to the cause, sending a message to the company! You talk about dysfunction in the group, well your comments don't help either. if you stop bagging/ intimidating non members and invite them in then you may get a positive result.
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The union has been actively recruiting for at least 2 solid years now, all you need to do is open your ears! But you knew that already, didn't you? You are just a message board dissenter. You help no one, not even your own colleagues, or yourself.
box
box
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Boxjockey
I am a member- so be careful what you say. And I reiterate to members like you that isolating and bagging does not help- try and be more inviting to these people and you might be surprised. You sound so bitter.
Routetuner, As a member you must know how much stress and effort has been put on recruiting non-members. I am surprised by your post
"Has the AOA actually done anything to recruit pilots to the union?"
I am also surprised by the excuses given by some non-members, particularly ones with family joining as cadets who don't want to support the AOA getting a decent deal for them
"Has the AOA actually done anything to recruit pilots to the union?"
I am also surprised by the excuses given by some non-members, particularly ones with family joining as cadets who don't want to support the AOA getting a decent deal for them
Jeeze Louise Routetuner, what more does the AOA have to do to convince non-members that it is in their, and everybody's, interest to be part of the AOA? Offer a free plastic Snoopy to every new member?
I've said it once, and I'll say it again: the 'soft soap' approach to non-members has gone on long enough. It's time for:
'no membership no jump seat'
no sharing of AOA updates and newsletters
and a more aggressive approach by members toward these freeloaders
.
I've said it once, and I'll say it again: the 'soft soap' approach to non-members has gone on long enough. It's time for:
'no membership no jump seat'
no sharing of AOA updates and newsletters
and a more aggressive approach by members toward these freeloaders
.
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Non-member punishment
... don't forget no sectors for non-member FOs unless their landing recency is about to expire. And no, I don't care if it is an out and back.
Why make this job any more enjoyable for them than absolutely necessary?
Current membership list can found on the www.hkaoa.org > login to get to home page > useful info > membership list.
Why make this job any more enjoyable for them than absolutely necessary?
Current membership list can found on the www.hkaoa.org > login to get to home page > useful info > membership list.
Last edited by cxorcist; 13th Oct 2010 at 23:50. Reason: addition
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Routetuner'
If you are a member, then I simply don't understand your comments or your attitude. You know clearly that the company restricts access to new joiners, so the union has targeted those that are already here. They have pushed those of us who are members to take it upon ourselves to get everyone together. Have you done this recently? I have. Anyone I fly with, who is not a member, I try to talk to and encourage them to join us. Could the union do a better job of recruiting the other 25%. Probably, but I also believe that we have to do part of the work ourselves. An inactive and complacent union is no union at all. Everyone needs to do their part!!
box
If you are a member, then I simply don't understand your comments or your attitude. You know clearly that the company restricts access to new joiners, so the union has targeted those that are already here. They have pushed those of us who are members to take it upon ourselves to get everyone together. Have you done this recently? I have. Anyone I fly with, who is not a member, I try to talk to and encourage them to join us. Could the union do a better job of recruiting the other 25%. Probably, but I also believe that we have to do part of the work ourselves. An inactive and complacent union is no union at all. Everyone needs to do their part!!
box
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Looks like the big bad poodles are out again! Given the track record who are you guys trying to kid??? One NTC from RH warning people about what you are suggesting and you'll be strangling yourselves in panic trying to remove your AoA lanyard.
Are you that gullible to think that whether you have 75% membership or 90% that somehow the union is going to be that much stronger. Talk is cheap, and you can't bring a knife to a gun fight. Before you guys mouth off you best be ready to put your job on the line, but how many of you are ready to do that with big fat mortgages??? Momentum my a##, it's just a bad sequel to an old movie!!!!
Are you that gullible to think that whether you have 75% membership or 90% that somehow the union is going to be that much stronger. Talk is cheap, and you can't bring a knife to a gun fight. Before you guys mouth off you best be ready to put your job on the line, but how many of you are ready to do that with big fat mortgages??? Momentum my a##, it's just a bad sequel to an old movie!!!!
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Humber10
There are plenty of non-member FOs out there... Just check on the HKAOA website. These pilots are the most troubling because they won't be leaving within 10 years. They continue the non-membership legacy that many of our illustrious captains have started.
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Flaps10
Does that extra 1% you are saving by not paying union dues feel good?
Whatever it takes to justify your non-membership / non-participation... Right?
Don't worry mate... RH is looking out for you. You don't need a union.
Whatever it takes to justify your non-membership / non-participation... Right?
Don't worry mate... RH is looking out for you. You don't need a union.