2009 Leave
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 202
Likes: 0
From: I go, therefore I am there!
2009 Leave
What am I missing?
I am correct in thinking that I can only bid for which month I want my leave to fall, rather than specific weeks? If so, then even with a first priority, it is a lottery as to which weeks I will get within a month, and may not even be what I want.
Has it always been this way?
I am correct in thinking that I can only bid for which month I want my leave to fall, rather than specific weeks? If so, then even with a first priority, it is a lottery as to which weeks I will get within a month, and may not even be what I want.
Has it always been this way?
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 651
Likes: 0
From: Hong Kong
CX Leave
The following will be telling most how to 'suck eggs' - but just for those who dont understand.
Once you put in a preference for your leave - you can see that their will be slots available, slots requested and slot balance. Now lets say there are 10 slots available, 12 slots bid for and -2 slots balance. In order to see if you will get that bid you will need to select "leave slot availability' then the 'view' option on far right to see where your 'points' fit in versus all the other bidders. If you are in the last two, on the previous example, you are wasting your first bid as "computer says NO" to bids in excess of slots.
All first bids are attempted to be met before any 2nd bids. So if you have requested a 2nd bid for a week, if looking at first requests you can see more people have bid for that week than their are slots available, you will not get your 2nd bid. Doesn't matter if you have +100 points and it is your 2nd bid and the 1st bidder has -100points - first bids are allocated first.
Last point -slots available are maximum...so when you select req 2 or 3 or 4 you will see that the same number of weeks are available. But in actual fact the slot balance indicated in req2/3/4 are not relevant. Lets say there are 10 slots avail - you would need to add up all 1st requests, say 6, add up all 2nd requests, say 3, then if your request was 3rd there is actually only 1 slot available - so if there were 3 of you requesting it 3rd, only one will get it - the one with the most points. Another shortfall of the system is that it only looks at the points of the bidders before any bids have succeeded. So if your first and second bids were successful and all -6 point weeks, then the actual points you will be bidding for your 3rd bid will be lower than is indicated.
Clear as mud?
PS Request by midnight tonight!
Once you put in a preference for your leave - you can see that their will be slots available, slots requested and slot balance. Now lets say there are 10 slots available, 12 slots bid for and -2 slots balance. In order to see if you will get that bid you will need to select "leave slot availability' then the 'view' option on far right to see where your 'points' fit in versus all the other bidders. If you are in the last two, on the previous example, you are wasting your first bid as "computer says NO" to bids in excess of slots.
All first bids are attempted to be met before any 2nd bids. So if you have requested a 2nd bid for a week, if looking at first requests you can see more people have bid for that week than their are slots available, you will not get your 2nd bid. Doesn't matter if you have +100 points and it is your 2nd bid and the 1st bidder has -100points - first bids are allocated first.
Last point -slots available are maximum...so when you select req 2 or 3 or 4 you will see that the same number of weeks are available. But in actual fact the slot balance indicated in req2/3/4 are not relevant. Lets say there are 10 slots avail - you would need to add up all 1st requests, say 6, add up all 2nd requests, say 3, then if your request was 3rd there is actually only 1 slot available - so if there were 3 of you requesting it 3rd, only one will get it - the one with the most points. Another shortfall of the system is that it only looks at the points of the bidders before any bids have succeeded. So if your first and second bids were successful and all -6 point weeks, then the actual points you will be bidding for your 3rd bid will be lower than is indicated.
Clear as mud?
PS Request by midnight tonight!
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 202
Likes: 0
From: I go, therefore I am there!
Thanks NC
Many sincere thanks NC
Gee ... the stuff you learn. I had my packet of eggs ready to suck on, but it wasn't required.
If your mailbox at work isn't locked I will slip a bottle of vino in there.
At the risk of further embarassing myself, ... what is the point of the Leave Allocation Preference page?
Cheers
ARSE
Gee ... the stuff you learn. I had my packet of eggs ready to suck on, but it wasn't required.
If your mailbox at work isn't locked I will slip a bottle of vino in there.
At the risk of further embarassing myself, ... what is the point of the Leave Allocation Preference page?
Cheers
ARSE
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 352
Likes: 0
From: UK
If they can't give you the leave you want, then filling out the leave allocation page indicates your preference should they have to allocate you some leave. However, it doesn't matter how clever you are with the system, if they want to allocate you, say, a week in Jan then they will still do it such that it's too close for you to be able to swap it back into the pool at a later date.....talk of train-sets ensues should you take the issue up.
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 651
Likes: 0
From: Hong Kong
leave allocation preference
Too late for the annual bid, but useful info for Pool Leave requests...
I put my first allocation preference as far in the future as possible, in this case, Mar 10. Then 2nd in Feb 10, 3rd Jan 10, 4th Dec09 etc etc. My reasoning for this is if I am allocated leave it will hopefully be far enough in the future so that I will have a chance to get the leave I actually wanted sometime later. Slots change quite frequently. They change as people release weeks they were allocated, or they have subsequently decided they don't want, they change as people do courses and have training/embargo periods. They change as the commercial operation dictates. The main reason we are moving to a Apr-Mar bid system for 2010/11 is to better align with the commercial plan.
I don't know why the numbers change so dramatically from month to month and week to week. It might make sense on the 777 with the crew intensive ERs arriving - but on the Seniors fleet I have seen some massive fluctuations in slot availability over 2 week period - 4 slots up to 12???
One last point about Leave Allocation Preference. If you don't want all your leave allocated in one block, put the max allocation as 1, 2 or 3 weeks. If you had it set at 2 weeks, and lets say you already had 2 weeks awarded/allocated in Mar2010, then next pool period, if you had Mar10 as your 1st allocation preference, it will not allocate any leave in that month as that would give you 3 or 4 weeks when you have stated 2 weeks as your limit. So any excess leave would then attempt to be allocated in your 2nd preference month and so on.
By the way, no leave system works properly when there isn't enough leave available due undermanning!
Anyway, once pool leave comes out PM or post any questions,
cheers
NC
I put my first allocation preference as far in the future as possible, in this case, Mar 10. Then 2nd in Feb 10, 3rd Jan 10, 4th Dec09 etc etc. My reasoning for this is if I am allocated leave it will hopefully be far enough in the future so that I will have a chance to get the leave I actually wanted sometime later. Slots change quite frequently. They change as people release weeks they were allocated, or they have subsequently decided they don't want, they change as people do courses and have training/embargo periods. They change as the commercial operation dictates. The main reason we are moving to a Apr-Mar bid system for 2010/11 is to better align with the commercial plan.
I don't know why the numbers change so dramatically from month to month and week to week. It might make sense on the 777 with the crew intensive ERs arriving - but on the Seniors fleet I have seen some massive fluctuations in slot availability over 2 week period - 4 slots up to 12???
One last point about Leave Allocation Preference. If you don't want all your leave allocated in one block, put the max allocation as 1, 2 or 3 weeks. If you had it set at 2 weeks, and lets say you already had 2 weeks awarded/allocated in Mar2010, then next pool period, if you had Mar10 as your 1st allocation preference, it will not allocate any leave in that month as that would give you 3 or 4 weeks when you have stated 2 weeks as your limit. So any excess leave would then attempt to be allocated in your 2nd preference month and so on.
By the way, no leave system works properly when there isn't enough leave available due undermanning!
Anyway, once pool leave comes out PM or post any questions,
cheers
NC
