Air China Set To Buy HK Cathay Pacific Airlines - Report and Dragonair to buy Cathay,
Hi all,
Beijing will not lose, whatever the outcome of this rumour, that surely is a certainty.
Cheers Oz2
Beijing will not lose, whatever the outcome of this rumour, that surely is a certainty.
Cheers Oz2
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Australia 2 is right, Beijing won't loose out on this one but I don't think Cathay will either.
Here's a few scenarios:
1. Nothing will happen (unlikely especially with LCC, new startups, open skies, etc);
2. CX agrees to sell all its KA shares in exchange for more Air China shares;
3. A merge, CX becomes the mainstream airline and KA the LCC.
"For those who know the two carriers well, think about it. Just compare CX and KA on the PEK, TPE, BKK, and NRT routes and compare the management style between the two. In my opinion, informally KA is already leaning towards being a LCC of some discription"
4. A full merge, one carrier only, ie. everything gets painted green!!
I'm only speculating, but something is happening....... would anyone care to comment?
Here's a few scenarios:
1. Nothing will happen (unlikely especially with LCC, new startups, open skies, etc);
2. CX agrees to sell all its KA shares in exchange for more Air China shares;
3. A merge, CX becomes the mainstream airline and KA the LCC.
"For those who know the two carriers well, think about it. Just compare CX and KA on the PEK, TPE, BKK, and NRT routes and compare the management style between the two. In my opinion, informally KA is already leaning towards being a LCC of some discription"
4. A full merge, one carrier only, ie. everything gets painted green!!
I'm only speculating, but something is happening....... would anyone care to comment?
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KA bus drivers don't paid anywhere near the CX guys. As for LCC, don't overlook the new players such as CR Airways and Hong Kong Express................dark clouds are looming ahead!
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Dixi Normus, jizz is right you dont have a clue. All up if you look at both packages they are pretty close.
Dragon salary about 15% less, but they get a 15% gratuity once a year. And KA guys get Chinese year 1 month bonus every year not just good profit years.
Dragon don"t have a Prov Fund but get overtime above 75hrs as oposed to 83hrs. On big months a Dragon guy can take home 30,000 extra.
Dragons Education fund will pay uni fees up to 21. where CX stops at the end of high school.
And lets not forget between 1 - 3 years to command pay!!!! for KA guys. But obviously this can't last for ever. But it should last for the next couple of years at least, as long as new a/c keep arriving.
Dragon salary about 15% less, but they get a 15% gratuity once a year. And KA guys get Chinese year 1 month bonus every year not just good profit years.
Dragon don"t have a Prov Fund but get overtime above 75hrs as oposed to 83hrs. On big months a Dragon guy can take home 30,000 extra.
Dragons Education fund will pay uni fees up to 21. where CX stops at the end of high school.
And lets not forget between 1 - 3 years to command pay!!!! for KA guys. But obviously this can't last for ever. But it should last for the next couple of years at least, as long as new a/c keep arriving.
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hey!
Just loking for an opinion. By merging both lists, if it happens, could the new company be overstaffed in term of pilots and could this affect new hirings or maybe could there be layoffs at the bottom of the new list??
gza
Just loking for an opinion. By merging both lists, if it happens, could the new company be overstaffed in term of pilots and could this affect new hirings or maybe could there be layoffs at the bottom of the new list??
gza
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Neither company has enough pilots now so that won't be a problem. As far as freighters go, classics for Europe and 400s for Pacific. Dragonair wet-leasing 2 classics from April pending some sort of deal to acquire CX classics. All mixed up with the confusion around classic sim and EFIS fit etc, no investment pending coming announcement. It will be interesting!
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5 year fixed rate note SGD$225 million. "Funds used to hedge the airline's SGD$ position." Oversubscribed 1.7 times - Managed by DBS Bank and Standard Chartered. Matures Feb 2010. Details available via a link in IntraCX.
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Air China Set To Buy HK Cathay Pacific Airlines - Report
What do you guys think of this?
Air China Set To Buy HK Cathay Pacific Airlines - Report
DOW JONES NEWSWIRES
March 15, 2005 6:49 p.m.
HONG KONG -- Air China Ltd. (0753.HK) is in talks with conglomerate Swire Pacific Ltd. (0019.HK) that could see the Chinese carrier take over Swire's 45% owned Cathay Pacific Airways Ltd. (0293.HK), the South China Morning Post reports.
Citing a senior Swire executive, the newspaper said Swire is in advanced negotiations that would see Cathay take over its rival Dragonair before being itself subsumed into the Air China Group.
Cathay is Hong Kong's de facto flag carrier, while Dragonair is a Hong Kong-based regional airline that's partly owned by Cathay and Swire.
The newspaper said if Hong Kong-listed Swire accepts Air China shares in return for its stake in Cathay , it would be the single largest shareholder in the mainland carrier and place its mainly British executives at the core of the Chinese airline's operations
The paper also citing "informed sources in the affected companies" said a deal would likely be announced in two weeks.
The newspaper said that talks over a crossholding structure between Air China and Cathay began in the middle of last year, when the mainland carrier first set a date to list in Hong Kong.
In November, Cathay paid about HK$2.91 billion for 10% in Air China, which listed in Hong Kong on Dec. 15.
Carolyn Leung, a Cathay Pacific spokeswoman, declined to comment. "We don't comment on market rumors," she said.
Any deal will require consent from multiple shareholders at the listed firms that potentially have divergent interests. Dragonair is controlled by China National Aviation Co. (1110.HK), while Chinese conglomerate CITIC Pacific Ltd. (0267.HK) has stakes in both airlines.
But a deal would be a boon for Cathay , which only won the right to fly to China a couple years ago after an absence of more than 10 years. Cathay resumed passenger services to Beijing in December 2003 after a 13-year hiatus in the mainland, and it now operates daily services to the capital. The airline early this year launched passenger services to Xiamen and a freighter service to Shanghai.
-By Nisha Gopalan, Dow Jones Newswires; 852-2832-2343; [email protected]
Here\'s more...
Wednesday March 16, 12:10 AM
Air China eyes Cathay, Dragonair buyout - report
HONG KONG, March 16 (Reuters) - Flag carrier Air China Ltd. may take over Cathay Pacific Airways Ltd. as part of a consolidation of Hong Kong\'s two main airlines in a deal which would create the world\'s largest airline, a Hong Kong newspaper said on Wednesday.
The South China Morning Post said British-linked Swire Pacific Ltd. , one of Hong Kong\'s oldest trading houses, was in advanced negotiations that would see Cathay take over rival Dragonair before being subsumed itself into the Air China group, creating an aviation powerhouse.
Citing sources in the affected companies, the newspaper said Swire may accept Air China shares in return for its 45.73-percent stake in Cathay, a move that would make it a single largest shareholder in the mainland carrier and place its executives at the core of the new group\'s operations.
The paper quoted a senior executive at Swire as saying that Cathay\'s 10 percent investment in Air China in November was the first step in cementing a relationship.
Sources suggested that a deal could be announced within two weeks.
A Cathay spokeswoman in Hong Kong declined to comment on report.
The Hong Kong Economic Times reported Cathay was also in talks with China-focused conglomerate CITIC Pacific , which holds 26 percent of Cathay, and Dragonair\'s main stakeholder China National Aviation Corp. .
A consolidation of the three carriers would create the world\'s largest airline by market value which could feed an international customer base into Greater China\'s most comprehensive route network, the Post added.
Shares of Cathay have gained 1.05 percent in the past month to end at HK$14.30 on Tuesday while Air China has edged up 0.87 percent in the past month to HK$2.825.
Swire\'s shares have risen 4.4 percent over the past month to end at HK$65 on Tuesday.
(US$=HK$7.8)
Air China Set To Buy HK Cathay Pacific Airlines - Report
DOW JONES NEWSWIRES
March 15, 2005 6:49 p.m.
HONG KONG -- Air China Ltd. (0753.HK) is in talks with conglomerate Swire Pacific Ltd. (0019.HK) that could see the Chinese carrier take over Swire's 45% owned Cathay Pacific Airways Ltd. (0293.HK), the South China Morning Post reports.
Citing a senior Swire executive, the newspaper said Swire is in advanced negotiations that would see Cathay take over its rival Dragonair before being itself subsumed into the Air China Group.
Cathay is Hong Kong's de facto flag carrier, while Dragonair is a Hong Kong-based regional airline that's partly owned by Cathay and Swire.
The newspaper said if Hong Kong-listed Swire accepts Air China shares in return for its stake in Cathay , it would be the single largest shareholder in the mainland carrier and place its mainly British executives at the core of the Chinese airline's operations
The paper also citing "informed sources in the affected companies" said a deal would likely be announced in two weeks.
The newspaper said that talks over a crossholding structure between Air China and Cathay began in the middle of last year, when the mainland carrier first set a date to list in Hong Kong.
In November, Cathay paid about HK$2.91 billion for 10% in Air China, which listed in Hong Kong on Dec. 15.
Carolyn Leung, a Cathay Pacific spokeswoman, declined to comment. "We don't comment on market rumors," she said.
Any deal will require consent from multiple shareholders at the listed firms that potentially have divergent interests. Dragonair is controlled by China National Aviation Co. (1110.HK), while Chinese conglomerate CITIC Pacific Ltd. (0267.HK) has stakes in both airlines.
But a deal would be a boon for Cathay , which only won the right to fly to China a couple years ago after an absence of more than 10 years. Cathay resumed passenger services to Beijing in December 2003 after a 13-year hiatus in the mainland, and it now operates daily services to the capital. The airline early this year launched passenger services to Xiamen and a freighter service to Shanghai.
-By Nisha Gopalan, Dow Jones Newswires; 852-2832-2343; [email protected]
Here\'s more...
Wednesday March 16, 12:10 AM
Air China eyes Cathay, Dragonair buyout - report
HONG KONG, March 16 (Reuters) - Flag carrier Air China Ltd. may take over Cathay Pacific Airways Ltd. as part of a consolidation of Hong Kong\'s two main airlines in a deal which would create the world\'s largest airline, a Hong Kong newspaper said on Wednesday.
The South China Morning Post said British-linked Swire Pacific Ltd. , one of Hong Kong\'s oldest trading houses, was in advanced negotiations that would see Cathay take over rival Dragonair before being subsumed itself into the Air China group, creating an aviation powerhouse.
Citing sources in the affected companies, the newspaper said Swire may accept Air China shares in return for its 45.73-percent stake in Cathay, a move that would make it a single largest shareholder in the mainland carrier and place its executives at the core of the new group\'s operations.
The paper quoted a senior executive at Swire as saying that Cathay\'s 10 percent investment in Air China in November was the first step in cementing a relationship.
Sources suggested that a deal could be announced within two weeks.
A Cathay spokeswoman in Hong Kong declined to comment on report.
The Hong Kong Economic Times reported Cathay was also in talks with China-focused conglomerate CITIC Pacific , which holds 26 percent of Cathay, and Dragonair\'s main stakeholder China National Aviation Corp. .
A consolidation of the three carriers would create the world\'s largest airline by market value which could feed an international customer base into Greater China\'s most comprehensive route network, the Post added.
Shares of Cathay have gained 1.05 percent in the past month to end at HK$14.30 on Tuesday while Air China has edged up 0.87 percent in the past month to HK$2.825.
Swire\'s shares have risen 4.4 percent over the past month to end at HK$65 on Tuesday.
(US$=HK$7.8)
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Quote from another website:
Today Hong Kong's South China Morning Post revealed that CX's parent company, Swire Group, is in talks with Air China which could see the Hong Kong airline itself taken over by the Chinese national airline.
Under the deal, as it is understood, Hong Kong's two main airlines, Cathay Pacific and Dragonair, in which both Swire and Air China have a stake, will be merged into a new consolidated Air China group. In returns, Swire will receive shares of the new group and emerge as its single largest shareholder to place executives at the core of the company's operations.
Sources suggested a deal could be announced within two weeks. "A deal is very close to being completed. The 10 per cent investment in Air China by Cathay [in November] was the first step in cementing a relationship," said a senior Swire executive. "Cathay has successfully fought for a small share of the Beijing-Hong Kong and Shanghai-Hong Kong routes, but that is not enough. It knows that it will need full integration into the market."
It is estimated that Cathay's market value is at HKG$48 billion, compared to $26.6 billion for Air China.
A consolidation of the three carriers would create the world's largest airline by market value and an Asian powerhouse that could feed an international customer base into greater China's most comprehensive route network. It would also allow the airlines to rationalise their route networks and reduce overhead costs on sectors such as Hong Kong-Beijing.
http://www.scmp.com/topnews/ZZZ510E456E.html
Today Hong Kong's South China Morning Post revealed that CX's parent company, Swire Group, is in talks with Air China which could see the Hong Kong airline itself taken over by the Chinese national airline.
Under the deal, as it is understood, Hong Kong's two main airlines, Cathay Pacific and Dragonair, in which both Swire and Air China have a stake, will be merged into a new consolidated Air China group. In returns, Swire will receive shares of the new group and emerge as its single largest shareholder to place executives at the core of the company's operations.
Sources suggested a deal could be announced within two weeks. "A deal is very close to being completed. The 10 per cent investment in Air China by Cathay [in November] was the first step in cementing a relationship," said a senior Swire executive. "Cathay has successfully fought for a small share of the Beijing-Hong Kong and Shanghai-Hong Kong routes, but that is not enough. It knows that it will need full integration into the market."
It is estimated that Cathay's market value is at HKG$48 billion, compared to $26.6 billion for Air China.
A consolidation of the three carriers would create the world's largest airline by market value and an Asian powerhouse that could feed an international customer base into greater China's most comprehensive route network. It would also allow the airlines to rationalise their route networks and reduce overhead costs on sectors such as Hong Kong-Beijing.
http://www.scmp.com/topnews/ZZZ510E456E.html
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A tie-up between Cathay Pacific Airways and Air China will create one of the world's most dominant and dynamic airline groups.
As for pilots & expats get ready for more Maxims and speak all the dialects you can learn
As for pilots & expats get ready for more Maxims and speak all the dialects you can learn
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I am interested in the implications of this developement.
You said: As for pilots & expats get ready for more Maxims and speak all the dialects you can learn
Can you be more specific?
Also, does anyone have any comment on pilot job security in this case?
Thnx,
VRT
You said: As for pilots & expats get ready for more Maxims and speak all the dialects you can learn
Can you be more specific?
Also, does anyone have any comment on pilot job security in this case?
Thnx,
VRT
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I am waiting for an official response from CX before commenting, as what i have read in the paper makes no sense, from a CX point of view. Cathay is worth almost twice that of Air China!!!
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I can see now that some people may start panicking and thinking about merging rosters and such. I feel there really is no such need yet.
Does the newspaper report make sense? Yes, Air China is worth less than CX, but when you consider that (reportedly) the Swire management is taking a major stake in the new group, the mathematics do work out.
If indeed this report becomes reality, how will it work out?
Speculate on, this is a rumour network afterall...
Does the newspaper report make sense? Yes, Air China is worth less than CX, but when you consider that (reportedly) the Swire management is taking a major stake in the new group, the mathematics do work out.
If indeed this report becomes reality, how will it work out?
Speculate on, this is a rumour network afterall...
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If this does indeed go ahead then I suspect it will take a very long time to sort it all out.
In the first instance will CX/KA become one pilot force? How would they merge the seniority? Would they merge it at all or just go for a meritocracy system? Would they stream pilots longhaul or shorthaul? Would there be any crossover rights?
How would the routes be sorted? How would the headquarters be rationalised? I cannot see, in this day and age, how this could go ahead in the CX/KA instance, without some form of 'slimming down'. May be good for the shareholders in the long term. Not so good for staff I fear.
And that is before the Air China scenario is even thought about - go figure. I cannot put my hand on my heart, at this point, and say the whole idea fills my heart with boundless joy.
Plenty to talk about at the Gaybar tonight.
In the first instance will CX/KA become one pilot force? How would they merge the seniority? Would they merge it at all or just go for a meritocracy system? Would they stream pilots longhaul or shorthaul? Would there be any crossover rights?
How would the routes be sorted? How would the headquarters be rationalised? I cannot see, in this day and age, how this could go ahead in the CX/KA instance, without some form of 'slimming down'. May be good for the shareholders in the long term. Not so good for staff I fear.
And that is before the Air China scenario is even thought about - go figure. I cannot put my hand on my heart, at this point, and say the whole idea fills my heart with boundless joy.
Plenty to talk about at the Gaybar tonight.