How NOT to instruct

[Centaurus]

Originally Posted by RichardJones

Interesting posts.
They help illustrate the difference between military and civilian flying training. The military avoided me, with ease When one leaves school at 15 with nothing hardly surprising.
The moron who did all the yelling, would be drummed out of a civilian flying school so fast, their head would spin.
Why? Because no person of sound mind, would want to fly with him. That type of individual is not an instructor. A destroyer would be a better description.
Personally I would have told them to "stick it... "
There is a lot of psychology involved in instructing, CRM and Captaincy. You won't get the best performance out of anyone behaving like that. You wont get much respect either.
Best is the silent method. Demonstrate, too others the way you would like it done and how to do it. Aim to make the demonstration, awe inspiring! For the right reasons.
Actions speak louder than words.
Bearing in mind, "it's a poor student, that cant better the instructor" at a later stage.

The moron who did all the yelling, would be drummed out of a civilian flying school so fast, their head would spin.
I doubt that would happen unless the student put in a personal complaint.to the CFI. That that would rarely happen. The student would either assume all instructors were are like that and grit his teeth and take it, or simply walk away and find another flying school.
I am reminded of a story one of my students told me about an instructor he once had. My student was a jovial security guard who had arrived in Australia from Vietnam as a young boy having escaped from North Vietnamese soldiers after the fall of Vietnam. Along with his family they drifted by boat and were robbed by pirates until they finished up in Singapore and thence to Australia. With his money as a security guard he decided he would learn to fly, then do an instructors course and then teach some Vietnamese he knew from his security guard jobs to learn to fly. I did a few dual flights with him and found him keen and a pleasure to fly with.

He told me of flying with an instructor on his first dual cross country flight in a Cessna 172. There was a large cloud mid way through the flight and he was unsure how to avoid it. His instructor started to swear at him calling him an idiot. The language of his instructor was so insulting that (in his own words) "I nearly had to put him to sleep" and he drew a karate cut gesture. There was a happy ending though. Years later he became CFI of a flying school in Fiji and that led to an airline job in Australia

[mahogany bob]

In my experience flying training in the RAF was not an enjoyable experience - everything was tense and the fear of the chop was ever present. Some instructors seemed to take delight in making students life miserable.

Stupid really - as everyone performs and learns much better in a more relaxed atmosphere.

My first instructor on Vulcans was great however - my first attempted roller landing was a shambles when the runway disappeared from view - he calmly took over and whispered - try raising the seat and have another go !

Later on when instructing Air Refuelling the odd reminder to relax and keep breathing usually worked well.

[Manwell]

Originally Posted by mahogany bob

In my experience flying training in the RAF was not an enjoyable experience - everything was tense and the fear of the chop was ever present. Some instructors seemed to take delight in making students life miserable.

Stupid really - as everyone performs and learns much better in a more relaxed atmosphere.

My first instructor on Vulcans was great however - my first attempted roller landing was a shambles when the runway disappeared from view - he calmly took over and whispered - try raising the seat and have another go !

Later on when instructing Air Refuelling the odd reminder to relax and keep breathing usually worked well.

He was a wise instructor. Relaxing, good posture, and breathing, all contribute to heightened awareness and co-ordination. The RAF want people who can handle pressure and still function, so that would weed out the snowflakes.

[Hamish 123]

I was on 7 FTS at Church Fenton in the early 80s, a couple of years after Fighter Pilot was aired. My ultimate chop ride was with a flight commander whose style was akin to the segment in the programme. Not saying he was to blame for my failure, but he made a difficult situation pretty unpleasant. All the other instructors I flew with were very much more human, and did their best to get me up to the required standard.

[megan]

When at an advanced stage of training 1967 in the USN at Pensacola a story circulated among the students about a prank many years prior that instructors played upon one of their own who had a bad reputation with his students. Always had some doubts re the veracity until this showed up on Y'tube.

You Tube

You Tube

[Fred.Kite]

Peter F. Drucker was a management consultant, educator, and author widely regarded as the "Father of Modern Management."

He famously said, "Teaching is the only major occupation of man for which we have not yet developed tools that make an average person capable of competence and performance. In teaching we rely on the 'naturals,' the ones who somehow know how to teach."

Many pilots, regardless of their vast experience or where they learned to fly, are simply not suited for teaching. Effective teaching is not only a creative art and a performative skill—it is a vocation.

[wiggy]

Originally Posted by BEagle

That item in 'Fighter Pilot' was staged for the BBC!

Bit late spotting this, apologies...and yes, ^^^ pretty much.

Story from those directly involved, or on the edge of this or had to unravel the resultant fallout was that the QFI was certainly stitched up in the editing suite....and FWIW the RAF didn't have a say in the final result.

Over the years I ended up working alongside a couple of the victims of the series... From the stories they told some on the directing/production side of the series very definitely had an agenda...

[Centaurus]

Back in the 1950's I was the squadron QFI on Avro Lincoln maritme reconnaissance aircraft. I was 25 years old at the time and a bit of an eager beaver instructor. . Some of the captains on the squadron were former WW2 Lancaster pilots in their 40's. In our squadron, paper checklists were unheard of. The only checklist was in the head and the before take off checklist was the standard Central Flying School mantra of Harness, Hatches, Hydraulics, Trim, Mixture, Pitch, Fuel, Flaps etc .

I set about to teach our pilots the scan system left to right as used by the airlines. The Lincoln had a supercharger switch on the instrument panel marked MS for medium speed and HS for high speed. It was important to ensure that MS was used for take off since HS could cause engine damage at take off power.
I noticed that some of the ex wartime captains refused to accept the pre-start scan I had introduced. To counter that problem I would quietly move the supercharger switch to the HS position before the captain had taken his seat and see if he picked this up during his pre-start scan. The old and bolds from the 1940's frequently missed the switch during their pre-start checks - particularly when night flying

One night I arrived at the aircraft before the other pilot and went to set the supercharger switch to HS. It was dark in the cockpit as the Lincoln cockpit lighting was notoriously poor. As I went to select the supercharger to HS I felt a sharp prick to my finger. I cursed in the darkness and sucked my finger to stem the blood flow. There was a laugh behind me and it was the old and bold ex Lancaster pilot with a grin all over his face. I shone my torch on to the supercharger switch to discover a drawing pin cellotaped to the switch pointed side sticking out. The old bugger had got to the aircraft before me having heard of my reputation for putting the supercharger switch to HS instead of leaving it on MS the normal position.

He had made his point (pun intended) and I never did that trick again

[LTCTerry]

The comments here about good instructors and bad instructors back in the day are quite interesting. I retired at 62 three years ago to pursue a new career flying. Much of my adult life has been spent teaching, including teaching people to teach in an industrial environment.

In just over 3 years I have sent 34 people to various practical tests with all but one passing on the first go. Six of these have been initial FAA instructors. But only one of the 34 has been a traditional single engine private pilot. Even he was different - he had soloed 30 years before and had been a US Marine Corps helicopter crew chief and had grown up around family airplanes.

"Fear, Intimidation, Sarcasm, and Ridicule" I had heard before from a former USAF/retired Delta guy in my glider club. But had forgotten the specifics. I like the Peter Drucker quote.

I try to share practical tips on being a good, effective instructor with my candidates. I want them to succeed. I need to incorporate some of these stories!

A civilian trainee has a choice. A good instructor delivers good value for the money. Or the customer goes elsewhere.

Thanks for sharing, Gents!

[ShyTorque]

I didn’t enjoy my RAF basic fixed wing flying training much at all. I soon gained the impression that we were all up for the chop unless we proved otherwise, that some of our QFIs would rather not be in the job and consequently treated students with more than a little disdain. I latterly suffered from sinus issues and was eventually sent to rotary wing training rather than continue on jets. I found that system to be a breath of fresh air (!) and my renewed enthusiasm for flying resulted in being awarded a trophy for highest aggregate marks, despite me being the second youngest on the course, which consisted mainly of already qualified pilots. I later became an A2 QHI then a QFI and my one aim was to be a more empathetic, better instructor than some of those I’d flown with at fixed wing BFTS.

Years later, whilst carrying out self funded training for my fixed wing CPL, I flew with an ex RAF instructor who I had never previously met but who dated back to my time at BFTS. I found him increasingly difficult to fly with, mainly because he never stopped talking and heavily criticising almost every control movement I did. Eventually, during a circuits sortie I told him I’d had enough, I wasn't learning anything and wanted to terminate the flight. He became verbally aggressive and tried to insist that I continued. I gave him back control in no uncertain terms, folded my arms and that was it. On landing, he began to verbally lay into me. I cut him short, told him that he was forgetting that I was a paying customer of the school, not in the RAF and told that I wouldn’t be flying with him again. After we walked in he went off to see the chief instructor. I was asked to go to see him a few minutes later. I put forward my viewpoint, which was that his instructional technique which might have been seen as acceptable in the RAF of twenty years ago wasn’t acceptable to paying civilian customers of the day. I received an apology from the chief instructor and later a rather contrite one from the instructor himself. I flew with another instructor (a retired group captain, who by coincidence I knew because he had previously been the station commander where I’d been a UAS QFI). We got along very well and he soon put me forward to my CPL checkride, which went well.

[BEagle]

The Lincoln had a supercharger switch on the instrument panel marked MS for medium speed and HS for high speed. It was important to ensure that MS was used for take off since HS could cause engine damage at take off power.
I noticed that some of the ex wartime captains refused to accept the pre-start scan I had introduced. To counter that problem I would quietly move the supercharger switch to the HS position before the captain had taken his seat and see if he picked this up during his pre-start scan.

So if you'd been distracted before start up or had missed checking the supercharger switch, you could have been responsible for causing engine damage. Surely there must have been better ways of making sure that the trainee captain had checked the switch?

[Centaurus]

The dangers of over-confidence in your own ability

For a truly frightening example of an instrucror who crashed his USAF B52 many years ago, read the following link. *80 degrees angle of bank at 100 feet. He had been doing this for years and got away with it.https://www.facebook.com/share/p/1NM...ibextid=wwXIfr

[beamer]

I was at Linton at the same time that ‘Fighter Pilot’ was being filmed albeit on a different Sqn to the ‘film stars’. I don’t know why they chose the students they did but suffice to say that there were others on the same course who were perhaps more representative of those who went on to fly fast jets. From a personal point of view my primary instructor on the JP3 was an absolute a**e who in addition to being crude and aggressive in the cockpit was also remarkably indiscreet talking about students in the bar before he went home in the evening. When I went onto the JP5 I was given another instructor who, rather older, was an absolute gentleman; Dave was demanding but certainly brought the best out of my marginal abilities and got me off to Valley and beyond.

[Genghis the Engineer]

I don’t know why they chose the students they did but suffice to say that there were others on the same course who were perhaps more representative of those who went on to fly fast jets.

I've done a reasonable amount of TV, although not this. I'm reminded for example of selecting people for an episode of Scrapheap Challenge that I was technical scriptwriter for. Ability was a nice-to-have. Visual interest, tendency to explain everything they did, and above all never to swear when they dropped a hammer on their foot were much more important.

Fighter Pilot will all have been about making compelling TV, not about providing an accurate portrayal of the course, most of whose members will have been of necessity quiet, boring, workaholics who happened to be quite good at flying jets.

G

[Centaurus]

At one point in my flying career I flew 737's for a small Pacific operator. During my training to be upgraded as a captain the check pilot was a tough and forceful American bloke who was despised by all the 30 pilots in the airline. His name was Joe. He had previously been a 737 simulator instructor with Boeing in Seattle. His instructional technique was sarcasm coupled with physical grabbing of your arm to make a point.

For all that, he could come out with an occasional brilliant quip about one's competence ot lack of. One of our copilots was a lovely chap called Barry. The simulator session with Barry didn't go too well, and Joe quipped to Barry; "Well Barry, one thing for sure and that is you will never be killed in a Boeing 737 - and do you know why? - and that is because you are so far behind the aircraft that it would have crashed before you got there."

I had my own problems with Joe. I was very experienced with 18 years of flying in the Royal Australian Air Force on transports, but I could never please him in the 737. In the end I pulled out $400 from my bank account. We were in the cockpit in the 737 doing the before start checklist when Joe grabbed my wrist over some minor point of procedure. I took a deep breath and said to Joe "The more you yell - the deafer I get". I pulled out the $400 and waved it in his face and said that's my fare home - I'm out of here - and stormed out of the cockpit and went to walk towards the airport termina. Joe was shocked as he knew we couldn't operate the flight single pilot. He called me back and aplogised for his behaviour saying that if he had upset me let him know and it wouldn't happen again.

After that little epsisode I never had any more problems with Joe.

[Chronic Snoozer]

RAAF Central Flying School used to have a poster in the hallway or kitchen, “The Rules of Muff” or something of that nature. I can’t recall its source. It was presented as a list of commandments for the new QFI. Amongst those I can remember vaguely, were these:

He will learn in spite of you.
Never fly the first circuit.

Always stuck with me, especially the first one.

Anybody remember the full list?

As an aside, the RAAF finally has a simulator in the ab initio phase. No more waiting for an accident to repurpose a cockpit for practicing checks. I imagine the quality of instruction has gone up by degrees through the application of this technology.

[Centaurus]

Originally Posted by Chronic Snoozer

RAAF Central Flying School used to have a poster in the hallway or kitchen, “The Rules of Muff” or something of that nature. I can’t recall its source. It was presented as a list of commandments for the new QFI. Amongst those I can remember vaguely, were these:

He will learn in spite of you.
Never fly the first circuit.

Always stuck with me, especially the first one.

Anybody remember the full list?

As an aside, the RAAF finally has a simulator in the ab initio phase. No more waiting for an accident to repurpose a cockpit for practicing checks. I imagine the quality of instruction has gone up by degrees through the application of this technology.

He will learn in spite of you.
Never fly the first circuit.
Try as a I may, I fail to see the sense in either of those statements. I will always remember with great regret one of my early students on Tiger Moths. His name was Trainee Pilot Jones and he was on No. 24 Post War Pilots Course at RAAF No.1 Basic Flying Training Course at Uranquinty in New South Wales in 1956. He was a quiet gentleman in every sense of the word. Despite my efforts at trying to train him to fly circuits he always misjudged the turn on to final. His landing were consistently hopeless and there was no way I could take the risk and send him on his first solo.

After about five sessions of circuits and with no success, I reluctantly called in my flight commander and asked if he could fly with the student as I had run out of ideas. The flight commander was a no-nonsense charaacter and in my heart I knew he would scrub my student after a few circuits. And that is exactly what happened. I watched the landings and they varied from huge bounces to impossibly long floats due excessive speed over the fence.

After twenty minutes the flight commander called it a day and taxied in. Leaving the forlorn student behind in the aircraft the flight commander said to me "That man is dangerous I've scrubbed him."
So that quickly put paid to the CFS assertion that "he will learn in spite of you." As for the second statement, Never fly the first circuit, I would counter that with " if the student is nervous, try flying the first circuit yourself to relax him."

70 years later, if Trainee Pilot Jones is still around, I would like to say sorry I couldn't help you, but I tried my best

[jonkster]

Originally Posted by Centaurus

As for the second statement, Never fly the first circuit, I would counter that with " if the student is nervous, try flying the first circuit yourself to relax him."

I also don't quite understand what that "don't fly the first circuit" rule is about.

I always remember a piece of advice I was given a long time ago (given by an instructor long gone but whom I still highly respect)

"Never underestimate the value of a good demonstration"

Many times I think a quick demonstration of what I am looking for has saved me hours of frustrated instruction and poor progress by the student.

(Sadly I keep needing to re-learn that bit of advice, you can sometimes feel you are stealing stick time from the student when in actual fact you are saving time and frustration and money).

[Big Pistons Forever]

Whenever I fly I tell the student where to look. Without a sweaty hand on the throttle and stick to use most of all his brain power the student can concentrate on "seeing" what the picture should be.

[Centaurus]

Jongster. I agree with your point about a good demonstration. For that reason I could never understand why flight simullator instructors rarely, if ever, demonstrate a sequence in the simulator. Some prefer to simply sit back in their chair and criticise. Over many years of airline flying I have suffered more than my fair share of those hopeless characters. A typical example is teaching the engine failure at V1 whether it is a 737 or an Airbus variety. Imagine a new airline pilot coming directly from general aviation light twins where there are two engines but no such thing as a V1.

The most comprensive pre-flight briefing can never replace a demonstration in the simulator. Is it any wonder the simulator earns its reputaion as the Horror Box. Yet most of the time it is the instructor that causes that reputation. When one sees the name of a known "screamer" instructor up on the simulator program with your name next to it, it sets the scene for a horror session where nothing is learnt and the student's morale crashes. You can also bet that instructor never first demonstrates a diificult sequence before handing over to the student to have a go. Why? The usual excuse is the limitaion on simulator time. The real reason? The instructor might stuff up the sequence and lose face/