CAA code of conduct during audit?
Thread Starter
CAA code of conduct during audit?
I am seeking information from instructors in various EASA countries.
I have been doing ground training for an operator for several years and a little bird whispered in my ear that the CAA will be attending my next type technical refresher course in a few weeks time. This has happened before about 3 years ago where CAA auditor showed up unannounced to monitor classroom training. I let it go at the time but it annoyed me. In my opinion it shows lack of professional courtesy and above all trust.
So my question to all:
Is this common practice in other EASA countries that CAA senior inspector/ auditor shows up at your classes to review your work?
And if you know where I could read information about auditing practices of authorities as thatīs is not in my field and I have no knowledge of what rules CAA inspectors are to follow.
Thanks.
I have been doing ground training for an operator for several years and a little bird whispered in my ear that the CAA will be attending my next type technical refresher course in a few weeks time. This has happened before about 3 years ago where CAA auditor showed up unannounced to monitor classroom training. I let it go at the time but it annoyed me. In my opinion it shows lack of professional courtesy and above all trust.
So my question to all:
Is this common practice in other EASA countries that CAA senior inspector/ auditor shows up at your classes to review your work?
And if you know where I could read information about auditing practices of authorities as thatīs is not in my field and I have no knowledge of what rules CAA inspectors are to follow.
Thanks.
Well if the operator is due for an AOC audit, and it conducts training, it seems pretty normal to me. Here's some comments from the UK CAA website on operator oversight: https://www.caa.co.uk/Commercial-ind...f-AOC-holders/
If the question relates to how the auditor actually conducts himself during the audit, that's a different issue.
If the question relates to how the auditor actually conducts himself during the audit, that's a different issue.
Thread Starter
Thank you for your input. I am mainly trying to establish if itīs normal to do unannounced audits on classroom training and if there are any written rules the auditors should adhere to. For example is it allowed or can it be tolerated that they participate in the classroom discussions.
I do training for AOC holders of many countries oversight authorities but this one is the only one that really gets on my finest nerves. Perhaps itīs time for that operator to purchase a fine CBT package and let itīs aircrew do yet another brain dead computer course.
I do training for AOC holders of many countries oversight authorities but this one is the only one that really gets on my finest nerves. Perhaps itīs time for that operator to purchase a fine CBT package and let itīs aircrew do yet another brain dead computer course.
I am mainly trying to establish if itīs normal to do unannounced audits on classroom training
For example is it allowed or can it be tolerated that they participate in the classroom discussions.
Is this common practice in other EASA countries that CAA senior inspector/ auditor shows up at your classes to review your work?
During my time as a Chief Ground Instructor the CAA always discussed and agreed audit dates several months in advance.
In selecting which classroom lessons to audit, their first choice would always be any new istructors which they had not audited before. I would of course advise the instructors that they would be audited and tell them what to expect.
On those occasions when there we no new instructors, the auditors would simply select a lesson at random. This of course meant that the instructor would get little or no prior notice. But I cannot remember any occasion on which the auditor iterupted the lesson. And there were never any problems with the audits.
In selecting which classroom lessons to audit, their first choice would always be any new istructors which they had not audited before. I would of course advise the instructors that they would be audited and tell them what to expect.
On those occasions when there we no new instructors, the auditors would simply select a lesson at random. This of course meant that the instructor would get little or no prior notice. But I cannot remember any occasion on which the auditor iterupted the lesson. And there were never any problems with the audits.
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I suspect most of today's CAA auditors would have difficulty in differentiating between a lesson on turbine theory or one on knitting.
The ones I've come across in the past year or so are all 'box-tickers'.
The ones I've come across in the past year or so are all 'box-tickers'.
Thread Starter
@ īCows getting biggerī thatīs exactly what gets me so miffed. These Bozoīs have no clue..
@ Billiebob. I have not been informed officially, someone overheard someoneīs cousin saying to the lunch lady who told the guy at the hot dog stand who... and so on and thatīs how the rumour got back to me.
A unnanounced audit seems to be in order with safety concerned matters. Maybe fully trained and checked out pilots will suddenly forget what material the engine cowlings are made of or how many injectors the turbine has so in that way it could be a urgent safety matter
"GM1 ARA.GEN.300(d) Oversight
(b) Audits and inspections of such activities, including ramp and unannounced inspections,
should be prioritised towards those areas of greater safety concern, as identified
through the analysis of data on safety hazards and their consequences in operations."
In the UK CAA AOC oversight information letter it sayīs:
" Training Department Check (Check T)- An inspection of training conducted by or on behalf of the company."
Makes sense to review the subjects taught and material used but to sit in and interrupt the class is not proper conduct in my opinion.
Has anyone here made a complaint to EASA about a NAA and how did you go about that?
Thanks for your input guyīs, much appreciated.
@ Billiebob. I have not been informed officially, someone overheard someoneīs cousin saying to the lunch lady who told the guy at the hot dog stand who... and so on and thatīs how the rumour got back to me.
A unnanounced audit seems to be in order with safety concerned matters. Maybe fully trained and checked out pilots will suddenly forget what material the engine cowlings are made of or how many injectors the turbine has so in that way it could be a urgent safety matter
"GM1 ARA.GEN.300(d) Oversight
(b) Audits and inspections of such activities, including ramp and unannounced inspections,
should be prioritised towards those areas of greater safety concern, as identified
through the analysis of data on safety hazards and their consequences in operations."
In the UK CAA AOC oversight information letter it sayīs:
" Training Department Check (Check T)- An inspection of training conducted by or on behalf of the company."
Makes sense to review the subjects taught and material used but to sit in and interrupt the class is not proper conduct in my opinion.
Has anyone here made a complaint to EASA about a NAA and how did you go about that?
Thanks for your input guyīs, much appreciated.
but to sit in and interrupt the class is not proper conduct in my opinion.
Last edited by Whopity; 25th Nov 2016 at 10:24. Reason: sp
N4790P
Likewise. Every EASA auditor we have had here has behaved correctly when observing training, whether classroom or FSTD based and only made comments during the debrief or wrap up meeting but never within earshot of the students..
