EASA IR (restricted)
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EASA IR (restricted)
Hi, I have just received my Easa license this morning. And I have IR (R) on it. I understand it is basically IMCr with a new title. And all the restricted privileges.
I have a lapsed ME/IR, so does actually count as an IR which absolves my need to renew my IR prior the 5 year cut off ? Has my IR (sep) been renewed by this new title, as I was going to renew my IR in a SEP anyway.......
Bet this is a long shot. Lol
I have a lapsed ME/IR, so does actually count as an IR which absolves my need to renew my IR prior the 5 year cut off ? Has my IR (sep) been renewed by this new title, as I was going to renew my IR in a SEP anyway.......
Bet this is a long shot. Lol
Has my IR (sep) been renewed by this new title,
Last edited by Whopity; 25th Oct 2012 at 10:24.
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Lol. Thought so. It's only been out for a couple of years. IMCr suited my FI work. Renewing it in a few months.
Thanks for the reply !
Thanks for the reply !
I have a lapsed ME/IR, so does actually count as an IR which absolves my need to renew my IR prior the 5 year cut off ? Has my IR (sep) been renewed by this new title, as I was going to renew my IR in a SEP anyway.......
As I understand it, any IR(R) to 'competency-based' IR conversion criteria will only be considered once the NPA 2011-16 CRD has been released, received a response, progressed through comitology and eventually into law. Similarly, an IR(R) conversion to include EIR privileges will be considered if the EIR becomes law.
So don't hold your breath.....
So don't hold your breath.....
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If you have not renewed or revalidated it in the past 7 years you will have to retake all of the exams and undergo considerable training to get it back
What is happening to UK airline pilots who have been working in say USA or HK and who want to come back?
Is there no route for them, or is giving up flying their only option?
Virtually nobody is actually going to do the 7 exams and the 55hrs training...
What is happening to UK airline pilots who have been working in say USA or HK and who want to come back?
Is there no route for them, or is giving up flying their only option?
Virtually nobody is actually going to do the 7 exams and the 55hrs training...
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EASA IR (restricted)
My buddy has just put a new rating on his UK ATPL, this has triggered the issue of an EASA licence. The EASA licence includes as an expired rating an IR(r). Effectively losing the IMC rating that was formerly contained within the UKATPL. Not sure why the rating was listed as expired as obviously it was current on the UKATPL. Speculation suggests that it was because there was no test date.
I am about to renew my UK ATPL as it expires in December and would very much like to keep my IMC rating or a valid IR(r). Anyone got any suggestions of the best way of achieving this
I am about to renew my UK ATPL as it expires in December and would very much like to keep my IMC rating or a valid IR(r). Anyone got any suggestions of the best way of achieving this
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If you hold an SP IR then the last time you passed the test in an aircraft will also
count as the test for an IMC / IR(R) and you can apply for an IR(R) on the basis
of this pass valid for 25 months from the date of test.
However you say you hold an ATPL which implies you have an MP IR.
In which case take the Test!
This makes good sense - No matter how qualified and experienced you are
in flying IFR and IMC Approaches in Controlled Airspace in a Multi Crew
enviroment with an aircraft with all the kit - including IFR approved GPS.
This is not the same as flying IMC Single Pilot in Class G in (say) a very basically
equipped PA28 followed by a Procedural Approach in to a non-radar airfield.
Skills are different and hence need to be separately assessed
count as the test for an IMC / IR(R) and you can apply for an IR(R) on the basis
of this pass valid for 25 months from the date of test.
However you say you hold an ATPL which implies you have an MP IR.
In which case take the Test!
This makes good sense - No matter how qualified and experienced you are
in flying IFR and IMC Approaches in Controlled Airspace in a Multi Crew
enviroment with an aircraft with all the kit - including IFR approved GPS.
This is not the same as flying IMC Single Pilot in Class G in (say) a very basically
equipped PA28 followed by a Procedural Approach in to a non-radar airfield.
Skills are different and hence need to be separately assessed
What is happening to UK airline pilots who have been working in say USA or HK and who want to come back?
However you say you hold an ATPL which implies you have an MP IR.
From CAP804:
3.3.4 Part-FCL Restricted Instrument Rating
Where a licence containing a valid IMC rating or IMC privileges is replaced with a Part-
FCL licence, the IMC rating privileges may be preserved as a restricted Instrument
Rating. This will appear on the licence as IR (Restricted).
Where a licence containing a valid IMC rating or IMC privileges is replaced with a Part-
FCL licence, the IMC rating privileges may be preserved as a restricted Instrument
Rating. This will appear on the licence as IR (Restricted).
Indeed, Whopity.
In theory then, since EASA Part-FCL is not supposed to remove any existing privileges
the IR(R) included in a converted UK (non JAR-FCL) CPL(A) or ATPL(A) should be non-expiring.....
However, the minimum validity must surely be 25 months from the date of conversion? Nothing to do with the date of any previous IR(A).
In theory then, since EASA Part-FCL is not supposed to remove any existing privileges
the IR(R) included in a converted UK (non JAR-FCL) CPL(A) or ATPL(A) should be non-expiring.....However, the minimum validity must surely be 25 months from the date of conversion? Nothing to do with the date of any previous IR(A).
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EASA IR (restricted)
Glad to see you are all finding this as difficult as I am to sort out! For the record, my current IR is MP, although my original test some years ago was SP. I have held a rating continiously since the original test. (This used to be relevant as it meant I could just do an SEP IR without assessment or course).
Level , I appreciate your point that it's a different skill, that's why my current SEP flying really only requires an IMC rating. If I was planning on taking an SEP into controlled airspace etc I would plan some refresher flying followed by a proper SEP SP IR. I feel content that my existing skills will cope with the privileges granted by an IMC rating.
If I am going to have to take a test to validate my IR(r) then I may as well do the full IR.
One option I had considered was paying the extra to renew my UK ATPL as well as this should give me IMC privileges until 2015 and will will work out cheaper than an IR(r) test.
I was rather hoping though, that someone had already persuaded the CAA to issue an ATPL with a non expiring IR(r).
Level , I appreciate your point that it's a different skill, that's why my current SEP flying really only requires an IMC rating. If I was planning on taking an SEP into controlled airspace etc I would plan some refresher flying followed by a proper SEP SP IR. I feel content that my existing skills will cope with the privileges granted by an IMC rating.
If I am going to have to take a test to validate my IR(r) then I may as well do the full IR.
One option I had considered was paying the extra to renew my UK ATPL as well as this should give me IMC privileges until 2015 and will will work out cheaper than an IR(r) test.
I was rather hoping though, that someone had already persuaded the CAA to issue an ATPL with a non expiring IR(r).
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If they have JAR-FCL licences, they change the State of Issue to somewhere which has an NAA more sensible than the UK CAA, such as the Republic of Ireland, which does recognise the validity of ICAO IRs.
What would be the procedure for that?
Surely you need to live in Ireland, or something like that, because under the new rules the State issuing the license needs to also hold your medical records.
See CAP 804 Part I Section 3.
Other Member States have been more generous than the CAA with respect to IR recognition. The CAA changed from:
LASORS2008:
to LASORS2010:
without any warning or justification. The IAA are aware of this absurd situation and are, I understand, quite happy for pilots with UK-issued JAR-FCL licences to change their State of Issue to the Republic of Ireland, in order to avoid the absurd nonsense of retaking exams after 7 years of JAR-FCL IR expiry even though IR privileges are being exercised on other ICAO licences.
Other Member States have been more generous than the CAA with respect to IR recognition. The CAA changed from:
LASORS2008:
However, where IR privileges have been exercised in another category of aircraft (i.e. UK/JAR IR(H)) or under the privileges of an ICAO licence (Aeroplanes and Helicopters) or under a UK military IR qualification (fixed-wing or rotary), the renewal requirements will be based on the expiry date of that IR.
Where less than 7 years have elapsed since the IR(A) expired but IR privileges have been exercised since in another category of aircraft (i.e. UK/JAR IR(H)) or under the privileges of an ICAO licence (Aeroplanes and Helicopters) or under a military IR qualification (fixed-wing or rotary), the renewal requirements for the IR(A) will be based on the expiry of that other IR.
If more than 7 years have elapsed since the IR(A) expired, no credit will be given for any other IR rating or qualification, and the terms set out below for more than 7 years since expiry shall apply.
If more than 7 years have elapsed since the IR(A) expired, no credit will be given for any other IR rating or qualification, and the terms set out below for more than 7 years since expiry shall apply.
Last edited by BEagle; 28th Oct 2012 at 11:12.
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Priceless info, Beagle, thank you 
I will update my tome on this topic
...not to mention the 55hrs at an FTO, followed by the JAA IR flight test, most of which not many long-time airline pilots, flying "computer planes" all day, will find very easy...
I will update my tome on this topic
Will be cheaper than doing the exams again.
FAA IR holders wishing to convert to an EASA Part-FCL C-B IR(A) will no doubt be interested to note that EASA has accepted my IAOPA Europe proposals in full.... See Comment 506 and the associated response.
We still have the FCL.600(b) battle to win, particularly as regards the issue of new IR(R)s after Apr 2014.....
We still have the FCL.600(b) battle to win, particularly as regards the issue of new IR(R)s after Apr 2014.....
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Had a bit of a skim read and overall I feel quite positive about it.
One aspect that I'm not over keen on is the 200 hours of IFR time before you can instruct for the EIR/CBIR as that disadvantages career instructors.
One aspect that I'm not over keen on is the 200 hours of IFR time before you can instruct for the EIR/CBIR as that disadvantages career instructors.