OBTAINING AN FAA MEI RATING
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OBTAINING AN FAA MEI RATING
Hello, i hold an FAA CPL/AMEL/IR. If i want to obtain an Multi-engine instructor, Am i reqd to first of all get a CFI or can i obtain MEI as my first instructor rating?
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Is that post-1st April joke? Don't tell us you got multi IFR comm without having read the regs. Isnt' it all in the regs?
As an answer already mentioned, yes. Your initial instructor rating can be MEI and you don't have to do CFI first. Saves you flying complex aircraft later as you need complex for the initial instructor rating (ie no need to have complex single for the take offs/landing as per CFI PTS). Some FAA pilots have done it for few practical reasons regarding maneuvres in PTS as well from what I've researched in the past.
MEI alone is of limited use as without CFII you can't teach multi IFR and without CFI you can't have CFII.
As an answer already mentioned, yes. Your initial instructor rating can be MEI and you don't have to do CFI first. Saves you flying complex aircraft later as you need complex for the initial instructor rating (ie no need to have complex single for the take offs/landing as per CFI PTS). Some FAA pilots have done it for few practical reasons regarding maneuvres in PTS as well from what I've researched in the past.
MEI alone is of limited use as without CFII you can't teach multi IFR and without CFI you can't have CFII.
Not quite true. You most certainly can hold a CFII without either MEI or CFI. The three instructor ratings are each standalone ratings.
BTW, I hold MEI without the other two. I've also held Oz equivalents to the FAA's instructor rating trio. I'll end up doing the other two at some point but it worked out easier for me to do the MEI first. Lots of multi time or multi instructing time & no experience with the FAA's unique PPL & CPL manoeuvres.
BTW, I hold MEI without the other two. I've also held Oz equivalents to the FAA's instructor rating trio. I'll end up doing the other two at some point but it worked out easier for me to do the MEI first. Lots of multi time or multi instructing time & no experience with the FAA's unique PPL & CPL manoeuvres.
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My bad. 
Must confess I didn't study regs regarding standalone CFII but I was made to believe from talking to other pilots etc in the past, that II is added after doing CFI. The practicality for flying as CFII but not CFI, is quite limited in helicopter world. Maybe that's why I haven't come across this exact info.
Teaching twin instrument would then be ME class rating and IR training, hence no ab-initio instruction, needing CFI. It does make sense. I guess I read too many different countries' regs. JAA/EASA would be an example why it'd NOT work. Though there's CRI/CRE.
Must confess I didn't study regs regarding standalone CFII but I was made to believe from talking to other pilots etc in the past, that II is added after doing CFI. The practicality for flying as CFII but not CFI, is quite limited in helicopter world. Maybe that's why I haven't come across this exact info.
Teaching twin instrument would then be ME class rating and IR training, hence no ab-initio instruction, needing CFI. It does make sense. I guess I read too many different countries' regs. JAA/EASA would be an example why it'd NOT work. Though there's CRI/CRE.
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§ 61.195 Flight instructor limitations and qualifications.
A person who holds a flight instructor certificate is subject to the following limitations:
(a) Hours of training. In any 24-consecutive-hour period, a flight instructor may not conduct more than 8 hours of flight training.
(b) Aircraft Ratings. A flight instructor may not conduct flight training in any aircraft for which the flight instructor does not hold:
(1) A pilot certificate and flight instructor certificate with the applicable category and class rating; and
(2) If appropriate, a type rating.
(c) Instrument Rating. A flight instructor who provides instrument training for the issuance of an instrument rating, a type rating not limited to VFR, or the instrument training required for commercial pilot and airline transport pilot certificates must hold an instrument rating on his or her pilot certificate and flight instructor certificate that is appropriate to the category and class of aircraft used for the training provided.
A person who holds a flight instructor certificate is subject to the following limitations:
(a) Hours of training. In any 24-consecutive-hour period, a flight instructor may not conduct more than 8 hours of flight training.
(b) Aircraft Ratings. A flight instructor may not conduct flight training in any aircraft for which the flight instructor does not hold:
(1) A pilot certificate and flight instructor certificate with the applicable category and class rating; and
(2) If appropriate, a type rating.
(c) Instrument Rating. A flight instructor who provides instrument training for the issuance of an instrument rating, a type rating not limited to VFR, or the instrument training required for commercial pilot and airline transport pilot certificates must hold an instrument rating on his or her pilot certificate and flight instructor certificate that is appropriate to the category and class of aircraft used for the training provided.
This ruling (PDF link) clarified stuff and was connected to the changes.
Therefore it looks to me that it's legally now useless to hold Flight instructor instrument airplane certificate without "airplane single engine" and try to instruct and those who do so after 2009, are skating on very thin ice. True, doing it as initial may save some hassle/stress of first instructor checkride, but..
That's a relatively recent change to the interpretation of the rules then, and changes the application of what I wrote before. Under this new version you would need a CFI or MEI (as appropriate), and a CFII, to provide instrument instruction.
However, by my reading of it, a standalone CFII could still be used if the other pilot is already qualified eg a PPL or CPL with IR who needs an instrument proficiency check. Possibly also usable as a standalone rating for simulator work, but I'm not really certain about that.
However, by my reading of it, a standalone CFII could still be used if the other pilot is already qualified eg a PPL or CPL with IR who needs an instrument proficiency check. Possibly also usable as a standalone rating for simulator work, but I'm not really certain about that.
Last edited by Tinstaafl; 4th Apr 2012 at 04:30.
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sure, sim training should be OK with even ground instructor ratings/certs.
I'm not sure about IPC, but it may fall into the instrument training area.
It's not just the interpretation/clarification, I believe they changed the wording to make it clearer.
Basically, when I checked the rules, they also clarify that only 'instrument basics' for issue of PPL can be done by non-instrument rated CPL/CFII, rest has to be proper instrument instructor and FI on relevant class/category (incl the instrument for CPL).
Sure. We both learned something new about the regs and 'recent' changes by digging into the topic a bit. So win-win situation, even though OT for MEI rating/cert.
I'm not sure about IPC, but it may fall into the instrument training area.
It's not just the interpretation/clarification, I believe they changed the wording to make it clearer.
Basically, when I checked the rules, they also clarify that only 'instrument basics' for issue of PPL can be done by non-instrument rated CPL/CFII, rest has to be proper instrument instructor and FI on relevant class/category (incl the instrument for CPL).
Sure. We both learned something new about the regs and 'recent' changes by digging into the topic a bit. So win-win situation, even though OT for MEI rating/cert.
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As for Ground Instructors/IGIs doing sims, I remember that early in my career too (apparently per a 1980 letter from the FAA), but not anymore: see Pilipshen's post here:
http://www.pprune.org/north-america/...nstructor.html
A scan of the original letter is here:
http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/...010/Gatlin.pdf
Interestingly Mr. Gatling (the addressee of the 2010 FAA letter) has a website as a Ground Instructor and advertises that he does simulator work...maybe it's an old site.
http://www.pprune.org/north-america/...nstructor.html
A scan of the original letter is here:
http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/...010/Gatlin.pdf
Interestingly Mr. Gatling (the addressee of the 2010 FAA letter) has a website as a Ground Instructor and advertises that he does simulator work...maybe it's an old site.
