Restricted FI - what can and can't I do?
Interesting to read that the following is what the UK CAA said in reponse to the EASA proposals:
Thank you for providing your opinion.
The Agency has carefully reviewed your comment but came to the conclusion
not to introduce a specific requirement for the supervising instructor. The
training organisation is asked to nominate an instructor for this purpose which
will be in most of the cases one of the most experienced the ATO has available.
200 hours instruction time is not needed to fulfil this task as the unrestricted
instructor is allowed to instruct himself also without any additional supervision.
The Agency has carefully reviewed your comment but came to the conclusion
not to introduce a specific requirement for the supervising instructor. The
training organisation is asked to nominate an instructor for this purpose which
will be in most of the cases one of the most experienced the ATO has available.
200 hours instruction time is not needed to fulfil this task as the unrestricted
instructor is allowed to instruct himself also without any additional supervision.
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On the contrary, there is no reason to introduce an unworkable requirement for a supervising FI to be present at every location a restricted FI departs from.
The above is a perfect example of the problem.
Most people who have only experienced the UK system will have abig problem with the supervisor being on holidays and will focus all their attention on that as a clear example of not actually supervising (despite perhaps being in regular contact, and being aware of the issues the CAA likes raised).
People elsewhere will probably focus more on the "doing whatever I wanted" as being a better example of poor supervision no matter what the location of the supervisor. For me this is what jumps out as being poor rather than the fact they were not at the terminal bar enjoying their 5th pink of special brew = present at the aerodrome!!
and the third was ok with me doing whatever I wanted while he was on holiday for a week.
Most people who have only experienced the UK system will have abig problem with the supervisor being on holidays and will focus all their attention on that as a clear example of not actually supervising (despite perhaps being in regular contact, and being aware of the issues the CAA likes raised).
People elsewhere will probably focus more on the "doing whatever I wanted" as being a better example of poor supervision no matter what the location of the supervisor. For me this is what jumps out as being poor rather than the fact they were not at the terminal bar enjoying their 5th pink of special brew = present at the aerodrome!!
Well, I think that 'supervision' does indeed need to be more closely regulated - but not to the extent proposed by the UK CAA.
I have recommended the following to EASA:
(a) Supervising instructors shall hold unrestricted instructor ratings with
experience on the type or class of aircraft for which supervision is being
given, the syllabus/exercise being taught and the experience/limitations of
the individual he/she is supervising.
(b) Supervising instructors shall be nominated by the ATO.
(c) Supervising instructors should be present at the aerodrome during any
instructional flights conducted by holders of restricted flight instructor
certificates and shall be contactable without undue delay.
(d) Supervising instructors must be informed of any student solo flying and
be available to observe briefings conducted by, or student solo flights
authorised by, holders of restricted flight instructor certificates.
Not too demanding - and note that 'should', 'shall', 'must' are used in accordance with EASA vernacular usage.
I have recommended the following to EASA:
(a) Supervising instructors shall hold unrestricted instructor ratings with
experience on the type or class of aircraft for which supervision is being
given, the syllabus/exercise being taught and the experience/limitations of
the individual he/she is supervising.
(b) Supervising instructors shall be nominated by the ATO.
(c) Supervising instructors should be present at the aerodrome during any
instructional flights conducted by holders of restricted flight instructor
certificates and shall be contactable without undue delay.
(d) Supervising instructors must be informed of any student solo flying and
be available to observe briefings conducted by, or student solo flights
authorised by, holders of restricted flight instructor certificates.
Not too demanding - and note that 'should', 'shall', 'must' are used in accordance with EASA vernacular usage.
BEagle, for your third bullet to work we need to define "present at the aerodrome". On a quiet day, with only one FI and one FI(r) on duty, must the FI stay on the ground while the FI(r) is flying - if so there is additional cost to using FI(r)s. If the FI is allowed to be in the air, is this only in the circuit, or the local area ... or on a dual land-away? What happens if the FI is airborne and the FI(r) or their student blacks the runway? It's all a bit of a minefield in the real world.
When I'm formally supervising I regard it as simply being available for advice and dealing with first solos. I'm not sure that anything else is viable in reality.
I'll certainly "have a word" if anything looks a little out of line but I (and I expect most other experienced aviators) do that even when not supervising.
HFD
When I'm formally supervising I regard it as simply being available for advice and dealing with first solos. I'm not sure that anything else is viable in reality.
I'll certainly "have a word" if anything looks a little out of line but I (and I expect most other experienced aviators) do that even when not supervising.
HFD
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The whole problem with the "being present" is that almost everywhere outside the Uk has never had such a requirement. In some places prior to JAR-FCL the only instructor in a club who could authorise First Solos was also responsible for supervision of all other instructors and training activity at that club - the CFI. Organisations ijn those places will cite the lack of previous problems as a reason for not introducing a new "be present" requirement.
How can an organisation have a supervising FI present at aerodromes where navigation exercises may temporarily land during an exercise.
What if the restricted FI decides to divert - do they have to divert to an aerodrome where their organisation has pre-positioned an FI so that they have someone present when they arrrive.
In my experience organisations that apply the "be present" rule rush restricted FI's through to avoid what hfd correctly describes as extra expense and other related issues. Flight training safety and quality is actually worse as a result.
What is very important is to put something in place to firstly provide on-the-job training (line training if you like) for instructors in their first post, career development and proper supervision.
How can an organisation have a supervising FI present at aerodromes where navigation exercises may temporarily land during an exercise.
What if the restricted FI decides to divert - do they have to divert to an aerodrome where their organisation has pre-positioned an FI so that they have someone present when they arrrive.
In my experience organisations that apply the "be present" rule rush restricted FI's through to avoid what hfd correctly describes as extra expense and other related issues. Flight training safety and quality is actually worse as a result.
What is very important is to put something in place to firstly provide on-the-job training (line training if you like) for instructors in their first post, career development and proper supervision.
When I'm formally supervising I regard it as simply being available for advice and dealing with first solos.
If the FI is allowed to be in the air, is this only in the circuit...
or the local area ... or on a dual land-away?
What happens if the FI is airborne and the FI(r) or their student blacks the runway?
I have recommended the following to EASA:
You must realise that you are dealing with terminally narrow-minded bureaucrats who regard the 'stakeholders' as an unnecessary distraction. Future amendments to the Implementing Rules will not be subject to the NPA process, which is seen by the establishment as entirely negative and counter-productive.
Thank God, Greece and the rest of the PIIGS that the whole rotten edifice is about to come crashing down.
My comment was made following the CRD release and is in the current round of consultation responses which ends in a few days time.
European Economic Community ('Common Market') - fine idea. Single currency - I'm yet to be convinced. European Community superstate run by a European Parliament - no b£oody way. But Trust-me-Tone and Incapability Brown lied to us about the prospect of a referendum and the pooch has now been well and truly screwed....
European Economic Community ('Common Market') - fine idea. Single currency - I'm yet to be convinced. European Community superstate run by a European Parliament - no b£oody way. But Trust-me-Tone and Incapability Brown lied to us about the prospect of a referendum and the pooch has now been well and truly screwed....
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How can you supervise from another airfield to that of the FI(R).... as is what is happening at a school i know....
My understanding and that of our CFI was that if the "student" was a PPL licence holder then supervision was not necessary. However I can't find this in black and white any where.
An FIC instructor i've just spoken to also feels this is the case but again can't find a reference anywhere, going to try and get a more solid answer from the CAA.
However I can't find this in black and white any where.
JAR–FCL 1.325 FI(A) – Restricted privileges
(a) Restricted period. Until the holder of a
FI(A) rating has completed at least 100 hours
flight instruction and, in addition, has supervised
at least 25 student solo flights, the privileges of
the rating are restricted.
(b) Restrictions. The privileges are
restricted to carrying out under the supervision
of a FI(A) approved for this purpose:
(1) flight instruction for the issue of
the PPL(A) – or those parts of integrated
courses at PPL(A) level – and class and type
ratings for single-engine aeroplanes,
excluding approval of first solo flights by day
or by night and first solo navigation flights by
day or by night; and
(a) Restricted period. Until the holder of a
FI(A) rating has completed at least 100 hours
flight instruction and, in addition, has supervised
at least 25 student solo flights, the privileges of
the rating are restricted.
(b) Restrictions. The privileges are
restricted to carrying out under the supervision
of a FI(A) approved for this purpose:
(1) flight instruction for the issue of
the PPL(A) – or those parts of integrated
courses at PPL(A) level – and class and type
ratings for single-engine aeroplanes,
excluding approval of first solo flights by day
or by night and first solo navigation flights by
day or by night; and
Thats nothing I've seen schools using "instructors" without an instructor rating restricted or otherwise!
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JAR–FCL 1.325 FI(A) – Restricted privileges
(a) Restricted period. Until the holder of a
FI(A) rating has completed at least 100 hours
flight instruction and, in addition, has supervised
at least 25 student solo flights, the privileges of
the rating are restricted.
(b) Restrictions. The privileges are
restricted to carrying out under the supervision
of a FI(A) approved for this purpose:
(1) flight instruction for the issue of
the PPL(A) – or those parts of integrated
courses at PPL(A) level – and class and type
ratings for single-engine aeroplanes,
excluding approval of first solo flights by day
or by night and first solo navigation flights by
day or by night; and
(a) Restricted period. Until the holder of a
FI(A) rating has completed at least 100 hours
flight instruction and, in addition, has supervised
at least 25 student solo flights, the privileges of
the rating are restricted.
(b) Restrictions. The privileges are
restricted to carrying out under the supervision
of a FI(A) approved for this purpose:
(1) flight instruction for the issue of
the PPL(A) – or those parts of integrated
courses at PPL(A) level – and class and type
ratings for single-engine aeroplanes,
excluding approval of first solo flights by day
or by night and first solo navigation flights by
day or by night; and
So you watched a totally illegal flight that was uninsured! What did you do about it?
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....the privileges of the rating are restricted.
(b) Restrictions. The privileges are restricted to carrying out under the supervision of a FI(A).....
(b) Restrictions. The privileges are restricted to carrying out under the supervision of a FI(A).....
And to me!
So did you turn a Nelsonian eye or what?
Thats nothing I've seen schools using "instructors" without an instructor rating restricted or otherwise!
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So did you turn a Nelsonian eye or what?
Are you always this aggressive? looking through your posts on this thread I'd say that seems the case.
If this was SO clear how come 2 pages has now been devoted to discussion on it?
I'll wait for a reply from the flight crew licencing department or a CAA staff examiner thanks rather than speculating. In the mean time i'll make sure any restricted FI's I know are erring on the side of caution. No harm in that.
freon - you're totally outclassed. The clever thing to do now would be to quit while you're not too far behind. As for waiting for an answer from the flight crew licensing department (which, incidentally, doesn't exist - I suppose you mean the Licensing and Training Standards Department), you've already had it.
