SEP Renewal After 24 months.

[jgs43]

You could also add an "R" examiner to the list. These examiners are solely empowered to sign of the ratings on a PPL/NPPL if the revalidation has been done by experience.

Then you also have FIE's - Flying Instructor Examiners

Would really have to go read "the book" to recall if there are any others

[timzsta]

IRE and TRE spring to mind.

[Coffin Corner]

Sorry madlandrover but grace is a 2 way thing, there are ways of saying things and the way I was told is not the way to say it hence my reaction.
You don't have to dictate to me about making mistakes, I'm a good exponent of it

Yours is the first post to put it in any kind of legible context, I now know there's such thing as a "GR" so thanks for that,

[use man pitch trim]

When the PPL wishes to revalidate by experience the licence and CAA form will be signed by an examiner but not necessarily a SEP examiner.

The CAA will allow anyone with some form of examiner approval to do this e.g. airline TRE, flying club r/t examiner etc.

In the case of a revalidation, no flight test is required, the guy signing is merely checking the log book etc.

The requirement for a flight with an instructor is waived if the individual has undertaken a flight test of some form during the required period even on a different class or group of aircraft e.g. airline pilots flying SEP will usually undertake sim checks which absolve them from the instructor flight.

[ffranko]

Class Renew Jaa

Hello to all !

Can you help me with following?

I hold an FAA and ICAO CPL Licence with Instruments and Multi that is NOT valid for 10 years.

After deciding to RENEW it, I passed all the ATPL theory exams and now I am about to start the flying part.

I would like to understand, what, according to the JAR´s (JAR FCL 1…etc ), will I have to complete ( how many flight hours etc…) in order to get my CPL valid again, with MULTI and IFR.

Is renewing my SINGLE ENGINE CLASS enough ? What does that involve ?

for the TWIN part, I know I will have to complete a light MULTI ENGINE course (theory and flight), and I that I might integrate the IFR hours in my MULTI flight time.

But for having my CPL valid again, what else ??

Thanks !

Good flights.

[julian_storey]

I'm not absolutely sure that I understand your question?

If you have an FAA CPL & IR the conversion to JAA frozen ATPL is relatively straightforward.

You need to get a JAA Class 1 medical, pass the ATPL written exams (which it sounds as though you have) then for the CPL it's training as required and a skills test. Then for the IR conversion it's 15 hours plus a test.

Have I answered the right question?

[Keygrip]

ffranko - I appreciate that it's often difficult to express *exactly* what you mean when writing - but you've confused us (certainly me - and it would appear, Julian).

I hold an FAA and ICAO CPL

An FAA *is* an ICAO CPL, so can you tell us what, exactly, you have in terms of licences, experience and recency - then what, exactly, are you trying to achieve?

What contries are your licences from, how many hours flying what, how long ago, where did you do those recent exams?

If you don't want to say all this publicly, feel free to PM (then we'll switch to e-mail).

[ffranko]

Thanks! And I do agree with both of you!

It is even confusing to me….Expressing yourself in a different language is not an easy task!

Here I go again:

I got my CPL with MULTI and IR in the USA (FAA) in the 90`s and converted it later to a Portuguese ICAO licence.

That ICAO licence got expired about 10 years ago.

After deciding to RENEW my expired qualifications, I started with the THEORY PART by sitting and pass all ATPL Theory tests.

Now, what about the flying part according to JAR’s ?

For instance, will I need a cross-country navigation flight to RENEW my SINGLE ENGINE CLASS? What will I need to fly to sit for a skill test ?

Hope it is clearer now.

Thanks.

[ffranko]

Thanks! And I do agree with both of you!

It is even confusing to me….Expressing yourself in a different language is not an easy task!

Here I go again:

I got my CPL with MULTI and IR in the USA (FAA) in the 90`s and converted it later to a Portuguese ICAO licence.

That ICAO licence got expired about 10 years ago.

After deciding to RENEW my expired qualifications, I started with the THEORY PART by sitting and pass all ATPL Theory tests.

Now, what about the flying part according to JAR’s ?

For instance, will I need a cross-country navigation flight to RENEW my SINGLE ENGINE CLASS? What will I need to fly to sit for a skill test ?

Hope it is clearer now.

Thanks.

ffrankoView Public ProfileSend a private message to ffrankoFind More Posts by ffrankoAdd ffranko to Your Buddy List

[julian_storey]

I know nothing about Portuguese licensing, so we'll wait for someone to come along who does

[Keygrip]

Just passing - whilst thinking - but there may not *be* any Portugese licences anymore - they may be all JAA ones (albeit issued by the Portugese authorities).

Safest bet is to WRITE (or e-mail [which is also writing?]) to the Portugese authorities and ask THEM what they would want to see for renewals of any, or all, ratings and licences.

Get it in writing - NO telephone calls.

I could help with UK licences, I could help with JAA licences - but this is different. You need the *official* word.

=^..^=

<edit: typo>

[Whopity]

The fist question is did you get a Portuguese IR as well as the CPL? If you did then its quite easy, by taking the JAA theoretical exams all you will need to do is to pass the JAA CPL and IR Skill tests to get the licence reissued. Ideally as you held a Portuguese National licence it would be best to do it Portugal to save any complications.

If you did not hold a Portuguese IR then it will require more training to get the IR. You should really check the requirements in the country where you have taken the ATPL exams.

[ffranko]

Renewal

Thanks !

In 1996 we were not JAA yet.

You are right, all licences for JAA country remembers are now regulated by JAA. Finally a lot “mess” had to end…But it looks like there is still “some around”…

Yes I do have a cancelled IFR licence , as well as not valid CLASS and LIGHT MULTI.

All my ATPL theory exams are done.

I already did contact our authority and according to an INTERNAL CIRCULAR, after having a licence cancelled by more than 07 years ALL I need to do get current again is is regulated by:

JAR FCL 1.245 (f) 1,
JAR FCL 1.245 (f) 2 ,
JAR FCL1.240 & 1.295
APPENDIX 3 to JAR FCL 1.240
JAR FCL 1.261
JAR FCL 1.262

My “doubt/question” here has raised because an FTO is asking me to fly a VFR cross country navigation to get my MULTI ENGINE licence and IFR valid again…expecting that VFR navigation for my final exam as well.

It is strange for the SINGLE ENGINE renewal and even more strange for the MULTI RENEWAL…

According to our Authority and APPENDIX 3 to JAR FCL 1.240JAR 3 & 4, having completed SECTION 3B, which I did, I am NOT REQUIRED to complete SECTION 3A…

Any help ??

Regards,

[ffranko]

Thanks !

In 1996 we were not JAA yet.

You are right, all licences for JAA country remembers are now regulated by JAA. Finally a lot “mess” had to end…But it looks like there is still “some around”…

Yes I do have a cancelled IFR licence , as well as not valid CLASS and LIGHT MULTI.

All my ATPL theory exams are done.

I already did contact our authority and according to an INTERNAL CIRCULAR, after having a licence cancelled by more than 07 years ALL I need to do get current again is is regulated by:

JAR FCL 1.245 (f) 1,
JAR FCL 1.245 (f) 2 ,
JAR FCL1.240 & 1.295
APPENDIX 3 to JAR FCL 1.240
JAR FCL 1.261
JAR FCL 1.262

My “doubt/question” here has raised because an FTO is asking me to fly a VFR cross country navigation to get my MULTI ENGINE licence and IFR valid again…expecting that VFR navigation for my final exam as well.

It is strange for the SINGLE ENGINE renewal and even more strange for the MULTI RENEWAL…

According to our Authority and APPENDIX 3 to JAR FCL 1.240JAR 3 & 4, having completed SECTION 3B, which I did, I am NOT REQUIRED to complete SECTION 3A…

Any help ??

Regards,

[Keygrip]

ffranko - you have your answers, no?

The list of the JAA requirements is what the Portugese authorities want - what more can we say?

I *will* say that, according to the UK authorities, if renewing/revalidating an MEP for VFR only then the cross country must be completed, though it's only a 15 minute cruise anyway. If doing the MEP for IFR then the cross country is not required - exactly as you say, 3B compliance cancels 3A.

However, I flew VFR with a guy for SEP and IFR, the same day, for MEP. The relevant authorities - Swiss or Austrian (I forget which offhand) - rejected his MEP application, stating that he had not completed the VFR cross country.

I argued the 3B cancels 3A point, but the authorities were adamnant that he must do a cross country - despite their own paperwork very clearly saying that 3B cancels 3A.

It took a SERIOUS amount of arguing over many e-mails to get them to agree.

They finally accepted that 3B cancels 3A, their own paperwork said so, but mainly based on the fact that the candidate had done a VFR route earlier in the day in SEP and had done VFR work the day before in an MEP during refresher training with an FAA flight instructor.

True, the flight school maybe trying to get an extra hour out of you - but if you haven't flown for so long then you probably could do with it anyway.

The only answers that are relevant to you are those from the Portugese authorities, not from some well wishing contributor on PPRuNe who thinks that *they* are the fountain of all knowledge.

[ffranko]

Thanks for your comments !

Regards

[Cloud Chaser]

Not wanting to start another argument, but... I thought that a GR examiner was only authorised to mark theory papers.
Surely a class rating has to be signed by a FE or at the very least a CRE????

*Ducks for cover*

[jgs43]

"Not wanting to start another argument, but... I thought that a GR examiner was only authorised to mark theory papers.
Surely a class rating has to be signed by a FE or at the very least a CRE????"

Not if revalidating "by experience".
Even a lowly "R" examiner can sign in that case.

If revalidating by proficiency check, however, then it would need an FE

[RaffC]

UK JAR PPL SEP Revalidation

Hi

I have a UK JAR PPL. I fulfill the revalidation by flying experience requirements however, I am not in the UK and will not get hold of a UK FE to validate my logbook etc on time.

Can I get any JAR-FCL FE from any JAR member state (Swiss) to sign the Certificate of Revalidation page or, does it have to be a UK JAR-FCL FE?

(Only asking as sum bloke told me it must be a UK JAR-FCL FE)

Thanks in advance

[Keygrip]

Any JAA will do for UK authorities - but not neccessarily the other way round.