Not allowed to fly in UK due to the fact that my PPL was done abroad
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Not allowed to fly in UK due to the fact that my PPL was done abroad
Hi all, thought I might seek the views of some of you instructors on this, hope u dont mind.
Basically I hold a UK issued PPL which I gained over in Spain earlier this year from a CAA registered flying school, taught entirely by British instructors and examined by a British examiner.
I have however been told by a couple of flying schools that they will not let me hire out one of their planes due to my licence having been gained abroad. Apparently they have had "too many problems with foreign trained pilots before."
Whilst I can appreciate that some of the UK atc procedures might be a bit different to abroad, surely a check flight, as I believe is the norm anyway for new customers, would be enough to sort out any differences?
Is this kind of policy the norm throughout flying schools in the Uk, and if not what is the attitude of other schools to PPLs earned abroad?
Cheers
Basically I hold a UK issued PPL which I gained over in Spain earlier this year from a CAA registered flying school, taught entirely by British instructors and examined by a British examiner.
I have however been told by a couple of flying schools that they will not let me hire out one of their planes due to my licence having been gained abroad. Apparently they have had "too many problems with foreign trained pilots before."
Whilst I can appreciate that some of the UK atc procedures might be a bit different to abroad, surely a check flight, as I believe is the norm anyway for new customers, would be enough to sort out any differences?
Is this kind of policy the norm throughout flying schools in the Uk, and if not what is the attitude of other schools to PPLs earned abroad?
Cheers
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I'm not a UK FI and don't know the legal answer. But I know the moral answer.........
Tell them to stick their school where the sun don't shine and take your business elsewhere.
Tell them to stick their school where the sun don't shine and take your business elsewhere.
I can't understand their attitude.
All you should need is a check ride with one of their instructors who will then say whether or not he's happy for you to rent an aircraft.
All you should need is a check ride with one of their instructors who will then say whether or not he's happy for you to rent an aircraft.
Prejudice
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With BEagle on this one, cant understand their attitude - especially with a lot of clubs needing new members at the moment.
They are probably just upset that you didnt spend you PPL money with them so either ask if you do a club checkride with them and a couple of hours to adjust to the UK or take your money to another club - or join a group syndicate scheme.
J.
They are probably just upset that you didnt spend you PPL money with them so either ask if you do a club checkride with them and a couple of hours to adjust to the UK or take your money to another club - or join a group syndicate scheme.
J.
Unfortunately, a perfect example of the current prejudice against foreign trained pilots.
Sad and absolutely ridiculous to treat a potential customer this way.
Take your business elsewhere, this arrogance will cost them dearly in the long run.
Sad and absolutely ridiculous to treat a potential customer this way.
Take your business elsewhere, this arrogance will cost them dearly in the long run.
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Standard check ride as with any new hirer, maybe a bit extra on UK procedures and if they can do the do then job done.
One word sums up the schools you mentioned. Prejudice. Plain and simple.
KK
One word sums up the schools you mentioned. Prejudice. Plain and simple.
KK
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Sounds like cutting off their nose to spite their faces, after all if you are not up to their standard on the check ride it is more in their coffers training you to that level.
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Got to agree with everyone else on this. You hold a JAR pilot's licence so you can legally fly the aeroplane, I'd be happy to have your business subject to the usual checkout.
Happy landings
3 Point
Happy landings
3 Point
Dancing with the devil, going with the flow... it's all a game to me.
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Could be that due to past accidents (however minor) involving pilots trained abroad that their insurers have placed a restriction on them hiring out to foreign trained pilots? Just a thought....
My view is that they're losing out on potential business - must be that they don't need the money, apparently there're still a couple of clubs like that around these days, but not many I bet!
It is the flying club's perogative who they hire out to (insurers aside) and not many people in business turn down good money therefore my gut feeling is that their insurers have insisted upon this, however it's a new one on me and if I were the person who told you "sorry, no way...", I'd have made the reasons why very clear!
VFE.
My view is that they're losing out on potential business - must be that they don't need the money, apparently there're still a couple of clubs like that around these days, but not many I bet!
It is the flying club's perogative who they hire out to (insurers aside) and not many people in business turn down good money therefore my gut feeling is that their insurers have insisted upon this, however it's a new one on me and if I were the person who told you "sorry, no way...", I'd have made the reasons why very clear!
VFE.
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Got to agree with the above posts, normal check ride with an instructor required and if need be a bit of time on local procedures then off you go. Obviously schools not worth bothering with, i'm sure you will find plenty of other schools that will be happy to have your business.
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Prejudice yes, without a doubt.
Insurance reasons aside, there is an in-built prejudice against foreign trained pilots. One CFI told me recently, when I mentioned I was thinking of going to Florida to finish my ppl, that I would need another 5 to 10 hours minimum before he would let me loose in one of his planes.
This is part of the problem, and I know a lot of guys trained in the USA, and there are some very good schools out there. But this is a hangover from the old days when you coldn't get a JAA PPL in America, you got an FAA one and converted it when you got home.The standards were perceived as lower. And in addition, although there are good schools out there, there are also some sausage factories that only want your dollar. Standards at these schools are poor in the extreme, and the pilots they churn out are an "unsure of position" waiting to happen.
All that said, there are some greedy characters out there, who will string your training along a bit to make more dough.
I would suggest trying another club at the same airfield. As you trained under JAA in Spain, then a quick check ride should suffice, or at worst a couple of hours tuition to brush up your skills, and lets be fair, taking an instructor along for the ride now and again isnt a bad idea anyway!
Insurance reasons aside, there is an in-built prejudice against foreign trained pilots. One CFI told me recently, when I mentioned I was thinking of going to Florida to finish my ppl, that I would need another 5 to 10 hours minimum before he would let me loose in one of his planes.
This is part of the problem, and I know a lot of guys trained in the USA, and there are some very good schools out there. But this is a hangover from the old days when you coldn't get a JAA PPL in America, you got an FAA one and converted it when you got home.The standards were perceived as lower. And in addition, although there are good schools out there, there are also some sausage factories that only want your dollar. Standards at these schools are poor in the extreme, and the pilots they churn out are an "unsure of position" waiting to happen.
All that said, there are some greedy characters out there, who will string your training along a bit to make more dough.
I would suggest trying another club at the same airfield. As you trained under JAA in Spain, then a quick check ride should suffice, or at worst a couple of hours tuition to brush up your skills, and lets be fair, taking an instructor along for the ride now and again isnt a bad idea anyway!
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Originally Posted by BEagle
I can't understand their attitude.
All you should need is a check ride with one of their instructors who will then say whether or not he's happy for you to rent an aircraft.
All you should need is a check ride with one of their instructors who will then say whether or not he's happy for you to rent an aircraft.
Not so long ago you were very sure that you would never employ a JAA qualified instructor who was trained abroad.
If a pilot has a JAA licence then they are entitled to be treated exactly the same as any other JAA licence holder. Thus the school was discriminating by not letting you do a check flight before maing a decision regarding suitability.
Regards,
DFC
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Bit of old double standards BEagle.
Not so long ago you were very sure that you would never employ a JAA qualified instructor who was trained abroad.
Not so long ago you were very sure that you would never employ a JAA qualified instructor who was trained abroad.
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I'm currently in the process of checking out a JAA PPL holder who got his licence in America. Had only planned on an hour check ride doing some stalls, PFL's, steep turns and circuits, but have now flown two trips and need another one for some circuits. Hopefully then I will sign him off to use our aircraft.
I had no past experience or opinion of overseas training, but was slightly concerned when my student had never be taught about carb-heat and when stalling, decided to put in huge boot-fulls of rudder.
My student who got his licence only in May admits he needs these few extra hours to build his confidence and get used to UK airspace and procedures. In this case its a win-win situation where the student builds confidence and can hire our aircraft and we, the flying school get a new customer. Plus, I get to demo a PFL which is fun!!
I had no past experience or opinion of overseas training, but was slightly concerned when my student had never be taught about carb-heat and when stalling, decided to put in huge boot-fulls of rudder.
My student who got his licence only in May admits he needs these few extra hours to build his confidence and get used to UK airspace and procedures. In this case its a win-win situation where the student builds confidence and can hire our aircraft and we, the flying school get a new customer. Plus, I get to demo a PFL which is fun!!
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sir.pratt
You might wish to read the following.....
http://www.flycorvair.com/carbice.html
http://www.pilotfriend.com/articles/carbicing.htm
And if the stude learned on an injected 172, he should still have learned about the use of carb heat as a general topic.
You might wish to read the following.....
http://www.flycorvair.com/carbice.html
http://www.pilotfriend.com/articles/carbicing.htm
And if the stude learned on an injected 172, he should still have learned about the use of carb heat as a general topic.