RW Test Pilot Path?
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Joined: Dec 2013
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From: derp
RW Test Pilot Path?
Hi there.
I'm currently finishing up my physics degree and am very interested in a future as a RW pilot and maybe even test pilot. I haven't been able to find out that much about it, but here in the US it seems like the vast majority (at least for FW) of test pilots have a military background. What about for RW?
I ask because I don't want to go the military route (I actually did, briefly! I went to the US Air Force Academy but in the end decided it wasn't for me).
Either way, after college I intend on getting my masters in aeronautical engineering or flight test engineering. After that, I want to do my RW training (I already have my FW PPL and IR, so that should speed things up a bit) and fly. And I think I want to fly for at least a good 5-8 years or so before thinking about something else. But eventually I think I would like to do something more technical/academic/engineering-related and that's why I'm ultimately interested in being a test pilot. So I guess I could try to get hired as a FTE and--maybe with all of the RW experience I will have--I'll eventually be eligible to become a TP.
Does this seems like a reasonable path to becoming a test pilot? Would joining the military make things a lot easier for me if this is what I really want to do (while I'm not really interested in the US military anymore, I am a German citizen as well and have thought about joining the German military)?
Thank you for the information!
I'm currently finishing up my physics degree and am very interested in a future as a RW pilot and maybe even test pilot. I haven't been able to find out that much about it, but here in the US it seems like the vast majority (at least for FW) of test pilots have a military background. What about for RW?
I ask because I don't want to go the military route (I actually did, briefly! I went to the US Air Force Academy but in the end decided it wasn't for me).
Either way, after college I intend on getting my masters in aeronautical engineering or flight test engineering. After that, I want to do my RW training (I already have my FW PPL and IR, so that should speed things up a bit) and fly. And I think I want to fly for at least a good 5-8 years or so before thinking about something else. But eventually I think I would like to do something more technical/academic/engineering-related and that's why I'm ultimately interested in being a test pilot. So I guess I could try to get hired as a FTE and--maybe with all of the RW experience I will have--I'll eventually be eligible to become a TP.
Does this seems like a reasonable path to becoming a test pilot? Would joining the military make things a lot easier for me if this is what I really want to do (while I'm not really interested in the US military anymore, I am a German citizen as well and have thought about joining the German military)?
Thank you for the information!
Joined: Feb 2005
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From: Zummerset
TPW,
I'll be blunt. There are relatively few RW TP jobs available and several highly experienced and motivated graduates every year from the 'recognised' military flight test centres (such as ETPS, Pax, Edwards and EPNR) - therefore your chances of employment are vanishingly small IMHO. If the military is 'not for you' then your best chance would be to find an engineering job within a major defence company and hope they agree to sponsor you through a course such as ITPS. If it's your own money, consider a loan and do the ETPS FTE course. Either way, prepare for hard work and no guaranteed returns - your lack of military background will likely count against you.
I'll be blunt. There are relatively few RW TP jobs available and several highly experienced and motivated graduates every year from the 'recognised' military flight test centres (such as ETPS, Pax, Edwards and EPNR) - therefore your chances of employment are vanishingly small IMHO. If the military is 'not for you' then your best chance would be to find an engineering job within a major defence company and hope they agree to sponsor you through a course such as ITPS. If it's your own money, consider a loan and do the ETPS FTE course. Either way, prepare for hard work and no guaranteed returns - your lack of military background will likely count against you.
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From: UK
Probably an academic point, as I doubt that course has ever been in the reach, financially, of a private individual.
Seem to me that without a military background, TPW's proposed route is probably the only viable one. The odds will be small - but not zero. That route has been used in the fixed wing world by a few, and failure to quite make the last goal, still means he'd have done a lot of very rewarding work and flying en-route.
G
Seem to me that without a military background, TPW's proposed route is probably the only viable one. The odds will be small - but not zero. That route has been used in the fixed wing world by a few, and failure to quite make the last goal, still means he'd have done a lot of very rewarding work and flying en-route.
G
Do a Hover - it avoids G
Joined: Oct 1999
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From: Chichester West Sussex UK
TPW
I don't want to pour cold water on your ambition rather to offer a touch of reality as I see these things.
Being a tp of any sort means you have reached fairly well up the aviation totem pole.
As with any totem pole (running 100m better than most, being successful as a racing driver in F1 or NASCAR, or indeed any human endeavour you like to consider) you have to have a great deal of determination (bordering on obsession) to succeed - as well as the appropriate talents.
In my book this means you put your ambition in front of everything else in your life. You fully accept (and tell all concerned) that you will do anything asked of you to enhance your chances of success. In this case that would include showing everybody that you are an above average military pilot.
Sorry.
I don't want to pour cold water on your ambition rather to offer a touch of reality as I see these things.
Being a tp of any sort means you have reached fairly well up the aviation totem pole.
As with any totem pole (running 100m better than most, being successful as a racing driver in F1 or NASCAR, or indeed any human endeavour you like to consider) you have to have a great deal of determination (bordering on obsession) to succeed - as well as the appropriate talents.
In my book this means you put your ambition in front of everything else in your life. You fully accept (and tell all concerned) that you will do anything asked of you to enhance your chances of success. In this case that would include showing everybody that you are an above average military pilot.
Sorry.
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From: london, UK
Joined: Apr 2004
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From: UK
You could end up on mars. I think the Chinese are recruiting too...
F/o
Joined: Sep 2001
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From: UK
I am not sure who Shawn Coyle's source of information is about ETPS but I can assure eveyone that ETPS is most certainly still training FTEs on the fixed wing and rotary wing courses that it runs in the same manner that it has done for many years.
Also, JF has hit the nail on the head. To be a test pilot you need firstly to be a high ability, highly experienced pilot and if you are one of those then you need the right academic background as well. If a pilot does not have the requisite ability then he will not have the capacity to be able to undertake the testing tasks however good he is an an engineer.
Also, JF has hit the nail on the head. To be a test pilot you need firstly to be a high ability, highly experienced pilot and if you are one of those then you need the right academic background as well. If a pilot does not have the requisite ability then he will not have the capacity to be able to undertake the testing tasks however good he is an an engineer.
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From: UK
Fair and valid points made by LOMCEVAK.
A TP needs a high level of both flying ability and experience, and high engineering knowledge and ability. There's a small trade-off there, but only a small one.
Also, realistically, the TPs with an FTE background who have built their own flying experience will mostly never tackle the biggest and most complex test flying tasks as a TP. Given the size of the helicopter world in particular, that is extremely limiting. Most of us with that profile are part time, and exist in the light aviation world, not "heavy metal".
I believe that there may be a couple of engineer-background TPs at, for example, Robinsons - but the odds of landing such a job are incredibly small. And doubtless those TPs are as high ability as they should be for such a critical role.
If the OP is of an age and profile who could potentially join the German armed forces, that is almost certainly his best route if it's available. Most armed services these days are very amenable to good people pursuing additional technical qualifications alongside their main service roles, and Germany does put people through TPS - albeit few, and they both need to be very good, and have the right profile at the right time.
G
A TP needs a high level of both flying ability and experience, and high engineering knowledge and ability. There's a small trade-off there, but only a small one.
Also, realistically, the TPs with an FTE background who have built their own flying experience will mostly never tackle the biggest and most complex test flying tasks as a TP. Given the size of the helicopter world in particular, that is extremely limiting. Most of us with that profile are part time, and exist in the light aviation world, not "heavy metal".
I believe that there may be a couple of engineer-background TPs at, for example, Robinsons - but the odds of landing such a job are incredibly small. And doubtless those TPs are as high ability as they should be for such a critical role.
If the OP is of an age and profile who could potentially join the German armed forces, that is almost certainly his best route if it's available. Most armed services these days are very amenable to good people pursuing additional technical qualifications alongside their main service roles, and Germany does put people through TPS - albeit few, and they both need to be very good, and have the right profile at the right time.
G
Do a Hover - it avoids G
Joined: Oct 1999
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From: Chichester West Sussex UK
TPW
For examples of people doing the job at the moment have a look at
Test Pilot Tuesday - YouTube
As well as thinking about what they have to say look at their ages and their obvious quality as people.
I think we can be pretty sure they did not get where they are by saying
For examples of people doing the job at the moment have a look at
Test Pilot Tuesday - YouTube
As well as thinking about what they have to say look at their ages and their obvious quality as people.
I think we can be pretty sure they did not get where they are by saying
I ask because I don't want to go the military route (I actually did, briefly! I went to the US Air Force Academy but in the end decided it wasn't for me).
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 2013
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From: derp
Thanks for the detailed responses. I think I just need to spend some time figuring out what it is I want to do in the aviation world and whether or not I'm willing to make certain sacrifices to get there (I.e. going military).
Joined: May 2008
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From: Somerset
It's all about knowing the role!
All military TPs are selected after extensive military operational experience on the front line and many also have instructor qualifications. This means that they can work within a test team to provide credible role relation when determining whether a found deficiency is actually an issue in the role, or not. Most large helicopter manufacturers build a lot of military helicopters and don't have many TPs, they therefore usually go for ex military TPs. That said, extensive offshore experience and a civvy TP school qualification may work (expensive though!). EASA now have 2 classes of TP; Class A (experimental) and Class B (developmental) you will need to make sure any course you do is accredited or has grandfather rights.
