Mysterious case of the "missing" fuel!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 75
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Mysterious case of the "missing" fuel!
Seems that Mr Steve Fossett's solo round the world attempt with the Global Flyer may be in jeopardy due to what the operations team are calling "missing" fuel! The team are reporting that the aircraft has 15% less fuel than what it should actually have!!
Now here is a question for you guys.......How do you misplace fuel?!! I've misplaced my pants before but have never nor do I believe that I will ever be responsible for misplacing fuel!!! Why can't they just admit that the screwed up and actually say "well we actually put 15% less fuel than what we actually needed!"
Now here is a question for you guys.......How do you misplace fuel?!! I've misplaced my pants before but have never nor do I believe that I will ever be responsible for misplacing fuel!!! Why can't they just admit that the screwed up and actually say "well we actually put 15% less fuel than what we actually needed!"
Having been cold soaked at 45000ft for 36 hours, the remaining fuel must have shrunk at bit. I wonder if this has anything to do with the low fuel reading.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 75
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
brakedwell See.... that would be the most logical answer....but a part of me is thinking that surely they would have taken differences in temperatures at altitude into account!! I'm guessing that there would be some differences but would they be enough to make such a huge difference and put the whole attempt in jeopardy?
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Blighty - On secondment
Posts: 329
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
AVeight, where are the operations team are reporting about "missing" fuel! I have been monitoring progress on their website and there is nothing mentioned there or am I missing something......??
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 75
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Global Pilot Good afternoon....it's being reported on Sky news. The team need to make a decision within the next couple of hours on whether to proceed or not. The only way that it can now be done, it is reported, is with tail winds.
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
Well he has just coasted out over Japan, next option Hawaii, then press for Mexico or the USA.
His take off point was chosen in the centre of the USA to ensure that, even if he fell short, he would be overland with recovery options.
Two questions if anyone knows the figures. Will a 15% fuel deficit allow him to reach the west coast? If so, will it also allow the required distance to be covered, even if he does not reach his planned destination?
His take off point was chosen in the centre of the USA to ensure that, even if he fell short, he would be overland with recovery options.
Two questions if anyone knows the figures. Will a 15% fuel deficit allow him to reach the west coast? If so, will it also allow the required distance to be covered, even if he does not reach his planned destination?
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Near LOACH intersection
Posts: 497
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"Having been cold soaked at 45000ft for 36 hours, the remaining fuel must have shrunk at bit. I wonder if this has anything to do with the low fuel reading."
Temperature would not affect the reading if they are using the industry standard capacitance type indicating system. I would be surprised if Rutan designed anything else.
Temperature would not affect the reading if they are using the industry standard capacitance type indicating system. I would be surprised if Rutan designed anything else.
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Dublin
Posts: 105
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Does anybody know the number of main and or Aux fuel tanks on this A/C? or is it just one large Tank that holds the total fuel onboard?
I would hazard a guess that a fuel leak in one of the fuel tanks would account for the "Missing" Fuel altough if that were true surely ther would be a noticable Imbalance which would have to be Trmmed out. This application of Trim would go someway towards confirming the Fuel Leak Theory.
Also they no the total capacity of the Tanks. They know theUplift and Presumably the Burn so they should be able to work out the Total onboard which should match the Fuel Indicated. If not more than Likely you have a Leak as it is exterely unlikely to have bad indication on a New A/C
I would hazard a guess that a fuel leak in one of the fuel tanks would account for the "Missing" Fuel altough if that were true surely ther would be a noticable Imbalance which would have to be Trmmed out. This application of Trim would go someway towards confirming the Fuel Leak Theory.
Also they no the total capacity of the Tanks. They know theUplift and Presumably the Burn so they should be able to work out the Total onboard which should match the Fuel Indicated. If not more than Likely you have a Leak as it is exterely unlikely to have bad indication on a New A/C
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Rockytop, Tennessee, USA
Posts: 5,898
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
>>Does anybody know the number of main and or Aux fuel tanks on this A/C? or is it just one large Tank that holds the total fuel onboard?<<
According to the flurry of news reports today, it has 13 tanks (kinda like a Douglas or Lockheed airliner <g>).
According to the flurry of news reports today, it has 13 tanks (kinda like a Douglas or Lockheed airliner <g>).
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Rockytop, Tennessee, USA
Posts: 5,898
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Fuel - a big worry for Steve and the attempt
Mission Control have released a statement this morning regarding a loss of fuel in the early hours of Steve Fossett’s flight, which could lead to the attempt being abandoned.
There was a discrepancy of 2,600 pounds in readings between the fuel burn and a series of probes in the main beams of the Virgin Atlantic GlobalFlyer in the first three and a half hours of the flight.
During last night, Mission Control carried out various tests, but still know little as to why and how the problem occurred. Early flight fuel readings have been concluded to be ’not accurate’, and the lower reading of the amount of fuel onboard is the one that has been taken into account by the team for safety reasons.
Jon Karkow from Scaled Composites was unable to say whether it was due to leakage or evaporation. "We really don’t know what it is... It's more than likely a system issue, such as a fuel venting line. It's been very puzzling for us, and we saw it quite early on."
...The average tailwind speed needed for Steve to successfully complete the round the world circuit is 58 knots and so far they are relatively hopeful as the winds have been around this speed.
When this information was released at 14:00 UTC, Steve was already over 37 hours into the flight and had 5,500 pounds of fuel left.
In a couple of hours, Mission Control and Steve will have to decide whether is it safe to depart Japanese airspace for the Pacific Ocean, which is the largest ocean in the world and the most vunerable part of the route. The fuel will continue to be monitored closely up until this point and, if Steve decides he will attempt to cross the Pacific Ocean, another decision on the attempt's continuation will be made at about halfway across on approach to Hawaii...
http://www.virginatlanticglobalflyer...ues_update.jsp
Mission Control have released a statement this morning regarding a loss of fuel in the early hours of Steve Fossett’s flight, which could lead to the attempt being abandoned.
There was a discrepancy of 2,600 pounds in readings between the fuel burn and a series of probes in the main beams of the Virgin Atlantic GlobalFlyer in the first three and a half hours of the flight.
During last night, Mission Control carried out various tests, but still know little as to why and how the problem occurred. Early flight fuel readings have been concluded to be ’not accurate’, and the lower reading of the amount of fuel onboard is the one that has been taken into account by the team for safety reasons.
Jon Karkow from Scaled Composites was unable to say whether it was due to leakage or evaporation. "We really don’t know what it is... It's more than likely a system issue, such as a fuel venting line. It's been very puzzling for us, and we saw it quite early on."
...The average tailwind speed needed for Steve to successfully complete the round the world circuit is 58 knots and so far they are relatively hopeful as the winds have been around this speed.
When this information was released at 14:00 UTC, Steve was already over 37 hours into the flight and had 5,500 pounds of fuel left.
In a couple of hours, Mission Control and Steve will have to decide whether is it safe to depart Japanese airspace for the Pacific Ocean, which is the largest ocean in the world and the most vunerable part of the route. The fuel will continue to be monitored closely up until this point and, if Steve decides he will attempt to cross the Pacific Ocean, another decision on the attempt's continuation will be made at about halfway across on approach to Hawaii...
http://www.virginatlanticglobalflyer...ues_update.jsp
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: min rest
Posts: 424
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Sounds like a pilot error and warning letter job to me.
He needs to call movement control Gulf Air, fess up and seek their advice, of course it could take a month or two to arrive due meetings etc.
Guess it was another of thoes infamous min fuel flight plans.
He needs to call movement control Gulf Air, fess up and seek their advice, of course it could take a month or two to arrive due meetings etc.
Guess it was another of thoes infamous min fuel flight plans.
56 years ago today the first round-the-world-non-stop flight was completed by Capt James Gallagher and his 13-man USAF crew.
36 years ago today, Concorde made her maiden flight at Toulouse.
Good luck to Captain Fossett - hope the fuel management issue is resolved OK!
36 years ago today, Concorde made her maiden flight at Toulouse.
Good luck to Captain Fossett - hope the fuel management issue is resolved OK!
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 58
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Here's hoping he isn't navigating from the website. According to the "mission status" he's currently at LONGITUDE N33.26920 and LATITUDE E146.22875. Erm....something not quite right there, methinks.
Last edited by Cakov; 2nd Mar 2005 at 20:09.
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: London & Edinburgh
Age: 38
Posts: 646
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
For those who want an article link:BBC News Online
Cakov - the figure (00:47:10UTC hours) is the time he got airborne at the start of his flight ... UTC is another way of saying GMT or Zulu ....
next Stop: Hawaii
Jordan
Cakov - the figure (00:47:10UTC hours) is the time he got airborne at the start of his flight ... UTC is another way of saying GMT or Zulu ....
next Stop: Hawaii
Jordan
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: USA
Posts: 844
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Best of luck to the guy and his team.
I made this trip in the USAF back in 1990.
With many stops of course.
It took 8 days but was one of the best flights I ever had.
I hope the fuel problem is sorted out and he makes aviation history.
I made this trip in the USAF back in 1990.
With many stops of course.
It took 8 days but was one of the best flights I ever had.
I hope the fuel problem is sorted out and he makes aviation history.