Survey - Test Pilot and FTE Licensing
Moderator
Thread Starter
Survey - Test Pilot and FTE Licensing
There's a healthy debate going on in the "Test Flying .v. Flight Testing" thread which has led to a debate on the subject of whether TPs and FTEs should be licensed to practice.
So, since Pprunepost doesn't allow poll's any more, what I propose to do is simply ask the questions and let everybody post their answers. I suggest that detailed discussion is left to the other thread, since that will keep this easy to read. To avoid any accusations of trying to bias the debate, or even another well-deserved roasting from Lomcevac, I'll leave my own response to later - but will admit now that I have views !.
So, questions to the crewroom:-
(1) Should TPs be licenced?
(a) Only for military flight-test
(b) Only for civil flight test
(c) Both
(d) Neither
(2) Should FTEs be licensed?
(a) Only for military flight-test
(b) Only for civil flight test
(c) Both
(d) Neither
(3) If there were a licence.
(a) Should it be based entirely upon TPS graduation
(b) Should it be based entirely upon experience
(c) Should it require both
(d) Should it be based upon a sliding scale allowing for a range of combinations of TPS training, and professional experience.
(4) If there were a licence?
(a) Should it be totally separate to type qualifications.
(b) Should it be related to individual type qualifications.
(By this I mean, should a TP or FTE simply be licensed as a TP/FTE and be allowed to practice on any type that they are licensed / employed to work on (a), or should this licence be only for particular aircraft classes (b).)
(5) Should there be an independently administered exam system ?
(a) Only for non-TPS graduates
(b) Only for civil practice
(c) For everybody
(d) No.
I've made an asssumption here, which is that military TPS graduates have passed quite enough exams to practice in the military environment, and no further exam system would be considered appropriate. If anybody disagrees with me on this, by all means say so.
Wade in folks.
G
So, since Pprunepost doesn't allow poll's any more, what I propose to do is simply ask the questions and let everybody post their answers. I suggest that detailed discussion is left to the other thread, since that will keep this easy to read. To avoid any accusations of trying to bias the debate, or even another well-deserved roasting from Lomcevac, I'll leave my own response to later - but will admit now that I have views !.
So, questions to the crewroom:-
(1) Should TPs be licenced?
(a) Only for military flight-test
(b) Only for civil flight test
(c) Both
(d) Neither
(2) Should FTEs be licensed?
(a) Only for military flight-test
(b) Only for civil flight test
(c) Both
(d) Neither
(3) If there were a licence.
(a) Should it be based entirely upon TPS graduation
(b) Should it be based entirely upon experience
(c) Should it require both
(d) Should it be based upon a sliding scale allowing for a range of combinations of TPS training, and professional experience.
(4) If there were a licence?
(a) Should it be totally separate to type qualifications.
(b) Should it be related to individual type qualifications.
(By this I mean, should a TP or FTE simply be licensed as a TP/FTE and be allowed to practice on any type that they are licensed / employed to work on (a), or should this licence be only for particular aircraft classes (b).)
(5) Should there be an independently administered exam system ?
(a) Only for non-TPS graduates
(b) Only for civil practice
(c) For everybody
(d) No.
I've made an asssumption here, which is that military TPS graduates have passed quite enough exams to practice in the military environment, and no further exam system would be considered appropriate. If anybody disagrees with me on this, by all means say so.
Wade in folks.
G
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 62
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
OK, trying to think about this and answer without writing reams of reasoning, not easy but here my answers...
1) Both (ideally, but with great reservations about any bureaucratic system that may cause problems)
2) Both (again, ideally, but dependant on system put in place)
3) Based on sliding scale to allow for both TPS grads an the 'by experience' route.
4) Seperate to type qualification.
5) Not sure. Again depends on the system. Agree on Genghis' military TPS point, but what about when they leave the military?
1) Both (ideally, but with great reservations about any bureaucratic system that may cause problems)
2) Both (again, ideally, but dependant on system put in place)
3) Based on sliding scale to allow for both TPS grads an the 'by experience' route.
4) Seperate to type qualification.
5) Not sure. Again depends on the system. Agree on Genghis' military TPS point, but what about when they leave the military?
Sorry: plain language reply, G. I've been marking MCQA tests part of the day!
As a helicopter driver, I'd like a 'TP Rating' on my JAR licence that would cover me for all SE/ME types provided that I had a valid LPC on any aircraft type in each group. This would allow flight test, ferry, positioning and demonstration flying; I would not expect to exercise CAT privileges without a valid OPC for each aircraft type.
This would give some professional flexibility. Think the French have this sort of system in place under national regs.
Similar sort of thing for the plank drivers and FTEs. (FTEs to hold an FE licence?)
Graduate tps or those who had done suitable 'apprenticeship' to be accorded the licence privilege.
As a helicopter driver, I'd like a 'TP Rating' on my JAR licence that would cover me for all SE/ME types provided that I had a valid LPC on any aircraft type in each group. This would allow flight test, ferry, positioning and demonstration flying; I would not expect to exercise CAT privileges without a valid OPC for each aircraft type.
This would give some professional flexibility. Think the French have this sort of system in place under national regs.
Similar sort of thing for the plank drivers and FTEs. (FTEs to hold an FE licence?)
Graduate tps or those who had done suitable 'apprenticeship' to be accorded the licence privilege.
@idle stop
Under JAR-FCL we have a TP rating?! In some european countrys we have some national rules, but new on JAR - the company or development organisation is in charge for a specific training and skills of their pilots. OK a paper from one of the known TPS is right for the company, but no TP rating remarks on JAR licences.
I'm not shure if the mostly military guided and very expensive TPS program is right for the wide civil market. It's very good, but is it neccessary? Because of the raising costs for their training programs we will have in future nearly only retired military TPs. And that's not needed for the most civil and highly specialised developments. Why should a small civil development company hire an older retired military TP only for an Airforce TP degree and with small civil or special (software or sling load for example) experience? And how could get a younger highly civil educated engineer with civil flight licenses and no jet experience a degree from a TPS? How can a small development company pay the more than a half million bill, to train an own TP? Why we need for the certification from all additional stuff, including sling load systems a TP guided and flown test program? Thats to big cannons!
I'm an ex military helo driver and engineer but working now in the civil business.
Under JAR-FCL we have a TP rating?! In some european countrys we have some national rules, but new on JAR - the company or development organisation is in charge for a specific training and skills of their pilots. OK a paper from one of the known TPS is right for the company, but no TP rating remarks on JAR licences.
I'm not shure if the mostly military guided and very expensive TPS program is right for the wide civil market. It's very good, but is it neccessary? Because of the raising costs for their training programs we will have in future nearly only retired military TPs. And that's not needed for the most civil and highly specialised developments. Why should a small civil development company hire an older retired military TP only for an Airforce TP degree and with small civil or special (software or sling load for example) experience? And how could get a younger highly civil educated engineer with civil flight licenses and no jet experience a degree from a TPS? How can a small development company pay the more than a half million bill, to train an own TP? Why we need for the certification from all additional stuff, including sling load systems a TP guided and flown test program? Thats to big cannons!
I'm an ex military helo driver and engineer but working now in the civil business.
