My dream to be an aircraft engineer
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The approved Part 147 Cat A course is 800 hours; a typical approved course is 859 hours, with 490 theory, 252 practical and 117 OJT (ie structured training OJT, not hanging about in a hangar). This particular course would be accomplished in 24 working weeks. The extra hours are to allow for student absence and sickness.
Work experience acquired while using an A licence could count towards the work experience requirement for a B licence, if it was relevant, but I'm not certain that an A licence holder has a reduced work experience requirement for a B licence.
It should be possible to gain 3 years work experience as an A licence holder while getting the Modules for the B Licence. The Practical requirements could be covered in the same period.
By definition the work experience required for a B licence is carried out before the licence can be issued, and experience gained as an A licence holder is going to be more useful, probably, than experienced gained as an unlicensed mechanic.
As you say, going for an A licence and then B is a good route for some.
Edit: The requirement for work experience, moving from A1 to B1.1, is 2 years. Doing the B1.1 from scratch would need longer (3 years) if you do not do the full approved 2-year course. So it is true to say that having an A1 licence reduces the work experience requirement for the B1.1 licence, except in the unlikely case that the A licence holder does a full-time 2-year course for the B1.1 licence, when 2 years experience are needed instead of 3.
Incidentally, an A Licence holder can miss a few sections of the Module 7 and Module 10 of the B1.1 Modules, so there's another (very) small advantage!
Work experience acquired while using an A licence could count towards the work experience requirement for a B licence, if it was relevant, but I'm not certain that an A licence holder has a reduced work experience requirement for a B licence.
It should be possible to gain 3 years work experience as an A licence holder while getting the Modules for the B Licence. The Practical requirements could be covered in the same period.
By definition the work experience required for a B licence is carried out before the licence can be issued, and experience gained as an A licence holder is going to be more useful, probably, than experienced gained as an unlicensed mechanic.
As you say, going for an A licence and then B is a good route for some.
Edit: The requirement for work experience, moving from A1 to B1.1, is 2 years. Doing the B1.1 from scratch would need longer (3 years) if you do not do the full approved 2-year course. So it is true to say that having an A1 licence reduces the work experience requirement for the B1.1 licence, except in the unlikely case that the A licence holder does a full-time 2-year course for the B1.1 licence, when 2 years experience are needed instead of 3.
Incidentally, an A Licence holder can miss a few sections of the Module 7 and Module 10 of the B1.1 Modules, so there's another (very) small advantage!
Last edited by Capot; 18th Feb 2010 at 19:59.
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Ever thought about the RAF? Depends what your looking for but you'll be working on some awesome machines with the option of travel and a nice pension. Just a thought
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Blood / Sweat And Tears
Hi dani86, i totally understand where you are coming from and empathize with your situation, as i too took a change in career paths later on in my mid too late twenties and because of my age was not eligible for any grants/funding to assist with my studies.
Very frustrating for people wanting too better themselves, and some individuals in the past have told me,"I should have decided on what i wanted too do along time ago", but unfortunately we are not all blessed with school teachers that have their pupils best interests at heart, i wanted too work with aircraft from a young age but ended up doing something totally different, but that said that is all in the past.
All i can say is do not give up, i found studying for my licence financially stressful and challenging, i had no help from family or the banks (as the bank could not understand the concept of people maintaining aircraft, so turned down my career development loan, thankyou Barclays.)
It will not be easy by no means, but if you are determined too do it then you will suceed, if i can make it then anybody else with the right frame of mind can, develop a plan of action, formulate costs involved, get a part time job, week-ends for obvious reasons of studying in the week, and expect to have the social life of a hibernating shrew.
And most importantly of all, expect nothing, so that whatever comes your way will be an added bonus, whether it will be financial/educational.
Alot of people in this industry have worked their socks off too get here, and that makes us all more resilient, it is just bad timing that the industry is going through a severe correction at present,but as like most things in life, the cycle when begin too turn and regenerate, but WHEN is the 64 million dollar question.
All i can say is,alot of people including myself have gotten through too the bitter end,so develop your plan of action and implement it, some people do get bitter in this industry because companies do treat their staff unfairly, but that said i personally think it is the most rewarding career i am working within, i thoroughly enjoy what i do, and some of the people you meet on your travels will entertain you with their experiences within the industry.
And remember the aviation world is a very small one, so expect to bump into old friends from time to time.
I wish you all the best.
Very frustrating for people wanting too better themselves, and some individuals in the past have told me,"I should have decided on what i wanted too do along time ago", but unfortunately we are not all blessed with school teachers that have their pupils best interests at heart, i wanted too work with aircraft from a young age but ended up doing something totally different, but that said that is all in the past.
All i can say is do not give up, i found studying for my licence financially stressful and challenging, i had no help from family or the banks (as the bank could not understand the concept of people maintaining aircraft, so turned down my career development loan, thankyou Barclays.)
It will not be easy by no means, but if you are determined too do it then you will suceed, if i can make it then anybody else with the right frame of mind can, develop a plan of action, formulate costs involved, get a part time job, week-ends for obvious reasons of studying in the week, and expect to have the social life of a hibernating shrew.
And most importantly of all, expect nothing, so that whatever comes your way will be an added bonus, whether it will be financial/educational.
Alot of people in this industry have worked their socks off too get here, and that makes us all more resilient, it is just bad timing that the industry is going through a severe correction at present,but as like most things in life, the cycle when begin too turn and regenerate, but WHEN is the 64 million dollar question.
All i can say is,alot of people including myself have gotten through too the bitter end,so develop your plan of action and implement it, some people do get bitter in this industry because companies do treat their staff unfairly, but that said i personally think it is the most rewarding career i am working within, i thoroughly enjoy what i do, and some of the people you meet on your travels will entertain you with their experiences within the industry.
And remember the aviation world is a very small one, so expect to bump into old friends from time to time.
I wish you all the best.
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Engineer Help
With reference to your post, never ever give up hope etc and try to fulfill your dreams. I started as a Ground Support Mechanic, Aircraft Mechanic, Flight Engineer and now Senior First Officer/Chief Engineer.
It can be done etc and its not an easy road, know your basic mechanics, Learn a trade and become versatile. Try not to upset too many people as its a small world.
Send me a PM I can maybe couch you in some areas I know a lot of people and recently got 2 18 year old 4 year fixed courses with EASA 66 at the end.
It can be done etc and its not an easy road, know your basic mechanics, Learn a trade and become versatile. Try not to upset too many people as its a small world.
Send me a PM I can maybe couch you in some areas I know a lot of people and recently got 2 18 year old 4 year fixed courses with EASA 66 at the end.
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Hi Dani86
I understand the situation that you are in at the moment. I really appreciate how difficult it is setting off in an industry such as this. I am in a similar situation to yourself. I have also worked for no salary over the past year in an organisation gaining "on the tools" experience. I must say I have really enjoyed my time learning this way. It was a fantastic opportunity and I have enjoyed every minute of it. (I will choose this opportunity to say thanks to the guys that have put so much effort in, as I know they are enthusiastic readers of this website!)
I studied engineering when I was at school/college and I thought it was a great way of learning the basics. I believe it's a good foundation to start learning for a career in engineering. I then studied for the Part 66 modules and I am currently working towards applying for an A Licence with ambitions to be a full B2 sometime in the future. I will say now that I don't believe I am a hotshot engineer either. I want to work my way up and prove my worth too. I also agree that experience is one of the most important criteria for this job. But I do believe that a combination of the engineering foundation via academia as well as "on the tools" experience goes hand in hand.
Due to the current economic downturn, we are all quite aware of the current job market. It is such a shame that the downturn has affected the aviation industry quite so seriously. As I am regularly told, now is the worst time to have chosen to start a career in what is already a difficult industry to get into! But I don't think anyone predicted this would of happened!
If I did, I wouldn't of started when I did!
Which leaves you with the option of trying to join an apprenticeship. I have also applied for some with the same response of being too over qualified! It is difficult to please all employers.
If I was to pass on any advice that was said to me, it would be to keep trying. Positivity and enthusiasm is everything. I work every minute I can gaining experience as I am particularly passionate about this job and I am determined to better myself. You learn something new everyday. As famously said in my workplace, "everyone deserves a break". And I am sure your efforts will eventually pay off. It's just now may not be the time for us.
One thing I should of got more experience in was making the tea.
I am rubbish at that. Got to start somewhere! 
I understand the situation that you are in at the moment. I really appreciate how difficult it is setting off in an industry such as this. I am in a similar situation to yourself. I have also worked for no salary over the past year in an organisation gaining "on the tools" experience. I must say I have really enjoyed my time learning this way. It was a fantastic opportunity and I have enjoyed every minute of it. (I will choose this opportunity to say thanks to the guys that have put so much effort in, as I know they are enthusiastic readers of this website!)
I studied engineering when I was at school/college and I thought it was a great way of learning the basics. I believe it's a good foundation to start learning for a career in engineering. I then studied for the Part 66 modules and I am currently working towards applying for an A Licence with ambitions to be a full B2 sometime in the future. I will say now that I don't believe I am a hotshot engineer either. I want to work my way up and prove my worth too. I also agree that experience is one of the most important criteria for this job. But I do believe that a combination of the engineering foundation via academia as well as "on the tools" experience goes hand in hand.
Due to the current economic downturn, we are all quite aware of the current job market. It is such a shame that the downturn has affected the aviation industry quite so seriously. As I am regularly told, now is the worst time to have chosen to start a career in what is already a difficult industry to get into! But I don't think anyone predicted this would of happened!
If I did, I wouldn't of started when I did!Which leaves you with the option of trying to join an apprenticeship. I have also applied for some with the same response of being too over qualified! It is difficult to please all employers.
If I was to pass on any advice that was said to me, it would be to keep trying. Positivity and enthusiasm is everything. I work every minute I can gaining experience as I am particularly passionate about this job and I am determined to better myself. You learn something new everyday. As famously said in my workplace, "everyone deserves a break". And I am sure your efforts will eventually pay off. It's just now may not be the time for us.
One thing I should of got more experience in was making the tea.
I am rubbish at that. Got to start somewhere!
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Reading through this topic has proved very useful as this is something ive been thinking of a while. Im in a slightly different situation where i would have to totally retrain as i am currently a senior technical analyst in IT. Ive been looking at doing either one of these
Marshall Aerospace - Adult Re-training
or
IR PART-66 (self study)
Is this is the best route to take?
Thanks
Marshall Aerospace - Adult Re-training
or
IR PART-66 (self study)
Is this is the best route to take?
Thanks
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Hi Starbuck123
I don't know if you have spoken to Marshall Aerospace already if you are looking to start this year but I was told they are not running the Adult Re-training program due to not enough applicants! Which I find really hard to believe in this current climate! I am not sure of your age but as for other apprenticeships, you may not fall within the age bracket. You may also be too overqualified! Hence why I looked at the Adult Re-training program.
As for the self study route, unless you have previous aircraft experience such as a Military background, starting off might prove to be difficult. Especially at the moment as many people trying to start a career are having to work for free to make an impression. The disadvantage in your situation is that being a senior technical analyst I should imagine is a well paid job! You would probably take a huge cut in salary while retraining and starting off. I really think there is no stability at the moment especially when it comes to job security as well. A case in point is the unfortunate demise of the SR Technics Diamond Hangar at Stansted.
I can only speak from the frontline of my personal experience over the past year or so. As I previously mentioned to Dani86, all of this efforts will eventually pay off but as for the near future, it certainly looks bleak.
It's a real disappointment.
I don't know if you have spoken to Marshall Aerospace already if you are looking to start this year but I was told they are not running the Adult Re-training program due to not enough applicants! Which I find really hard to believe in this current climate! I am not sure of your age but as for other apprenticeships, you may not fall within the age bracket. You may also be too overqualified! Hence why I looked at the Adult Re-training program.
As for the self study route, unless you have previous aircraft experience such as a Military background, starting off might prove to be difficult. Especially at the moment as many people trying to start a career are having to work for free to make an impression. The disadvantage in your situation is that being a senior technical analyst I should imagine is a well paid job! You would probably take a huge cut in salary while retraining and starting off. I really think there is no stability at the moment especially when it comes to job security as well. A case in point is the unfortunate demise of the SR Technics Diamond Hangar at Stansted.
I can only speak from the frontline of my personal experience over the past year or so. As I previously mentioned to Dani86, all of this efforts will eventually pay off but as for the near future, it certainly looks bleak.
It's a real disappointment.
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Dani
I walked away in the dark ages, so others have much better tech info than i. we used to use valves then, remember them?
But, 2 things i suggest:-
don't do the free work thing. you are not doing yourself or anyone else any good. you will come to realise in this in time.
Also, it is always easier to find work when you are employed, not sure why, just is. then you can network and steer towards your goal.
Good luck.
But, 2 things i suggest:-
don't do the free work thing. you are not doing yourself or anyone else any good. you will come to realise in this in time.
Also, it is always easier to find work when you are employed, not sure why, just is. then you can network and steer towards your goal.
Good luck.
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There are many worthwhile sites around for engineers. A not so well known but useful which has many links to other sites is http://amengineer.webs.com/
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Im sorry to say that bro but i'd have to agree with 400_hertz's first post .
you picked the absolute wrong path right from the start and i believe your qualification only authorizes you to go for designer level or careers as such .
I can feel from the way you talk that you're quite an intelligent person and you're quite keen to work . alas you made a mistake .
So what to do now, make it up , carry on plugging away and apply for an A license and then you'll definitely find a job , then work for the required amount of time in a part 145 approved organisation ( i believe in the uk they're all part 145 approved ) and then apply for an exemption off the basic training curriculum since you already hold a degree thats almost of equivalent standard and then go straight for the CAA exams and get your b2 or b1 whatever suits your preference .
Then im pretty sure that your situation will improve a big much and you'll have a better opportunity to be hired.If not in your country you have all over the world !!
I wish you the best of luck bro!
you picked the absolute wrong path right from the start and i believe your qualification only authorizes you to go for designer level or careers as such .
I can feel from the way you talk that you're quite an intelligent person and you're quite keen to work . alas you made a mistake .
So what to do now, make it up , carry on plugging away and apply for an A license and then you'll definitely find a job , then work for the required amount of time in a part 145 approved organisation ( i believe in the uk they're all part 145 approved ) and then apply for an exemption off the basic training curriculum since you already hold a degree thats almost of equivalent standard and then go straight for the CAA exams and get your b2 or b1 whatever suits your preference .
Then im pretty sure that your situation will improve a big much and you'll have a better opportunity to be hired.If not in your country you have all over the world !!
I wish you the best of luck bro!
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God help us,no wonder the industry is totally boloxed in this country people being prepared work for zilch for the privilige of getting skydrol in your eyes and a piece of locking wire through your finger,.... amazing
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Smudgethecat
With respect, in your opinion, what is the best method of getting a "foot in the door"?
Many people didn't on purposely choose to start a career at this time foreseeing a economic downturn. As previously stated, this industry is notoriously difficult to become part of. I can't see how you can prove your worth without showing a company your enthusiasm or professionalism. From what I have found, the only way you can have this opportunity is by offering your services for free. In some respects it is beneficial for yourself as well as the company. It obviously could not be a long term choice but I can not see other ways of gaining that vital experience that is required.
I can not speak for every person who desires to be a Mechanic or Technician because it would be unfair to guess their skills or knowledge. As some may not be destined for this industry. With respect, I think it would surely be unfair to suggest that the nature of the industry has been, as you put it, "boloxed" in this country because people want to have a good career for the rest of their life. It is very easy for some to say disheartening comments towards others because they have already "made it" in their career. There is no reason to say people have worked any less than others to be where they are. They just deserve a break or at least one chance. Everyone was in the same position once before.
With respect, in your opinion, what is the best method of getting a "foot in the door"?
Many people didn't on purposely choose to start a career at this time foreseeing a economic downturn. As previously stated, this industry is notoriously difficult to become part of. I can't see how you can prove your worth without showing a company your enthusiasm or professionalism. From what I have found, the only way you can have this opportunity is by offering your services for free. In some respects it is beneficial for yourself as well as the company. It obviously could not be a long term choice but I can not see other ways of gaining that vital experience that is required.
I can not speak for every person who desires to be a Mechanic or Technician because it would be unfair to guess their skills or knowledge. As some may not be destined for this industry. With respect, I think it would surely be unfair to suggest that the nature of the industry has been, as you put it, "boloxed" in this country because people want to have a good career for the rest of their life. It is very easy for some to say disheartening comments towards others because they have already "made it" in their career. There is no reason to say people have worked any less than others to be where they are. They just deserve a break or at least one chance. Everyone was in the same position once before.
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People did not i suspect show much interest in marshals scheme to retrain due to the derisory salaries marshals pay, your better off at tescoes or picking turnips
I would however urge anyone thinking of changing careers to think very carefuly about aircraft maintenance ,the industry is in a severe downturn and the market is awash with well qualified engineers and mechanics , i was only talking to someone at monarch today and he informed and they are sacking over 50 per cent of their base staff due to lack of third party work , couple that with the lay offs at SR technics at STN and DUB and your talking hundreds of people from two companies alone, it wil be a long long time before these people are absorbed in the market, so if your a wannabie hoping to break into the industry unlessyour very lucky your going to have a very long wait im afraid
I would however urge anyone thinking of changing careers to think very carefuly about aircraft maintenance ,the industry is in a severe downturn and the market is awash with well qualified engineers and mechanics , i was only talking to someone at monarch today and he informed and they are sacking over 50 per cent of their base staff due to lack of third party work , couple that with the lay offs at SR technics at STN and DUB and your talking hundreds of people from two companies alone, it wil be a long long time before these people are absorbed in the market, so if your a wannabie hoping to break into the industry unlessyour very lucky your going to have a very long wait im afraid
Last edited by simonchowder; 5th Mar 2010 at 10:50.
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No problem. I guess the key to remember is that there are others in the same situation. The answer may be in how you approach the problem with enthusiasm and determination to succeed.Keep fighting. We will get there!
