handy hits on how to become an engineer!!
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handy hits on how to become an engineer!!
Hello, could anyone point me in the right direction on becoming an engineer. I am in the middle of joining the RAF but would like to know all my posibilites. Am 22 so not to sure what other options are available or who would take an older student on.
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Hi
Hi
I guess the first thing to do is to trawl through websites like
Safety Regulation Group | Safety Regulation , European Aviation Safety Agency - easa.europa.eu and also Aircraft Engineers Bulletin Board - Powered by vBulletin
These would give you an indication as How to go about being an engineer
Licenses are broadly categorised as B1(Airframe and Engines) and B2 (Avionics.... from Aviation Electronics)
1.There are two routes to choose from
a. If you are mechanically inclined then the license to go for is B1
b. If you have an interest in electronics,wires and stuff then B2
I personally think that in due course, you would need to hold both, so its a good thing to have that in mind while you start out.
2. You need to do a few exams (approximately 12....depending on the category chosen)
3.You would then need to prove that you have aviation related practical experience (This could vary from 3-5 years, based on your background)
I hope the above helps
Most importantly along the way you will have to learn to have the right attitude and operate with integrity, dont listen to the all the gloom and gloom, always aim to be good at what you do and pass on your knowledge to others.
It is a great career and lots of pathways to progress
All the best
I guess the first thing to do is to trawl through websites like
Safety Regulation Group | Safety Regulation , European Aviation Safety Agency - easa.europa.eu and also Aircraft Engineers Bulletin Board - Powered by vBulletin
These would give you an indication as How to go about being an engineer
Licenses are broadly categorised as B1(Airframe and Engines) and B2 (Avionics.... from Aviation Electronics)
1.There are two routes to choose from
a. If you are mechanically inclined then the license to go for is B1
b. If you have an interest in electronics,wires and stuff then B2
I personally think that in due course, you would need to hold both, so its a good thing to have that in mind while you start out.
2. You need to do a few exams (approximately 12....depending on the category chosen)
3.You would then need to prove that you have aviation related practical experience (This could vary from 3-5 years, based on your background)
I hope the above helps
Most importantly along the way you will have to learn to have the right attitude and operate with integrity, dont listen to the all the gloom and gloom, always aim to be good at what you do and pass on your knowledge to others.
It is a great career and lots of pathways to progress
All the best
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An apprenticeship is probably the 'easiest' way to become an engineer as you will be in employment after completion in most cases. There used to be an age limit for apprentices, but as far as I know it was removed. Virgin, Monarch, Ryanair, Flybe, Thomas Cook and KLM all offer apprenticeships.
Or there is the option of going to a college that do courses for Cat A or B1/B2, such as Kingston or LRTT.
Also, you can study for the licence modules and take the exams in your own time and out of your own pocket.
Or there is the option of going to a college that do courses for Cat A or B1/B2, such as Kingston or LRTT.
Also, you can study for the licence modules and take the exams in your own time and out of your own pocket.
Last edited by jpoth06; 18th Mar 2010 at 21:16.
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Also, you can study for the licence modules and take the exams in your own time and out of your own pocket.
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Stick with the route you're going down - join the RAF (I assume in an engineering trade).
Good training, good experiences, excellent grounding for becoming a civvie aircraft engineer in the future, you'll make friends that will be with you for the rest of your life to name but a few of the reasons to do it.
On the downside there will be detachments away from home on a regular basis that can / will affect home life.
At 22 years, getting an apprenticeship will be very, very difficult - no funding from government to the employer for a Modern Apprenticeship.
Going down the college / ab initio training route gives you the theoretical knowledge (at your own expense and it is not cheap) but almost zero practical, hands-on experience that employers want and need. There are many, many people who have gone down this road only to find nobody will employ them and they give up on the industry with a few years of their lives wasted and their bank account rooked.
Join the RAF, stick in, learn, have fun and do your licences before leaving in a few years time.
Good training, good experiences, excellent grounding for becoming a civvie aircraft engineer in the future, you'll make friends that will be with you for the rest of your life to name but a few of the reasons to do it.
On the downside there will be detachments away from home on a regular basis that can / will affect home life.
At 22 years, getting an apprenticeship will be very, very difficult - no funding from government to the employer for a Modern Apprenticeship.
Going down the college / ab initio training route gives you the theoretical knowledge (at your own expense and it is not cheap) but almost zero practical, hands-on experience that employers want and need. There are many, many people who have gone down this road only to find nobody will employ them and they give up on the industry with a few years of their lives wasted and their bank account rooked.
Join the RAF, stick in, learn, have fun and do your licences before leaving in a few years time.
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An apprenticeship is by far the best way to go if you want to work in civvie street.
You could join the RAF and get experience this way but from what I remember the CAA dont class this as great experience (Im not saying that working in the RAF is a bad form of training). If you look on airmech there is bound to be at least 1 question still running from a services guy looking at doing some work in civil to get his experince for his licences as the CAA are not recognising his time in the RAF.
Having said that, the RAF looks quite a nice option at the minute if you dont mind sand, as most airlines are trying to cut costs....
Then there is the final question
Planks or Whirly gigs
You could join the RAF and get experience this way but from what I remember the CAA dont class this as great experience (Im not saying that working in the RAF is a bad form of training). If you look on airmech there is bound to be at least 1 question still running from a services guy looking at doing some work in civil to get his experince for his licences as the CAA are not recognising his time in the RAF.
Having said that, the RAF looks quite a nice option at the minute if you dont mind sand, as most airlines are trying to cut costs....
Then there is the final question
Planks or Whirly gigs
While the CAA might not think much of military experience in respect of dispensations towards a licence, the major operators will have a different view.
We are still seeing so called engineers coming out of civil ab initio training schools with licence modules completed who can't tell a spanner from a toilet brush.
The training and experience you get in the services army, navy or airforce cannot be bettered even in these austere times.
If I had the choice I would take the military engineer every time and support him through the licence process.
We are still seeing so called engineers coming out of civil ab initio training schools with licence modules completed who can't tell a spanner from a toilet brush.
The training and experience you get in the services army, navy or airforce cannot be bettered even in these austere times.
If I had the choice I would take the military engineer every time and support him through the licence process.
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I completely agree with you regards the ab-initio route. Whilst there may be some decent guys coming from these establishments they generally lack hands on experience.
If you do an apprenticeship with a major airline, working on civil aircraft and do your licences either during or after, surely they would be more employable than a leaver from the services who hadnt finished their licences and hadnt worked in civil. An apprentice that has worked on airliners would be at a great advantage to somebody who had only worked fast jets for instance.
Im not saying the services are bad, just that apprenticeships offer the years of experience the CAA require and acknowledge. A good apprenticeship will enable you to work in every area and even post apprenticeship you still learn every day.
If you do an apprenticeship with a major airline, working on civil aircraft and do your licences either during or after, surely they would be more employable than a leaver from the services who hadnt finished their licences and hadnt worked in civil. An apprentice that has worked on airliners would be at a great advantage to somebody who had only worked fast jets for instance.
Im not saying the services are bad, just that apprenticeships offer the years of experience the CAA require and acknowledge. A good apprenticeship will enable you to work in every area and even post apprenticeship you still learn every day.
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i have been told that virgin wouldnt even consider taking female's on for an apprenticeship- however am not sure on this and there is other airlines. Thankyou all so much for your excellent advice,i now have many things to think about
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Originally Posted by miss-cook
i have been told that virgin wouldnt even consider taking female's on for an apprenticeship- however am not sure on this and there is other airlines. Thankyou all so much for your excellent advice,i now have many things to think about
They wouldn't be allowed to discriminate you against your sex.
Last edited by jpoth06; 18th Mar 2010 at 21:15.
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mrmagooo,
If I may pick up your point re the CAA not accepting RAF experience. Rotary, transport and Nimrod people were acceptable from the experience requirement for a pressurised airframe licence. I am prepared to stand corrected, but 100 years ago I remember a presentation given by a CAA man to this effect, and of course nothing stays the same in aviation.
If I may pick up your point re the CAA not accepting RAF experience. Rotary, transport and Nimrod people were acceptable from the experience requirement for a pressurised airframe licence. I am prepared to stand corrected, but 100 years ago I remember a presentation given by a CAA man to this effect, and of course nothing stays the same in aviation.
Good quality apprenticeships are now few and far between in the UK and Ireland.
Foe example look at how the scheme run by FLS in Dublin worked. Apprentices would work their way round the various workshops, composite, engine, undercarriage, structures e.t.c then they would go to the heavy maintenance hangar. The line operation was for the future.
Most of the heavy maintenance has now gone, line maintenance does not have the time to give apprentices the training they need.
If anyone wants a guaranteed training background with the required time and money spent go military. Civil apprentices are not immune to redundancy. As they are non productive they are a tempting target for the short term bean counters who have run out of orders for paperclips to cancel.
While BA might still run a quality scheme I have doubts about some of the others.
The quality of military training is fairly consistent and provided you stay the course the end result is more or less guaranteed.
If you end up on a poor quality civilian course you will have no redress and the time you have invested will be wasted.
IfI was young again today I would go back in to the military training system. I never regretted joining and also never regretted leaving. I will always be grateful to the military who provided me with the training to have a 30 year career in civil aviation as a licensed engineer.
Foe example look at how the scheme run by FLS in Dublin worked. Apprentices would work their way round the various workshops, composite, engine, undercarriage, structures e.t.c then they would go to the heavy maintenance hangar. The line operation was for the future.
Most of the heavy maintenance has now gone, line maintenance does not have the time to give apprentices the training they need.
If anyone wants a guaranteed training background with the required time and money spent go military. Civil apprentices are not immune to redundancy. As they are non productive they are a tempting target for the short term bean counters who have run out of orders for paperclips to cancel.
While BA might still run a quality scheme I have doubts about some of the others.
The quality of military training is fairly consistent and provided you stay the course the end result is more or less guaranteed.
If you end up on a poor quality civilian course you will have no redress and the time you have invested will be wasted.
IfI was young again today I would go back in to the military training system. I never regretted joining and also never regretted leaving. I will always be grateful to the military who provided me with the training to have a 30 year career in civil aviation as a licensed engineer.
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Beancounters will not get rid of apprenticeships in tough times for 2 main reasons. One being the awful publicity but mainly the ammount of funding it will lose from the government virtually makes it a nonsense idea. Proper modern apprenticeships did/do involve money from the government to subsidise the apprentice.
As for nimrod and other such experinced guys, I havent heard of this personally as it isn't aircraft on the civil register, hence I see more than a few connies working weekends to get experience in the civil sector. The training in the mob does give you the benefit of only needing 1 or 2 years exp rather than 5 but if you have all your licences you still need that 1/2 years on civil, that you would already have had if you had done an apprenticeship
As for nimrod and other such experinced guys, I havent heard of this personally as it isn't aircraft on the civil register, hence I see more than a few connies working weekends to get experience in the civil sector. The training in the mob does give you the benefit of only needing 1 or 2 years exp rather than 5 but if you have all your licences you still need that 1/2 years on civil, that you would already have had if you had done an apprenticeship
My suggestion that the bean counters might see the apprentice as an easy target was not a good example of what I was trying to get at.
In tough times bases and operations close. The civilian apprentice has no guarantee of continued employment. A good employer would try to place them elsewhere within the company or industry. Tough thing to do at the moment.
Apprentices being made redundant has certainly happened in the past and could happen again.
The lack of humanity shown by some UK employers beggers belief. In conversation I recently mentioned an avionics engineer I knew who gave up a job in the south moved to Aberdeen with his familly and was made redundant within a week. A second engineer listening to the conversation who's background I was not familiar with then told me he had been involved in the same redundancy package with the same major UK operator in almost identical circumstances.
I doubt that a bit of bad publicity affects this type of hire and fire mentality.
In tough times bases and operations close. The civilian apprentice has no guarantee of continued employment. A good employer would try to place them elsewhere within the company or industry. Tough thing to do at the moment.
Apprentices being made redundant has certainly happened in the past and could happen again.
The lack of humanity shown by some UK employers beggers belief. In conversation I recently mentioned an avionics engineer I knew who gave up a job in the south moved to Aberdeen with his familly and was made redundant within a week. A second engineer listening to the conversation who's background I was not familiar with then told me he had been involved in the same redundancy package with the same major UK operator in almost identical circumstances.
I doubt that a bit of bad publicity affects this type of hire and fire mentality.
