Stupid Design Award
Guest
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Award would have to go to all the folks who design where to put terminal blocks, and connectors on just about every airframe known to man. As an avionics type, I have the distinct pleasure of trying to find and access afore mentioned items.
Design Engineer: " Lets not put an access panel here, that way,the poor sod who needs to get to the wing root disconnects will have to tear the entire interior apart. (snicker)"
And, who is the genius who decided to put the elevator servo , for a Dash-8, UNDER the air cycle machine. Next time I call him to replace it!!
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"You want it on the gate for when???"
[This message has been edited by Maint99 (edited 18 October 2000).]
Design Engineer: " Lets not put an access panel here, that way,the poor sod who needs to get to the wing root disconnects will have to tear the entire interior apart. (snicker)"
And, who is the genius who decided to put the elevator servo , for a Dash-8, UNDER the air cycle machine. Next time I call him to replace it!!
--------------------------------------------
"You want it on the gate for when???"
[This message has been edited by Maint99 (edited 18 October 2000).]
Guest
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I forgot another one. The WIU (Wire Integration Unit) on the 747-400. Ugh. Has anyone else had to go in and change wire wraps for an upgrade? Has anyone else found unseated pins in the back of this marvel? How do you like torqueing a four inch diameter wire bundle in order to gain access? This is another area Douglas got right with the DC-10 and its use of terminal blocks.
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redtail,
Your post brought back bad memories. A few years ago, I went to change a 727-100 brake on a quick turn, and after I pulled the tire off, there was 2 crescent shaped safty bars holding the heads of the bolts. All the bolt heads were safety wired to the bar. This brake was all bolts (12 I think), no guide studs. Needless to say, there was a mx delay on that one.
[This message has been edited by HateThe8 (edited 18 October 2000).]
Your post brought back bad memories. A few years ago, I went to change a 727-100 brake on a quick turn, and after I pulled the tire off, there was 2 crescent shaped safty bars holding the heads of the bolts. All the bolt heads were safety wired to the bar. This brake was all bolts (12 I think), no guide studs. Needless to say, there was a mx delay on that one.
[This message has been edited by HateThe8 (edited 18 October 2000).]
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Although this does not relate to aircraft it is applicable to some of the postings on this thread.
Many years ago I was techrep on the Atlas Ballistic Missile. When the launch pads were about to be turned over to the Air Force the Tech Manuals had to be validated.
In the process of doing this, we found that what was in the manuals in no way resembled what was on the launch pad. Also, none of the equipment worked the way is was supposedly designed to do. We brought these problems up to our Air Force superiors and we made a recommendation. The Air Force followed our recommendation and the engineers and tech writers were directed to report to Vandenberg AFB and under our direction they were made to work on the equipment that they had either designed or wrote about in the manuals. This went on for a month and the writers and engineers returned to San Diego and it took several months to get things sorted out.
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The Cat
Many years ago I was techrep on the Atlas Ballistic Missile. When the launch pads were about to be turned over to the Air Force the Tech Manuals had to be validated.
In the process of doing this, we found that what was in the manuals in no way resembled what was on the launch pad. Also, none of the equipment worked the way is was supposedly designed to do. We brought these problems up to our Air Force superiors and we made a recommendation. The Air Force followed our recommendation and the engineers and tech writers were directed to report to Vandenberg AFB and under our direction they were made to work on the equipment that they had either designed or wrote about in the manuals. This went on for a month and the writers and engineers returned to San Diego and it took several months to get things sorted out.
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The Cat
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"Many years ago I was techrep on the Atlas Ballistic Missile."
Lu, that was about the time I was busy being born. I have always heard good things about Convair and their engineering, as well as generally liking the CV580. How did they impress you? Ever go to the Atlas sites in upstate NY?
Lu, that was about the time I was busy being born. I have always heard good things about Convair and their engineering, as well as generally liking the CV580. How did they impress you? Ever go to the Atlas sites in upstate NY?
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To: Red Tail,
As far as engineering at Convair is concerned it went south when they designed the 880 and 990. If you want to address inaccessability, then the Convair Jets are at the very top. When flying on an 880 you might notice that the wing skin is smooth and not pocked marked with access panels. On the return flight you might notice access panels all over the place. On the 880 and I assume on the 990 the designers installed hydraulic drive and other mechanical components for the flight control and fuel systems but there were no access panels for maintenance of these units. If something failed the mechanic had to cut a hole in the wing skin either on the top or bottom and in the process, Convair had to engineer the structural fix to repair the hole that had to be made in order to gain access to the failed component.
On many occasions when they were testing the 880 they would land and when they activated the thrust reversers the engines would blow heavy black sooty smoke and it would be ingested into the two inboard engines shutting them down. These two engines provided the hydraulic power for the brakes and the brakes would not operate very well because they had limited stopping power from the accumulator. Once the aircraft stopped it was towed back to the end of the runway and they would take off again. This problem I assume was solved before the 880 went into service.
Regarding the engineering at Convair Astronautics, the builder of the Atlas, it was pretty good. The management however totally sucked. Convair had four different aircraft programs going when they got the contract to build the Atlas. Those programs were the 880 and 990 and the F102 and F106. They felt that the Atlas would be lower in producing income for the company so the aircraft division unloaded all of the dead wood in their management structure onto the Astronautics division. All four aircraft programs eventually bit the dust and the company laid off all of their management instead of placing them in the Astronautics division and getting rid of the bad managers. When the Astronautics division was founded they Gave the Presidency to a comparitive unknown in the aircraft industry. The main reason he was hired was that the company felt that he would work well with the Air Force. This mans' main qualification was that in WW2 he dropped a bomb on a Japanese Battleship killing a high ranking Admiral. As a manager, he too sucked, and as the program matured the Air Force shared these same feelings.
Although the Atlas had some teething problems it proved to be fairly reliable as Ballistic Missiles are concerned. It turned out that way not because of management but, in spite of management.
Regarding my working at Plattsburg, NY I had the chance and I turned it down for two reasons. I didn't want to work in a hole in the ground and I felt that upstate NY sucked.
Now, I live in Quebec about 80 miles as the crow flies from Plattsburg. I could kick my butt for not taking the oppotunity as the area is fantastic. However if I had done so my life would have changed and I wouldn't be where I am, married to a lovely Quebec lady.
Any more war stories.
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The Cat
[This message has been edited by Lu Zuckerman (edited 19 October 2000).]
[This message has been edited by Lu Zuckerman (edited 19 October 2000).]
[This message has been edited by Lu Zuckerman (edited 19 October 2000).]
As far as engineering at Convair is concerned it went south when they designed the 880 and 990. If you want to address inaccessability, then the Convair Jets are at the very top. When flying on an 880 you might notice that the wing skin is smooth and not pocked marked with access panels. On the return flight you might notice access panels all over the place. On the 880 and I assume on the 990 the designers installed hydraulic drive and other mechanical components for the flight control and fuel systems but there were no access panels for maintenance of these units. If something failed the mechanic had to cut a hole in the wing skin either on the top or bottom and in the process, Convair had to engineer the structural fix to repair the hole that had to be made in order to gain access to the failed component.
On many occasions when they were testing the 880 they would land and when they activated the thrust reversers the engines would blow heavy black sooty smoke and it would be ingested into the two inboard engines shutting them down. These two engines provided the hydraulic power for the brakes and the brakes would not operate very well because they had limited stopping power from the accumulator. Once the aircraft stopped it was towed back to the end of the runway and they would take off again. This problem I assume was solved before the 880 went into service.
Regarding the engineering at Convair Astronautics, the builder of the Atlas, it was pretty good. The management however totally sucked. Convair had four different aircraft programs going when they got the contract to build the Atlas. Those programs were the 880 and 990 and the F102 and F106. They felt that the Atlas would be lower in producing income for the company so the aircraft division unloaded all of the dead wood in their management structure onto the Astronautics division. All four aircraft programs eventually bit the dust and the company laid off all of their management instead of placing them in the Astronautics division and getting rid of the bad managers. When the Astronautics division was founded they Gave the Presidency to a comparitive unknown in the aircraft industry. The main reason he was hired was that the company felt that he would work well with the Air Force. This mans' main qualification was that in WW2 he dropped a bomb on a Japanese Battleship killing a high ranking Admiral. As a manager, he too sucked, and as the program matured the Air Force shared these same feelings.
Although the Atlas had some teething problems it proved to be fairly reliable as Ballistic Missiles are concerned. It turned out that way not because of management but, in spite of management.
Regarding my working at Plattsburg, NY I had the chance and I turned it down for two reasons. I didn't want to work in a hole in the ground and I felt that upstate NY sucked.
Now, I live in Quebec about 80 miles as the crow flies from Plattsburg. I could kick my butt for not taking the oppotunity as the area is fantastic. However if I had done so my life would have changed and I wouldn't be where I am, married to a lovely Quebec lady.
Any more war stories.
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The Cat
[This message has been edited by Lu Zuckerman (edited 19 October 2000).]
[This message has been edited by Lu Zuckerman (edited 19 October 2000).]
[This message has been edited by Lu Zuckerman (edited 19 October 2000).]
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Stupid Design Award Nominee:
Beech 1900 windsheild wiper actuator; the maint manual has no resemblance to the actual access. It should read as follows: remove the cockpit bulkhead, remove the seats, lay on your back with your head between rudder pedals, spread your legs, have someone kick you in the crotch (hard), actuator should now be visible, if you had your hands up behind instrument panel prior to receiving kick, you might be able to change the failed actuator.
Beech 1900 windsheild wiper actuator; the maint manual has no resemblance to the actual access. It should read as follows: remove the cockpit bulkhead, remove the seats, lay on your back with your head between rudder pedals, spread your legs, have someone kick you in the crotch (hard), actuator should now be visible, if you had your hands up behind instrument panel prior to receiving kick, you might be able to change the failed actuator.
