Silly Question !
Moderator
Joined: Feb 2000
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
Posts: 14,480
Likes: 178
From: UK
Ultimately it's somebody's capabilities that make them an Engineer, not a specific route to that point. Similarly, it's somebody's abilility to do a job that results in them being authorised as a signatory, not whether they fit any particular mould of qualifications, experience, etc.
It just happens that a lot of Engineers, and signatories, have Engineering degrees. Many others have completed long and tough apprenticeships or equivalent courses. More importantly, the vast majority of them have years of relevant experience in the job during which they've proved their worth.
There is of-course a third breed, those who build them in the first place. Wherever I've worked, they've been called "craftsmen" or "fitters" but I imagine there are a lot of other job titles around the world.
I understand that the people who built and maintained the Titanic were far better qualified than those who built Noah's arc.
G
It just happens that a lot of Engineers, and signatories, have Engineering degrees. Many others have completed long and tough apprenticeships or equivalent courses. More importantly, the vast majority of them have years of relevant experience in the job during which they've proved their worth.
There is of-course a third breed, those who build them in the first place. Wherever I've worked, they've been called "craftsmen" or "fitters" but I imagine there are a lot of other job titles around the world.
I understand that the people who built and maintained the Titanic were far better qualified than those who built Noah's arc.
G
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 133
Likes: 0
From: Canada
Someone who signs off a minor mod is an Engineer?
I guess my Mom is a doctor then. She's great at affixing bandages....
I'm not sure how it works in your particular country, but here in Canada, aircraft maintenance personnel are allowed to sign off minor modifications in accordance with "acceptable" data. Acceptable data (as defined by the CARS) is not approved data. So that whole argument of "tech equals engineer because he performs engineer functions" doesn't hold water here. I assume your airworthiness system is similarily administered?
I guess my Mom is a doctor then. She's great at affixing bandages....
I'm not sure how it works in your particular country, but here in Canada, aircraft maintenance personnel are allowed to sign off minor modifications in accordance with "acceptable" data. Acceptable data (as defined by the CARS) is not approved data. So that whole argument of "tech equals engineer because he performs engineer functions" doesn't hold water here. I assume your airworthiness system is similarily administered?
Cunning Artificer
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,125
Likes: 7
From: The spiritual home of DeHavilland
Depends on your definition of 'Minor', STC.
A five foot by four foot hole in a pressurised fuselage is pretty nasty, the repair is beyond SRM limits, yet it may be classified as minor. The repair design is a bit more complicated than affixing bandage, though and an 8110-3 is an 8110-3 at the end of the day...
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Through difficulties to the cinema
A five foot by four foot hole in a pressurised fuselage is pretty nasty, the repair is beyond SRM limits, yet it may be classified as minor. The repair design is a bit more complicated than affixing bandage, though and an 8110-3 is an 8110-3 at the end of the day...
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Through difficulties to the cinema
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 133
Likes: 0
From: Canada
An 8110-3 is signed by a DER. Not an AMT. It is a statement of compliance, not a statement of conformity.
AMTs are responsible for conformity to approved data and typically sign 337 forms. DERs are responsible for compliance to airworthiness standards and sign 8110-3 forms. We have similar forms in Canada (Mod reporting form and AE-100)
By the way....there is no way in hell that a 4x5 foot hole in a pressure vessel that isn't covered in the SRM is a "minor" modification or repair. Not only that, but the tech doing a such a repair needs a special rating. In Canada the limit is for holes over 6 inches.
Am I missing something in your explaination Blacksheep?
AMTs are responsible for conformity to approved data and typically sign 337 forms. DERs are responsible for compliance to airworthiness standards and sign 8110-3 forms. We have similar forms in Canada (Mod reporting form and AE-100)
By the way....there is no way in hell that a 4x5 foot hole in a pressure vessel that isn't covered in the SRM is a "minor" modification or repair. Not only that, but the tech doing a such a repair needs a special rating. In Canada the limit is for holes over 6 inches.
Am I missing something in your explaination Blacksheep?
