Possible New Airline before Xmas !!!
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Possible New Airline before Xmas !!!
This article has appeared in the Singaporean newspaper 'The Business Times' and also in the Sydney newspaper ' The Sunday Telegraph' Page 7
July 21, 2002
SIA preparing to enter Aussie domestic market: report
SYDNEY - A Singapore Airlines-backed consortium is preparing to enter the lucrative but failure-strewn Australian domestic aviation market, a Sydney newspaper reported today.
The Sunday Telegraph said Singapore Airlines (SIA) would underwrite the new airline, which aims to be flying by Christmas.
The move would challenge Qantas, which now has about 80 per cent of the domestic market following the collapse of Ansett last year, and Virgin Blue, the successful discount carrier launched by British tycoon Sir Richard Branson in 2000.
Since the collapse of Air New Zealand-owned Ansett, the Star Alliance group of airlines, including SIA, has lacked a presence in the Australian domestic market, denting its tourist numbers.
A spokesman for SIA told the newspaper the company was "keeping its domestic options open" and was not ruling out any proposals.
The newspaper quoted an industry source as saying plans for the safety certificate needed to operate in Australian skies was well advanced.
"These guys have their paperwork ready to go, they can be in the air by Christmas," he said.
The new airline, which is yet to be named, would initially fly new Boeing and Airbus jets on the Sydney-Melbourne, Sydney-Brisbane routes, with some additional Canberra services.
Later expansion plans include Perth and Adelaide, the newspaper reported.
A vital consideration is understood to be the old Ansett terminal in Sydney airport, with SIA worried it will be frozen out if Qantas and Virgin Blue occupy the bulk of the facility.
"We are sending a strong signal that while we might be able to get the planes and the passengers, you've got to have somewhere to park your planes," the SIA spokesman said.
July 21, 2002
SIA preparing to enter Aussie domestic market: report
SYDNEY - A Singapore Airlines-backed consortium is preparing to enter the lucrative but failure-strewn Australian domestic aviation market, a Sydney newspaper reported today.
The Sunday Telegraph said Singapore Airlines (SIA) would underwrite the new airline, which aims to be flying by Christmas.
The move would challenge Qantas, which now has about 80 per cent of the domestic market following the collapse of Ansett last year, and Virgin Blue, the successful discount carrier launched by British tycoon Sir Richard Branson in 2000.
Since the collapse of Air New Zealand-owned Ansett, the Star Alliance group of airlines, including SIA, has lacked a presence in the Australian domestic market, denting its tourist numbers.
A spokesman for SIA told the newspaper the company was "keeping its domestic options open" and was not ruling out any proposals.
The newspaper quoted an industry source as saying plans for the safety certificate needed to operate in Australian skies was well advanced.
"These guys have their paperwork ready to go, they can be in the air by Christmas," he said.
The new airline, which is yet to be named, would initially fly new Boeing and Airbus jets on the Sydney-Melbourne, Sydney-Brisbane routes, with some additional Canberra services.
Later expansion plans include Perth and Adelaide, the newspaper reported.
A vital consideration is understood to be the old Ansett terminal in Sydney airport, with SIA worried it will be frozen out if Qantas and Virgin Blue occupy the bulk of the facility.
"We are sending a strong signal that while we might be able to get the planes and the passengers, you've got to have somewhere to park your planes," the SIA spokesman said.
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Read the above Sunday paper version Airtart.
A number of factors are going to play heavily into this.
Firstly Singapore Airlines backed.
This company although on the improve financially has made some woeful investments of late,Air New Zealand costing them a mint and their 49% of Virgin Atlantic which although now profitable has cost them alot more money than they anticipated.
Each of the above has left Dr Cheong with egg on his face.
The collapse of Ansett and re-nationalisation of Air NZ left him with a severe loss of face also.
His job and every move is under heavy scrutinsation - just read the Asia Wall St Journal if you get the chance.
This start up operation will be a very expensive venture if only to fill a minor gap in the Start Alliance network.Worth it I ask you say?
Terminal access will be interesting and I know for a fact that Chris Corrigan and the VB team along with Geoff Dixon at Qantas will be both united in lobbying strongly against these guys.
My money is with the incumbents and if this new mob is to get access to the old Golden wing lounge the new owners of Sydney Airport will make sure they pay a pretty penny for the priviledge.
Combine this with the fact that alot of Australians have been severly soured by the loss of their Frequent Flyer Points and will think twice in the future about spending money with these guys doesnt bode well.
I hardly expect this supposed start up operator to start a non sustainable air fare war either.
Experience has taught them the consequences.
A number of factors are going to play heavily into this.
Firstly Singapore Airlines backed.
This company although on the improve financially has made some woeful investments of late,Air New Zealand costing them a mint and their 49% of Virgin Atlantic which although now profitable has cost them alot more money than they anticipated.
Each of the above has left Dr Cheong with egg on his face.
The collapse of Ansett and re-nationalisation of Air NZ left him with a severe loss of face also.
His job and every move is under heavy scrutinsation - just read the Asia Wall St Journal if you get the chance.
This start up operation will be a very expensive venture if only to fill a minor gap in the Start Alliance network.Worth it I ask you say?
Terminal access will be interesting and I know for a fact that Chris Corrigan and the VB team along with Geoff Dixon at Qantas will be both united in lobbying strongly against these guys.
My money is with the incumbents and if this new mob is to get access to the old Golden wing lounge the new owners of Sydney Airport will make sure they pay a pretty penny for the priviledge.
Combine this with the fact that alot of Australians have been severly soured by the loss of their Frequent Flyer Points and will think twice in the future about spending money with these guys doesnt bode well.
I hardly expect this supposed start up operator to start a non sustainable air fare war either.
Experience has taught them the consequences.
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Lobbying - the Minister for Qantas
You are so correct TIMMEEE
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Terminal access will be interesting and I know for a fact that Chris Corrigan and the VB team along with Geoff Dixon at Qantas will be both united in lobbying strongly against these guys.
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who you gonna call??????????
___________________________________________________
Terminal access will be interesting and I know for a fact that Chris Corrigan and the VB team along with Geoff Dixon at Qantas will be both united in lobbying strongly against these guys.
____________________________________________________
who you gonna call??????????
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The new owners of Sydney Airport are also involved in negotiations over terminal space, not only with VB and QF, but with a third, as yet unnamed party.
These negotiations seem to revolve around the suggestion that the "old finger" AN gates should be multi user, with companies paying for gates on an individual utilisation basis.
The reality is that it is only a matter of time before someone else has a go at a full service carrier to continue a star alliance presence. This would be essential if ANZ changed to One World as a result of a QF share interest.
I gather the aircraft, finance, crews are not an issue, but until terminal access is sorted out, no one is going anywhere on this.
It is also possible that VB will tie up with this new carrier to provide discount on carriage from the complete star alliance network.
Now that will make QF sit up and think.
These negotiations seem to revolve around the suggestion that the "old finger" AN gates should be multi user, with companies paying for gates on an individual utilisation basis.
The reality is that it is only a matter of time before someone else has a go at a full service carrier to continue a star alliance presence. This would be essential if ANZ changed to One World as a result of a QF share interest.
I gather the aircraft, finance, crews are not an issue, but until terminal access is sorted out, no one is going anywhere on this.
It is also possible that VB will tie up with this new carrier to provide discount on carriage from the complete star alliance network.
Now that will make QF sit up and think.
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TIMMEEE
Regarding any angst against the old AN frequent flyer program, a lot of customers are also mightily pissed off with the arrogance of QF and the way they (the customers) have been treated since the AN collapse.
Just as a small example, look at how many QF FF points were needed to fly MEL SYD last September compared to now. It has at least doubled.
Service standards have also been reduced in both Y and J domestic . This is what happens in a monopoly situation.
Within OZ, QF have done very well over the last twelve months, but Dixon must surely by now be factoring the probability of some more assertive competition into future company projections.
Regarding any angst against the old AN frequent flyer program, a lot of customers are also mightily pissed off with the arrogance of QF and the way they (the customers) have been treated since the AN collapse.
Just as a small example, look at how many QF FF points were needed to fly MEL SYD last September compared to now. It has at least doubled.
Service standards have also been reduced in both Y and J domestic . This is what happens in a monopoly situation.
Within OZ, QF have done very well over the last twelve months, but Dixon must surely by now be factoring the probability of some more assertive competition into future company projections.
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airbrake I think you have it the wrong way around. VB has much lower costs than QF, therefore being able to cope better with discounting, (although there pockets arent as deep) and this new start up will be targeting the premium end of the market which QF currently monopolise. They wont be targeting the area of the market that VB predominately have. Just my thoughts
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I have heard rumours that Qantas ground staff(ie check-in) have been holding small union meetings around the country(one was held in BNE yesterday), as they are concerned that Qantas will move them to Australian Airlines when it starts operations. They are concerned because Australian does not have all the perks they now get with Qantas mainline.
It appears Qantas is trying to reduce it's costs in the domestic market and maybe gearing up for battle again with a new airline.
It appears Qantas is trying to reduce it's costs in the domestic market and maybe gearing up for battle again with a new airline.
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The Singaporeans are remaining tight lipped,and are trying to fob the media off, however it seems they have been very busy the last few months.
This from www.news.com.au
Plans by Virgin and Qantas to lease the two Ansett terminal piers have been complicated by Singapore Airlines' renewed interest in potential domestic terminal access in Australia.
The airport corporation confirmed yesterday it had talked with Singapore about plans for the former Ansett terminal.
This from www.news.com.au
Plans by Virgin and Qantas to lease the two Ansett terminal piers have been complicated by Singapore Airlines' renewed interest in potential domestic terminal access in Australia.
The airport corporation confirmed yesterday it had talked with Singapore about plans for the former Ansett terminal.
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games
Perhaps it suits SYD to be claiming there may be a 3rd entrant. They would be after a total common user with hourly rate on gates etc.
And perhaps SIN ground handling people are in Oz to look at a joint venture with Patricks?
And perhaps SIN ground handling people are in Oz to look at a joint venture with Patricks?
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Strobes On - some very valid points but this posting was never about standards of service.
The service on all airlines deteriorates to some extent with expansion in size.
The point I made about the bitter pill swallowed by those countless tens of thousands that were frequent flyers and lost everything will never be forgotten.Thats a fact and they are quite active about mentioning it in the "letters to the editor" columns.
Not to mention those businesses/individuals that had paid anything up to 10 years membership of the Golden Wing Lounge and lost out bigtime..............my relo's/friends/acquaintances constantly remind me of that.
The point about frequent flyer points may be true however this is the same around the networks of the world and in similar schemes.
9/11 kicked this off and it was only a matter of time anyhow.
The days of something for nothing is gone.
Qantas may be arrogant at the moment and no company is perfect by any means.
But by the same token just remember that QF did move over 50,000 stranded Ansett customers in Sept 2001 without getting a cent from the administrators.
They knew this and if anything it was cheap advertising and something alot of people did appreciate.
Not to mention alot of stranded AN tech/cabin crew who were given jump seats to get home whilst travelling on their freebies/staff discount or whatever.
The service on all airlines deteriorates to some extent with expansion in size.
The point I made about the bitter pill swallowed by those countless tens of thousands that were frequent flyers and lost everything will never be forgotten.Thats a fact and they are quite active about mentioning it in the "letters to the editor" columns.
Not to mention those businesses/individuals that had paid anything up to 10 years membership of the Golden Wing Lounge and lost out bigtime..............my relo's/friends/acquaintances constantly remind me of that.
The point about frequent flyer points may be true however this is the same around the networks of the world and in similar schemes.
9/11 kicked this off and it was only a matter of time anyhow.
The days of something for nothing is gone.
Qantas may be arrogant at the moment and no company is perfect by any means.
But by the same token just remember that QF did move over 50,000 stranded Ansett customers in Sept 2001 without getting a cent from the administrators.
They knew this and if anything it was cheap advertising and something alot of people did appreciate.
Not to mention alot of stranded AN tech/cabin crew who were given jump seats to get home whilst travelling on their freebies/staff discount or whatever.
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QF did move over 50,000 stranded Ansett customers in Sept 2001 without getting a cent from the administrators.
Not at a cheap rate that's for sure!
More money from that then from the administrators!
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Over and above their moves into other airlines SQ are not unknown for taking substantial shares in anything they think will turn a buck.
Quite possible, IMHO, that SQ could be looking at the terminals as a business proposition in themselves with no connection to any particular airline at all.
Quite possible, IMHO, that SQ could be looking at the terminals as a business proposition in themselves with no connection to any particular airline at all.
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Domestic air challenge: SQ denies ‘speculative’ report
Singapore Airlines has denied reports it is backing a new consortium with the intention of entering the Australian domestic aviation market.
A report in The Sunday Telegraph said SQ was underwriting a new airline in a move which would challenge Qantas’ and Virgin Blue’s control of the market.
However, the airline’s public affairs vice president, Rick Clements, dismissed the report, saying it was just “another speculative story”.
“We’re not ruling out any possibility of running another airline in the future nor are we ruling it in at this stage,” he said.
The newspaper quoted an industry source who allegedly said the airline already had the paperwork and could be in the air by Christmas, operating between Sydney, Melbourne and Canberra.
22 July 2002
Singapore Airlines has denied reports it is backing a new consortium with the intention of entering the Australian domestic aviation market.
A report in The Sunday Telegraph said SQ was underwriting a new airline in a move which would challenge Qantas’ and Virgin Blue’s control of the market.
However, the airline’s public affairs vice president, Rick Clements, dismissed the report, saying it was just “another speculative story”.
“We’re not ruling out any possibility of running another airline in the future nor are we ruling it in at this stage,” he said.
The newspaper quoted an industry source who allegedly said the airline already had the paperwork and could be in the air by Christmas, operating between Sydney, Melbourne and Canberra.
22 July 2002
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Word from deep inside S.I A. TODAY.
Is it Is most definately going to happen. Money is NO object . Equipment is immediately available , new ,and at minimal leasing costs due Sept 11...Many millions being lost by star alliance finishing in Asia. Qantas being seen as a major threat to ALL asian operators. ANZ seen as collapsing and no threat to anyone. Incentives being offered to all Star partners to back any rival that can operate full service operator IN AUS.. QANTAS REJECTING A TRADE OFF TO Join STAR ALLIANCE. One World is extremely worried ,to a point of spending money to block competitors. Virgin very vunerable to a third player.l .End of info....Draw your own conclusions.
Watch this space.
Is it Is most definately going to happen. Money is NO object . Equipment is immediately available , new ,and at minimal leasing costs due Sept 11...Many millions being lost by star alliance finishing in Asia. Qantas being seen as a major threat to ALL asian operators. ANZ seen as collapsing and no threat to anyone. Incentives being offered to all Star partners to back any rival that can operate full service operator IN AUS.. QANTAS REJECTING A TRADE OFF TO Join STAR ALLIANCE. One World is extremely worried ,to a point of spending money to block competitors. Virgin very vunerable to a third player.l .End of info....Draw your own conclusions.
Watch this space.
