Sad day for last captain
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Amazon Man - (heh heh wink wink nudge nudge say no more!) - the difference between a scab, whom you so admire, and an 89er', is that as a pax, that bloke you see waving at you from outside the wreck in which you sit is the scab. The bloke trying to assist you is the 89er. Metaphorically speaking of course. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="cool.gif" />
Hi All,. . I just cannot sit here and read all this BS and not say something.. .This guy was an opportunistic bastard 12 years ago and jumped into a job that was not his and he should not have had.. .. .I was a 2 year F/O with Ansett and lost a hell of a lot in 89, I had waited all my life to get there and ............... anyway the rest is history and life goes on.. .. .My point is absolutely none of the public gave 2 rats about me losing my job and being blacklisted and sent overseas. They thought I deserved it!! amazing isn't it. So why should I and my fellow 89 Pilots give a rats ass about a scumbag opportunistic low life like him? he took his chance and had 12 years of high wages to bank. He will not get a job anywhere in the free world if I have a say in it, and believe me I now do.. . .. .So excuse me if I take just a little bit of joy over Captain Little's last flight,,,,,,poor ****** now knows what it felt like in 89.. .. .We will never forget these "fine" men.. .. .Cheers all.. .. .ACMS.. .. .p.s. To all Ansett fellows that joined after 93, good luck you will find work soon.
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I honestly thought that this was a time when the 89ers could finally prove to us all that they were happy with the choices they made all those years ago.. .. .I thought a smart 89 would wryly muse "Ansett gone, who is Ansett. Oh, you mean that crummy carrier I left almost a decade and a half ago to pursue my proffession in other parts. Who cares". .. .But you guys are not doing that are you. why not.
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Snakes and ladders. . .What goes around comes around.. .. .I had nothing to do with 89, still at school. I can however see that since 89 aviation in Australia is very much a case of look after yourself first and stand on anyone to get to where you want to go. The famous Australian quality of mateship seems to have been lost in 89 and I can't see any evidence of it returning in the near future. Wages and conditions for pilots have deteriorated since much to the benefit of the companies and the travelling public (joe public expects to travel for the price of a bus fair and anything more is clearly extortion from the greedy airlines). Qantas, Ansett and their associated Regional Airlines seemed to be the only companies where a pilot didn't have to fork out for an endorsement. With Ansett now dead and pilots lining up enmasse at Virgin Blue, cash in hand, to pay for a 737 endorsement how long do you think it will be before a business savvy Qantas catches on and says, "Hang on, they're onto something here, why don't we do the same thing? **** , if someone will pay $20,000 to join Virgin, then surely it would not be unreasonable to ask them for $30,000 to join Qantas (after all we are the world's best)?" Just one more obstacle for anyone wanting a career in aviation because everyone thinks only of themselves and the airlines milk tis for their commercial benefit.(mind you in the present climate who can really blame them - especially when you look at history - the guys who looked after themselves in 89 ended up better off). Once again I had nothing to do with 89 but I don't think it should be called "irrelevant" or people told to "get over it" because it has shaped the present aviation psyche where everyone looks after number one. Any new pilot to the industry who doesn't acknowledge it's significance is plainly ignorant. We are and continue to be our own worst enemies so when someone finally trips over what they've helped create and finally gets Karma I don't begrudge others gloating and bringing it to everyone's attention. After all what comes around goes around or is it what goes around comes around.....arhhh stuffit.
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it's a rumour network. If you don't like it, don't read it. As for poor AN people being out of work, well, it's sad. But as I said before, once it happens to you 2 or 3 times, you won't feel a thing. It's a dog eat dog world north of Darwin
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Right on ACMS it has irked me the way the media and every other expert has carried on over the demise of Ansett yet they didn't give a rats about us.. .. .I feel genuinely sorry for those innocents caught up in this but those of you who know the real story know that a large majority of those screaming the loudest now about losing their jobs were the very people flight attendants, ground personel etc,etc who shafted us good and proper in '89 so I have trouble having any sympathy for them.. .. .And to the Scabs I take great pleasure in knowing that they will most probably never fly again anywhere, I hope you have enough blood money to get you through, 40 odd years not working in your chosen proffession is a long time. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="tongue.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="tongue.gif" />
Bluey
Regardless of what has been said here about Ansett's past, we Aussies are about to lose a national icon and that is definitely not a good thing.. .. .When this first happened in September of last year, I was one of the many who walked over from "our" terminal into "enemy territory" to stand in silent support with fellow aviation workers in serious trouble. I wore an Ansett lapel pin which I will wear again tonight while I watch with sadness as the last "enemy aircraft" departs Perth skies.. .. .The loss of a major airline is about to have a drastic effect on thousands of people, only some of whom are pilots. All the baggage handlers, ticketing staff, engineers, check-in staff, ramp rats, administration workers, cleaners, caterers, airport retail workers and everyone else involved in making an airline fly will now be out of work and suffering all the awful consequences of being in that situation. . .. .How anyone can possibly see this as a cause for rejoicing is beyond me.. .. .Good luck to all my good friends on the other side of the fence. I wish you well and sincerely hope it won't be too long before you all have full time employment again.
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Some of you are truly tragic people - I am becoming used to being viciously attacked by some in here merely for being from NZ, but I thought at least "blood would be thicker than water" between fellow Australians, and that some basic human decency and sympathy might be shown to the AN crews/staff, of whom the Captain shown was a representative - but for some of you this is clearly not the case. Heaven help you.
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BlueDiamond,. .. .Not once did the '89ers consider the real hardship inflicted on those people you mention below in '89.. .. ._________________________________________________. .. .The loss of a major airline is about to have a drastic effect on thousands of people, only some of whom are pilots. All the baggage handlers, ticketing staff, engineers, check-in staff, ramp rats, administration workers, cleaners, caterers, airport retail workers and everyone else involved in making an airline fly will now be out of work and suffering all the awful consequences of being in that situation. . .. .__________________________________________________. .. .Nevertheless they expected these same people to support their cause when, for instance,they expected aircraft refuellers to help even when they had tankered fuel to thwart the refuellers industrial action on other occasions.. .. .If a few ground crew did get a bit short it would not be surprising, after all they had mortgages to pay too. However, despite that, it is simply not true that a great many ground crew or flight attendants rejoiced in the pilots dispute.. .. .__________________________________________________
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I used to have a lot of respect for Australians and Australia but some of you guys are seriously letting yourselfs down, I am not for or against what went on in 89 but to wish somebody and his family ill and worse over this dispute 13 years ago just seems beyond belief.. .. .Some of us in Europe suffered including myself when you all flooded into the UK and filled jobs preventing promotion for many years, I never obtained the command position on the large jets that I had worked so hard for because of it, but Ive been in aviation ever since and never felt any bad feelings towards any Australian or any other group of pilots. Believe you me I know all about the dispute, I had to sit with enough Aussies who told me all about it.. .. .You do yourself and more importantly your country a great disservice. Move on or it seems a lot of you are going to be paying psychiatrists a lot of money in your retirements.
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ACMS said, . .. .p.s. To all Ansett fellows that joined after 93, good luck you will find work soon.. .. .What the hell has 93 got to do with it, the dispute finished when the Feds surrendered in March 1990. .and commanded "You may now apply for your jobs back". .. .All the best
To all AN staff, my good wishes and thanks for the great service I have received over the years. I especially congratulate the 3000 or so employees for whom 27/2 will always remain a devastating date; the dignity and decorum with which you have all carried out your duties is a truly great example and something for which you should all be proud. The slogan "Service that Shines" has never been more appropriate.. .. .To all those rejoicing at these people's misfortune, my unending distaste. That you continue to harbour your bitterness for an event that occurred 12.5 years ago is sad; that you direct this bitterness at innocent victims is a disgrace. . .. .You may have been mistreated back in '89 but, sadly for you, those that benefited from this "mistreatment" have already profitted from AN and left. TNT and News have both exitted from AN at handsome profits and surely it is these organisations that you should be directing your venom not fellow hardworking Australians.
Moderator
Amazon Man, hear hear!!!. .. .Those HYPOCRITES thought nothing of stamping all over the locals career paths overseas when it suited them. Times were hard enough as it was.. .. .Imagine the whining and carrying on had the tables been turned.. .. .What goes around comes around.. . . . <small>[ 04 March 2002, 06:35: Message edited by: Charlie Foxtrot India ]</small>
Getitright, in cold terms you are right. As Shakespeare said we are all actors dwelling briefly on stage but that shouldn't mean that we don't grieve just a little bit when an old friend's candle is extinguished.
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I have been reading the messages on this subject now for the past few weeks and have been gathering my thoughts and emotions on the matter. The previous post however has inspired me to air my thoughts in this public forum.. .Just for the record I was a 9 year First Officer with Ansett at the time of the 89 dispute.Today I would have some 21 years with Ansett.. .I must say that I am pleased at the prospect of never having to see the name Ansett adorning the Australian landscape. It isn't the human aspect that I find revolting, to me the name Ansett is synonymous with the most vile, un-Australian, criminal event ever undertaken by an Australian Government and major corporations.. .The fact that the heads of these corporations had to resort to purgury, and the Government of the day resort to invoking the secrecy under the guise of national interest to protect themselves, and remove individuals democratic rights to natural justice is something I cannot forgive or forget, nor should any true red blooded Australian. . .Yes I do symathize with the many innocent and loyal employees of Ansett, your lives will be irreversably altered from this day on, as was mine 12 years ago, and yes you will have to wear the scars of this experience, and in manny cases the bitterness you feel from the events of the past few months. However the company you were loyal to, this national Icon as so many have called it in the past, itself bears a heavy responsibility over the past 12 years for making all of us victims of its corrupt, protectionist, nepotistic approach to its business dealings. This includes its disciminatory policy toward qualified experienced AUSTRALIAN pilots in favour of foreigners well after the supposed end of the dispute in 1990, all under the protection of the Hawke government, and national security.. .Once that protection was removed, when the Liberals came to power, Ansett was domed, as it then had to stand alone, no more favoured status,by it's new found best budy's in the ACTU. It was at last transparent, culminating in the situation today.. .Ansett past it's use by date on the 24th August 1989, that is when it sold it's sole to the devil.It has been on borrowed time ever since. It didn't stand a chance out there on it's own.. .My best wishes to the staff, I hope those deserving will secure a position with Virgin or Qantas,they are both healthy, vibrant airlines, who deserve to have a place as AUSTRALIAN ICONS. Ansett forfeited that privalege quite some time ago.. .Get youselves back on your feet, shake yourselves off and put that positive loyalty into a company deserving your efforts.. .The airline industry worlwide is remarkably small. Those who are not deserving recognition in the industry are well known, and will soon find out just how small this industry really is.