Virgin Blue is here to stay.
Evertonian
I have to agree statorblade...
Never mind the bollock$, SQ will pull the shots on this little mess, regardless of whats said in the papers or who's baring his AR$E!! QF must know this, hence the wage fixing. They need to get lean mighty quick to confront the coming storm of a combined DJ/AN...Pipe dreams? possibly, but a very real chance.
Never mind the bollock$, SQ will pull the shots on this little mess, regardless of whats said in the papers or who's baring his AR$E!! QF must know this, hence the wage fixing. They need to get lean mighty quick to confront the coming storm of a combined DJ/AN...Pipe dreams? possibly, but a very real chance.
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With Virgin Blue announcing an $8 million audited profit for the six months April- September 2001, how is it that so many are forcasting financial troubles for the airline. This profit was during the period when 3 airlines were operating domestically (4 counting Impulse I think?), and now post Sept 11/Ansett1 collapse they have been doing exceptionally well. I wouldnt think they are quite in the predicament that most of the pro Ansetters predict. Another thing to keep in mind is that ALL Virgin companies are seperate identities and are in no way tied financially to other companies in the Virgin empire.Thus if Virgin Atlantic are in financial difficulties this doesnt mean that Virgin Blue will suffer as a result(most probably know that but a few like to take comfort in the fact that they think if one specific company is not performing well then VB must be in trouble also),not the case.
Best of luck to ALL airlines and staff.
Best of luck to ALL airlines and staff.
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Interesting points guys and a realistic outlook more importantly.
The facts are true about VB's cash flow on a daily basis sustaining them over the short term.
I hate to see anyone out of a job but lets face it everyone - why should Qantas maintain the upper hand and very manipulatively use politicians to support them when something doesn't go their way or they feel threatened by real competition (ie SQ/AN/NZ etc) and use the Federal Minister for Transport John Anderson to do their bidding!
I dont agree with government hand outs but the govt and the public want competition - and the only way its going to happen is with some tax concessions to start ups to assist in competing against Qantas.
As for the QF share price their cost structure will have to come down dramatically if they are to compete - their admin system is something akin to the public service of the sixties.
As one person said they seem to have more management pilots working in offices than flying planes!
To compete on an equal basic cost index they may have to shed up to 9000 staff to even approach a realistic level compared to AN II or Virgin Blue.Either that or rreduce wages considerably - there is no other choice.
Will QF expand the supposed Australian Airlines with its lower cost base at the expense of Qantas who may contract in size???
This is the other realistic scenario and may make for some very interesting times.
I know the boys in Qantas are making noises already.
[ 10 December 2001: Message edited by: Capt Kremin ]
The facts are true about VB's cash flow on a daily basis sustaining them over the short term.
I hate to see anyone out of a job but lets face it everyone - why should Qantas maintain the upper hand and very manipulatively use politicians to support them when something doesn't go their way or they feel threatened by real competition (ie SQ/AN/NZ etc) and use the Federal Minister for Transport John Anderson to do their bidding!
I dont agree with government hand outs but the govt and the public want competition - and the only way its going to happen is with some tax concessions to start ups to assist in competing against Qantas.
As for the QF share price their cost structure will have to come down dramatically if they are to compete - their admin system is something akin to the public service of the sixties.
As one person said they seem to have more management pilots working in offices than flying planes!
To compete on an equal basic cost index they may have to shed up to 9000 staff to even approach a realistic level compared to AN II or Virgin Blue.Either that or rreduce wages considerably - there is no other choice.
Will QF expand the supposed Australian Airlines with its lower cost base at the expense of Qantas who may contract in size???
This is the other realistic scenario and may make for some very interesting times.
I know the boys in Qantas are making noises already.
[ 10 December 2001: Message edited by: Capt Kremin ]
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From Tues "Sydney Morning Herald" http://www.smh.com.au/news/0112/11/n...national7.html
"Industry analysts now say Mr Lew and Mr Fox may need to acquire the airline progressively from the administrators, Mark Mentha and Mark Korda, because there are too may logistical difficulties to surmount."
Qantas also announced changes to its domestic operations yesterday, with flights every 30 minutes in morning and afternoon peaks between Sydney and Brisbane, and Melbourne and Brisbane. It is a deliberate strategy aimed at gazumping its main rival, Ansett, ahead of the relaunch planned by Solomon Lew and Lindsay Fox in February.
The new services follow the successful launch of the CityFlyer service to Melbourne last July.
Qantas will also introduce package meals, rather than tray meals, to all flights except Perth.
There will also be the potential for automatic swipe-card check-in for all passengers from January, overcoming queues.
Qantas executive general manager sales and marketing, John Borghetti, said domestic passengers were insisting on flexibility. "It's now a question of speed and frequency - not just in the terminal but in the aircraft," he said.
The extra flights to Brisbane puts Ansett Mark II under enormous pressure, especially as Virgin Blue and Qantas have unveiled major discount ticket offers for February and March.
Although bookings with Ansett are healthy over the Christmas holidays, no tickets can be bought for travel after January 31 - the day the Lew-Fox syndicate is due to take over operations. While they say they are committed to the sale, they are still wrangling with Singapore Airlines, which they want to manage the airline.
Industry analysts now say Mr Lew and Mr Fox may need to acquire the airline progressively from the administrators, Mark Mentha and Mark Korda, because there are too may logistical difficulties to surmount.
"Industry analysts now say Mr Lew and Mr Fox may need to acquire the airline progressively from the administrators, Mark Mentha and Mark Korda, because there are too may logistical difficulties to surmount."
Qantas also announced changes to its domestic operations yesterday, with flights every 30 minutes in morning and afternoon peaks between Sydney and Brisbane, and Melbourne and Brisbane. It is a deliberate strategy aimed at gazumping its main rival, Ansett, ahead of the relaunch planned by Solomon Lew and Lindsay Fox in February.
The new services follow the successful launch of the CityFlyer service to Melbourne last July.
Qantas will also introduce package meals, rather than tray meals, to all flights except Perth.
There will also be the potential for automatic swipe-card check-in for all passengers from January, overcoming queues.
Qantas executive general manager sales and marketing, John Borghetti, said domestic passengers were insisting on flexibility. "It's now a question of speed and frequency - not just in the terminal but in the aircraft," he said.
The extra flights to Brisbane puts Ansett Mark II under enormous pressure, especially as Virgin Blue and Qantas have unveiled major discount ticket offers for February and March.
Although bookings with Ansett are healthy over the Christmas holidays, no tickets can be bought for travel after January 31 - the day the Lew-Fox syndicate is due to take over operations. While they say they are committed to the sale, they are still wrangling with Singapore Airlines, which they want to manage the airline.
Industry analysts now say Mr Lew and Mr Fox may need to acquire the airline progressively from the administrators, Mark Mentha and Mark Korda, because there are too may logistical difficulties to surmount.
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"Qantas also announced changes to its domestic operations yesterday, with flights every 30 minutes in morning and afternoon peaks between Sydney and Brisbane, and Melbourne and Brisbane. It is a deliberate strategy aimed at gazumping its main rival, Ansett, ahead of the relaunch planned by Solomon Lew and Lindsay Fox in February."
Might be a nice idea, but there is no way QF in its current form can get down to the new AN cost structure.
Something in QF will have to give and I wonder what that might be ?
Of course it won't mean wages, conditions and staff numbers are reduced - much.
All QF staff should pay close attention to what is happening here.
Might be a nice idea, but there is no way QF in its current form can get down to the new AN cost structure.
Something in QF will have to give and I wonder what that might be ?
Of course it won't mean wages, conditions and staff numbers are reduced - much.
All QF staff should pay close attention to what is happening here.
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THE WAY OF THE FUTURE
http://www.airliners.net/open.file?id=185530
[ 11 December 2001: Message edited by: eisle s ]
http://www.airliners.net/open.file?id=185530
[ 11 December 2001: Message edited by: eisle s ]
