Ex Impulse 717s are dogs.
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Ex Impulse 717s are dogs.
There seem to have been major problems out of Tassie with the ex Impulse 717s. Mostly max BRW created. It seems that getting the cheapest type certification has limited the 717 fleet badly. The Airline formerly known as Ansett is doing a wonderful trade in live seafood cargo where QF link has had to revert to chartering 146s just to move baggage much less cargo.
Are these aeroplanes the HQ Belmont of Boeing or can they be rerated with a lot of dollars thrown at them for a higher accreditation??
Best
EWL
Edited for typos.
[ 06 December 2001: Message edited by: Eastwest Loco ]
Are these aeroplanes the HQ Belmont of Boeing or can they be rerated with a lot of dollars thrown at them for a higher accreditation??
Best
EWL
Edited for typos.
[ 06 December 2001: Message edited by: Eastwest Loco ]
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EWL
Different strokes for different blokes.
The type is a 'commuter' not designed to carry much beyond pax on board bax.
Sorta Ummurican Bae146.
They (McDouglas) were heading south way before Boeing picked em up, I guess to fill in the "Belmont" part of their product line.
I suspect the old TAA would have found them too hard aagainst the Boeing thingys, were it not for the protection of the two airline policy. Can't recall but did Reg ever operate the type?
Different strokes for different blokes.
The type is a 'commuter' not designed to carry much beyond pax on board bax.
Sorta Ummurican Bae146.
They (McDouglas) were heading south way before Boeing picked em up, I guess to fill in the "Belmont" part of their product line.
I suspect the old TAA would have found them too hard aagainst the Boeing thingys, were it not for the protection of the two airline policy. Can't recall but did Reg ever operate the type?
Evertonian
They both ran the DC9's & I'm sure they went to Tassie, EWL would know for sure.
I guess they are just bigger CRJ's wrt freight handling/carriage. James Strong, during a meeting at QF maintenance MEL, said whilst a CRJ taxiied past, that they were AN's biggest mistake! Perhaps keeping the 717's in the fleet mix is QF's?
I guess they are just bigger CRJ's wrt freight handling/carriage. James Strong, during a meeting at QF maintenance MEL, said whilst a CRJ taxiied past, that they were AN's biggest mistake! Perhaps keeping the 717's in the fleet mix is QF's?
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Both TAA and Ansett operated the DC9-30s for many years, all over Australia including Tasmania. So of course did IPEC/IAF with the 2 freighters (IPC+IPF). They operated all over Australia, PNG and right through the South Pacific including Tasmania all the time, used to do a lot of the crew training in Tasmania as well....... 
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Yes indeed, lame, I did a lot of DC9 training in Launy and Hobart. Don't know about the specifics of the 717 but it looks like a much improved DC9 with better engines and Flight Deck. The DC9 was very much range limited because it's tank capacity only allowed 4 hours to dry tanks. Thought the more efficient engines would have improved on that considerably even with same tankage but don't know about operating weights.
Certainly looks nice.
PS
What are you doing out of bed so early? Did the storm wake you?
[ 06 December 2001: Message edited by: pterodactyl ]
Certainly looks nice.
PS
What are you doing out of bed so early? Did the storm wake you?
[ 06 December 2001: Message edited by: pterodactyl ]
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EWL
The 717's dont have a problem with the actual BRW ex TAS, the problem sometimes occurs is the MLW into MEL due to the short sector length. The 717's are currently getting the MLW increase certification which will solve this problem. I've never come close to reaching the MTOW on the 717 yet.
Cheers.
The 717's dont have a problem with the actual BRW ex TAS, the problem sometimes occurs is the MLW into MEL due to the short sector length. The 717's are currently getting the MLW increase certification which will solve this problem. I've never come close to reaching the MTOW on the 717 yet.
Cheers.
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lame,
You can get a good radar picture of the cause on Weatherzone
http://www.weatherzone.com.au/index.jsp
Perhaps you have it already.
You can get a good radar picture of the cause on Weatherzone
http://www.weatherzone.com.au/index.jsp
Perhaps you have it already.
it is raining and storms.......
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The max landing weight issue out of Hobart for Melbourne left forty bags on the tarmac during some poor weather a week or so ago. The Qantas agent claimed that the 717s were awaiting paperwork increasing the MLW by 1000kg, any truth to this?
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This matter has been discussed under earlier topics about Impulse.
Impulse elected to go for the 110,000 lbs certification as it suited the MEL - SYD - BNE stage lengths and saved then money in charges. However you then strike problems in operating over shorter stage lenths ie MEL _ LAU, MEL - HBA, hence mlw probs have arisen. They will obviously have the aircraft re certified to higher weights to overcome the problem and pay proportionaly more in weight based charges.
The DC9 - 30f's were at a far higher weight than the DC9 - 30's used in pax service by TN and AN.
The DC9 - 30's used by TN and AN were seated for 91/94 seats and not 117 seats which is the QF B717 configeration.
Impulse elected to go for the 110,000 lbs certification as it suited the MEL - SYD - BNE stage lengths and saved then money in charges. However you then strike problems in operating over shorter stage lenths ie MEL _ LAU, MEL - HBA, hence mlw probs have arisen. They will obviously have the aircraft re certified to higher weights to overcome the problem and pay proportionaly more in weight based charges.
The DC9 - 30f's were at a far higher weight than the DC9 - 30's used in pax service by TN and AN.
The DC9 - 30's used by TN and AN were seated for 91/94 seats and not 117 seats which is the QF B717 configeration.
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Not sure about the landing weight problem, we are still waiting for the service bulletin to replace the aft cargo floors with aluminium to assist with the C of G problem. If the aircraft has a MLW problem, then whacking a few hundred kilos of metal in the back isn’t going to help! Maybe Mr. Boeing is looking at increasing the MLW. I certainly don't know.........
Cheers!
GTG!
Cheers!
GTG!
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pterodactyl
Love your new logo thingy
And thanks a bunch for the link to Weatherzone of which I am now a member and can indulge one of my other passions.
The Hurricane Hugo story was really intersting, I still cant' believe those guys trudling in and out of those things.
I have flown around close to and over but in and out would be something else.
Love your new logo thingy
And thanks a bunch for the link to Weatherzone of which I am now a member and can indulge one of my other passions.
The Hurricane Hugo story was really intersting, I still cant' believe those guys trudling in and out of those things.
I have flown around close to and over but in and out would be something else.
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Was told by a reliable source in southern Tasmania that the mod for the 717s was being financed by Australian Air Express to allow them to carry AAE's freight. But on bad weather days, the excess weight will still be used for fuel. And back to square one.
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I have some good experience in this field so here it is...
The B717 with a full load of pax can not put anything significant in hold 1 (the fwd locker) as the aircraft is very nosey on trim due to the long moment of fuselage ahead of the wings( This is to counter the Br715's that sit right up the tail). It works well when 75% full, however any more can turn it into a problem. The increased landing weight of about 909kg has come through, and should be applied next week, and ballast has been put in the tail cone to utilise hold 1 more(as they often run out of space with freight). There will still be a problem uplifting freight when the wx turns ugly on short legs though. It is not the easiest plane to get into trim, little changes at the extemes of the aircraft make a large difference.
[ 07 December 2001: Message edited by: EngineOut ]
The B717 with a full load of pax can not put anything significant in hold 1 (the fwd locker) as the aircraft is very nosey on trim due to the long moment of fuselage ahead of the wings( This is to counter the Br715's that sit right up the tail). It works well when 75% full, however any more can turn it into a problem. The increased landing weight of about 909kg has come through, and should be applied next week, and ballast has been put in the tail cone to utilise hold 1 more(as they often run out of space with freight). There will still be a problem uplifting freight when the wx turns ugly on short legs though. It is not the easiest plane to get into trim, little changes at the extemes of the aircraft make a large difference.
[ 07 December 2001: Message edited by: EngineOut ]
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Thanks for the excellent and erudite replies PPRuners - much appreciated. MLW was an issue on the BAe 146-300s too with holding and distant anlternates on MEL - however the F28-4000 was fairly bulletproof there. Both types could accept up to 2000kg of live seafood in 5 and 6 on the F28 and 1500 to 2000kg on the 146 with a full load.
The 717 is underbelly load so it it is still surprising that they cannot handle the baggage load on a short haul as that is what they are - a short haul airliner.
Airfreight always pays better than SLF - the thread seems to have been lost by manufacturers in some cases. The Regional Jets are the worst example. Bizjets on steroids.
The DC9-30s of TN were maximum config of 99 in a 1 class config. First class seats (Morganisable) could be converted to economy by engineering in seconds depending on the load and Taarsan would automatically reconfigure up to a cut off point in line with the class demand. The only run I am aware of them being vunerable was LST OOL. On a warm morning the traffic staff would go through the cabin with baggage search forms handing them out as all baggage had to be offloaded and the SLF jad them ready to just hand in as they got off the aeroplane. PER PHE KTA on the old TN555/556 run may have been pushing the parameters too.
Best
EWL
The 717 is underbelly load so it it is still surprising that they cannot handle the baggage load on a short haul as that is what they are - a short haul airliner.
Airfreight always pays better than SLF - the thread seems to have been lost by manufacturers in some cases. The Regional Jets are the worst example. Bizjets on steroids.
The DC9-30s of TN were maximum config of 99 in a 1 class config. First class seats (Morganisable) could be converted to economy by engineering in seconds depending on the load and Taarsan would automatically reconfigure up to a cut off point in line with the class demand. The only run I am aware of them being vunerable was LST OOL. On a warm morning the traffic staff would go through the cabin with baggage search forms handing them out as all baggage had to be offloaded and the SLF jad them ready to just hand in as they got off the aeroplane. PER PHE KTA on the old TN555/556 run may have been pushing the parameters too.
Best
EWL
At Impulse we were taking about 90 bags in compartment 3(rear hold) with up to 2.5 tonnes of cargo in compartment 2 from Mel to Syd and vica versa. I guess it's how uch reserve fuel is carried, Impulse allways seemed to carry way above the required minimums, can't remember the exact fuel figures now. From Sydney to Mel, they usually carried Sydney as the alternate.