Who is padantic with logbooks?
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Who is padantic with logbooks?
For low hour GA pilots, doing the odd bit of flying for Jim, Joe, Harry, Bob ect. does anyone bother to get every entry verified on any one page? I am a little padantic about this and as a result my logbook resembles a doodle-pad.
The reason I do it is in case at a future interview the logbook is scutinised and entries are found on a page which have not been stamped/signed by the operator. Is it possible for a potential employer to call operators to confirm hours if they find unverified entries or do they just assume you're a lier, or I am just being too padantic? Any thoughts?
The reason I do it is in case at a future interview the logbook is scutinised and entries are found on a page which have not been stamped/signed by the operator. Is it possible for a potential employer to call operators to confirm hours if they find unverified entries or do they just assume you're a lier, or I am just being too padantic? Any thoughts?
Be interested to hear what others do as well on that one. If flown a few privately owned aircraft of late and have wondered the same thing, how do you 'verify' that the hours that you are doing in a Privately owned aircraft are infact real...or does this basically just go back to the honesty system?
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Honesty plays a big part in logbook keeping for private flights, however if someone wants to cross check your logbook, I guess they could dig around enough to see just how honest you were.
If you are dishonest it would come back to bite you whenever you went for a check flight, as your "experience" would not show.
If you are dishonest it would come back to bite you whenever you went for a check flight, as your "experience" would not show.
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Private flying is not the only problem. I know many friends of mine that had no way of getting their hours verified or stamped, just because the operators have never done it before and never will. These guys have flown parachuting ops, aerial patrol and glider towing. what's the go with these? I suppose back to the honesty system.
Isn't limited to private flying either - I flew with a guy when I was a Citation Captain, and I'm sure he started logging hours from when he got to the airport. 
Certainly the right side of the plane seemed to be an awful lot slower than the left.
He got a spot with Ansett years ago, but I guess he doesn't now ...
Certainly the right side of the plane seemed to be an awful lot slower than the left.He got a spot with Ansett years ago, but I guess he doesn't now ...
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I have had a computerised logbook now for about 3 years and one thing that I have noticed is how up to date it is, because I find that in one way or another I am on my computer every day, and probably will be for the rest of my life either through checking emails or surfing the net. How easy is it to enter a few numbers before you log on?
Moderate, Modest & Mild.
Pilots who "rig" their logbooks generally become known throughout the industry, and it WILL come back to bight you eventually. Case in point is a pilot who has the nickname of ****** "Rigalogbook"....this guy used to log PIC time while he was paxing! He managed to silver tongue his way into overseas airlines, but when the time came to finding a position with Australia's new start-up airline, his (dishonest) reputation had preceded him.
If you have an accident, expect to be investigated, and falsification of a legal document (log book or licence) will leave YOU wide open to some serious charges and possible penalties - the least of which will probably be loss of licence, and hence loss of income!
In a nutshell, resist the temptation of short term gain because in the longer term it will be negated!
[ 13 November 2001: Message edited by: Kaptin M ]
If you have an accident, expect to be investigated, and falsification of a legal document (log book or licence) will leave YOU wide open to some serious charges and possible penalties - the least of which will probably be loss of licence, and hence loss of income!
In a nutshell, resist the temptation of short term gain because in the longer term it will be negated!
[ 13 November 2001: Message edited by: Kaptin M ]
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I would be more padantic (pedantic) with my spelling instead of my logbook. You would look worse than a lier (liar) if you were scutinised (scrutinised) and an airline saw you can not even spell.
Spelling error's are much more obvious than fabricated hours.
Spelling error's are much more obvious than fabricated hours.
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Have to disagree about not being able to use whiteout. I have used it many times and my logbook has never been questioned. To say you can't use whiteout is to say you can't correct a mistake. Most logbooks are riddled with honest mistakes.
Also this technical approach regarding a logbook as a 'legal document' is getting out of hand. The requirement of the various authorities is that you maintain a record of your flying. It then follows that that record needs to be verifiable, as much as is possible. This is not always going to be possible so let's not get too carried away with the details. Be practical because the airlines will be.
Also this technical approach regarding a logbook as a 'legal document' is getting out of hand. The requirement of the various authorities is that you maintain a record of your flying. It then follows that that record needs to be verifiable, as much as is possible. This is not always going to be possible so let's not get too carried away with the details. Be practical because the airlines will be.
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Whiteout is ok and I once had an FOI chastise a student because of the overwritten and crossed out entries, "it should have been done neatly with whiteout".
If you lose a logbook and do not have copies, you will only be officially creditted with the minimum number of hours applicable to the licence you hold, eg 150 if you hold a CPL. You will keep all your ratings and endorsements as they can be verified by CASA.
MOT how was BKK?
If you lose a logbook and do not have copies, you will only be officially creditted with the minimum number of hours applicable to the licence you hold, eg 150 if you hold a CPL. You will keep all your ratings and endorsements as they can be verified by CASA.
MOT how was BKK?
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Thanks for the interesting comments. I will be a little less pEdantic from now on....Ustasha thanks for your post. For your information when I apply to the airlines I am sure I will check my work and run a spell check, I certainly won't bother when posting on pprune. Better things to do with my time, unlike you it would seem. Cheers.
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One other thing Ustasha my friend, who ever said anything about "fabricated" hours, guilty conscience or something? I was merely asking about verification :o
BTW "can not" should be "cannot" and "error's" should be "errors". Sorry, could not resist Mr. Spelling Police
[ 13 November 2001: Message edited by: He/She Lobster ]
BTW "can not" should be "cannot" and "error's" should be "errors". Sorry, could not resist Mr. Spelling Police
[ 13 November 2001: Message edited by: He/She Lobster ]
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Now, what ever happened to "D+G Spelling Police"? Seem to remember my other half (the She Beast) caught him/her out a beauty one day a while ago!
How the mood has changed......
How the mood has changed......
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Regulation 283 has a $5000 fina attached, I don't call that padantic. If you have gained a licence, or something, with 'manufactured' experience and you have an accident, you are deemed to have no licence and get the appropriate treatment. I am sure Mr. Qantas would be very impressed with your liquid artwork.
I fly, I think you are making it a bit personal. The lobster was mearly asking about the legalities of white-out's vs cross-out and how to verify hours. I certainlly don't think he/she (?!) was advocating the fabrication of hours. rtfq.