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That Fat Lady is Warming Up!

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That Fat Lady is Warming Up!

 
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Old 26th Feb 2002, 15:43
  #21 (permalink)  

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Kaptin M

Quite so.

FT

I'll bite, so FLEW don't make the deadline but say, as they have been for months, we are close, cuppla days.

2 Marks don't have ANY option but to shut down and call their bluff. Just a business decision you realise, as a 'cuppla days' more exposure will certainly take out what's left, if any, of their personal fortunes, houses and any lose change laying around.

[quote] HOWEVER, CEASING OPERATIONS DOES NOT NECESSARILY MEAN TESNA WILL NOT PURCHASE THE AIRLINE. <hr></blockquote>

So what happens to those brave and optimistic souls who in the meantime are booked and expecting to fly.

I think it would be fair to say that they would be less than impressed and you could kiss goodbye to whatever goodwill that there may have been left for the Ansett brand.

Lets see we are come down from saving over 4,000 jobs in a $1.2 billion deal to less than 3,000 (no one knows how many actual full time jobs there are actually in there), 1500 of which they were prepared to toss out if they could have got Richard to take the fall for them, and the creditors have tipped in a further $40 million in addition to whatever has been ripped up since Sept 13.

[quote] The business call made by the administrators was simple - could they raise more money by liquidating the airline immediately, or by a selling and then deducting the losses of continuing operations? They chose the latter, in a move describe to me by an insider as "the gutsiest decision I've ever seen by an administrator". <hr></blockquote>

Quite so, but you didn't answer the obvious question. What if they got it wrong, the ACTU as proxy holder will have some explaining to do I guess.

"gutsiest decision"?? Sir Humphrey would have used "courageous", my insider friends, have a much more colourful and much more direct description.

Mind you the administrators are in so deep now without any other options than perhaps Lang, that FLEW have nothing to lose by playing them to the death.

In the meantime there are 15,000 staff and a cavalcade of creditors who are not going to be happy, whether they close the sale or not the 5c is gone and they are learning what a mouth full of feathers tastes like.

And another thing they spent the last x many months in court getting approval for this and orders for that and as recently in the last few days chasing deadlines seeking final approval for the completion.. .Now we are told that they can complete the sale without the courts approval.

Can someone explain to this simple soul what that actually means? Or is the answer that "this is big kids stuff that you wouldn't understand".

You're damnn tooting I dont.

Personally I don't care one way or the other what games they play with their own money, but I care deeply about the staff who got screwed over first by their employers and are getting screwed over again by the very people who claim to be saving them.

FT I'll modify your bet a little, I'll run around the MCG (not naked we don't want to frighten the kiddies now do we) with a dunces hat on, covered in feathers carrying a sign saying FLEW and the 2 Marks are heroes, if they are flying as TESNA ANSETT after midnight on the 28th and they are still there to fly me there as their guest for the Grand Final.
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Old 26th Feb 2002, 16:02
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Thanks Flying Tiger. At least someone with a brain can add a little commonsense to the discussion. The usual knockers get straight into the act as usual, only putting down their A320 models stuck with voodoo pins long enough to sprout their 89 c*ap again and again and again. God they will be so dissapointed when AN does get up again they will all be grounded for a month or so until the Prosac kicks in again.
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Old 26th Feb 2002, 16:22
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I have to take issue with Kaptin M and his assertion that because Sir Reg was a pilot then pilots know something about business. He was able to build up an airline like a lot of pilots could but in the end he lost it to people who were better at the nasty side of business than he was. There are plenty of examples of pilots with massive debts and large tax bills because they thought they knew how business operates but in the end they were just your average Joe on a large salary. There is going to be much scraping of egg of face come Friday when Ansett is relaunched under majority Australian ownership. I think if the Fat Lady sings it will be for Terry McCranns career as a financial comentator.
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Old 26th Feb 2002, 16:42
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Now that's a good point, Eternal F/O - I have a fundamental rule of investment that hasn't failed me yet:

[quote] "If airline pilots are involved in it, don't touch it with a barge pole." <hr></blockquote>

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Old 26th Feb 2002, 16:50
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Geez you guys dump on reporters. Aren't they just the messengers. They are stating what most people see as the facts. If that is all the info out there that is all that will be said by them.
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Old 26th Feb 2002, 17:42
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The Age late news:

Sydney Airport lease secured. .MELBOURNE, Feb 26 AAP|Published: Tuesday February 26, 11:37 PM

Prospective Ansett purchaser Tesna has finally secured the first of several airport leases crucial to the airline's take-off.

Sydney Airports Corporation Limited (SACL) announced late today it had formally offered Tesna a lease under the arrangements agreed to in principle on February 14.

Ansett administrators are still waiting to sign off documents to transfer the leases on 19 aircraft and the airport terminals of four other capital cities. . .advertisement . .

These lose ends threaten the Ansett sale deadline of midnight Thursday, set by administrators Mark Mentha and Mark Korda.

Mr Korda has repeatedly said the sale deadline would not be altered.

The Sydney Airport lease, in particular, was regarded as a major stumbling block to the sale of Ansett to Tesna, the company founded by Solomon Lew and Lindsay Fox.

However, a SACL spokesman tonight said the lease had never been a barrier to the sale of Ansett to Tesna.

"Sydney Airport has negotiated a deal in good faith and delivered in time for the administrators and Tesna to complete their sale process on 28 February," the spokesman said.

"We are an airport. Our clear intent is to get Ansett back in the air again and for passengers to enjoy the benefits of a competitive aviation market."

Inspections of aircraft and facilities are necessary before the air operators certificate (AOC) could be transferred from the administration to Tesna with two days' notice.

However, the AOC can be issued after the sale deal is signed.

Ansett administrators were back in court this week to obtain Federal Court approval for the Ansett sale.

However, the proceedings were deferred because many vital sale documents were incomplete, including the Sydney Airport lease.
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Old 26th Feb 2002, 18:07
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"The Age" late news

Ansett say ticket sales reflect public confidence. .MELBOURNE, Feb 26 AAP|Published: Tuesday February 26, 5:50 PM

An increase in Ansett ticket sales for the Easter holidays showed public confidence in the airline, representatives for the beleaguered carrier said today.

But travel agents said passengers must be buying tickets through the internet or the airline's call centres as their customers were ignoring Ansett promotions, preferring to fly Qantas or Virgin Blue.

"People have lost faith in Ansett, the inquiry level is next to nothing," a Flight Centre agent said today.

"Before the collapse they had about 40 per cent of sales. Now we don't sell Ansett tickets because the inquiries just aren't there," a St Kilda Jetset agent said.

Jetset's busy Airport West agency in Melbourne said agents had refused to sell tickets because Ansett administrators were no longer paying commission.

Ansett representatives today said ticket sales for flights scheduled after the February 28 sale deadline were on the increase.

"They're building up nicely over March, and Easter is looking excellent," a spokeswoman said.

She said sales were expected to increase after the sale to the Tesna syndicate went ahead.

As the sale deadline approached, final details were still being added to the vital airport and airline leasing transfers.

Administrators are continuing to quibble with Tesna over which assets will be included in the sale.

But airport operators say there is no reason why contracts cannot be signed by the due date.

"We're doing everything we can to get there," Melbourne Airport spokeswoman Bianca Polidori said.

The Civil Aviation Safety Authority said there was still time for an air operators certificate to be completed.

While analysts speculate on why Tesna has been slow in releasing its new marketing campaign, Qantas and Virgin are preparing themselves for a price and service war.

Virgin Blue extended its hold on the domestic market today, announcing the launch of a direct Melbourne-to-Cairns air service.

The non-stop service between the Victorian capital and one of Australia's most popular holiday destinations will start on May 3.

Flights will operate five days a week, with a special $199 one-way fare and every day $229 ticket.

Ansett has identified Cairns as a future destination.
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Old 26th Feb 2002, 18:13
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Uterus, it's not hard to ascertain that YOU are one of the few who has scored a job with TESNA, and that Flying Tiger has provided a salve for your stress, lest you also find yourself on the unemployment scrap heap!. .Please Ctrl+c then Ctrl+v the references in the posts on this page to 1989, and post them for us.. .Superficially, Flying Tiger's post would appeal to the 2-3,000 employees who resigned from Ansett to secure a guernsey with TESNA (and no-one is wishing you ill), however, to the other 10,000+ who DON'T have a job offer the post merely highlights the complete disregard that the 2 M&M's, FLEW,and the ACTU show for their welfare. . .It's a deal worth millions - and guess WHOSE $$$'s are being used in the gamble.......none of the preceding 3!!!!!!!!

PFO, you MUST be joking - surely - when you say that Sir Reginald Ansett lost control of his airline to people {Abeles and Murdoch) better able to manage it <img src="tongue.gif" border="0"> - THEY were the first stages of rot to set in, to what was a healthy, non-debt, fully owned company.. .Another fine example of a pilot-owned airline was Hazeltons. Have a look at where IT is today!!. .You and Zone 5 might like to take a walk around Bankstown, Essendon, Archerfield and Jandakot one of these days, and count the number of SUCCESSFUL charter and commuter operations managed by PILOTS.

No-one has said that pilots are great businessmen - have a look at some of those 60 year olds you're flying with, PFO (the "motelier", the Gold Coast taxi driver) - however the track record of management success in the airline industry, worldwide, over the past 10 years is pretty much one of dismal FAILURE!!
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Old 26th Feb 2002, 19:20
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Wed "Melbourne Age"

Airline deal goes down to the wire. .Leonie Wood. .February 27 2002

Prospective Ansett owners Solomon Lew and Lindsay Fox were bunkered down for a final decision on whether the beleaguered airline would fly after Friday.

With Ansett's administrators sticking to their deadline of midnight tomorrow, Mr Fox and Mr Lew have until this morning to notify authorities that their $500-million Ansett bid will go ahead.

Qantas yesterday began planning how it might carry Ansett passengers over this extremely busy weekend if the planes are grounded.

While Tesna and administrators Mark Mentha and Mark Korda, of accounting firm Andersen, have blamed airport owners and aircraft lessors for last-minute delays in finalising documentation, sources yesterday said almost everything was ready for Tesna to sign.

Mr Lew and Mr Fox spent much of yesterday making their final assessment of Tesna's financial prospects. The sources said the businessmen were concerned about the nature of the financial risk if some of the agreements with other parties were not resolved before Ansett's relaunch.

If Mr Fox and Mr Lew pull out of the deal - as many financial analysts expect - about 2700 employees hoping for full-time jobs with Ansett will once again be out of work. Jobs in ancillary businesses would also be in jeopardy.

Tesna has already employed several dozen managers, including chief executive James Hogan who quit his senior executive role at the successful British budget carrier bmi Midland.

Earlier yesterday, Tesna sources insisted there was a "high probability" that Tesna would complete the deal.

The Civil Aviation Safety Authority has agreed to approve Tesna's application for the crucial Air Operators Certificate in just 36 hours. CASA is expecting an application by midday today at the latest, accompanied by a request from the administrators to withdraw their certificate.

The certificate validates that the carrier has supplied a detailed list of safety audit standards.

CASA still needs the list of registrations for the planes that Tesna intends to fly. But that cannot be supplied until Tesna has finalised its leasing deals with aircraft financiers.

. .As well, Tesna still has not handed over its final business plan to the Victorian Government, a move considered crucial to securing a package of incentives including a payroll tax waiver for up to five years, marketing assistance and a commitment to direct state government business travel to Ansett.

It also has not finalised lease arrangements with any of the capital city airport owners, including Australia Pacific Airports Corporation, the owner of Melbourne airport.
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Old 27th Feb 2002, 01:02
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Talking

When the Fat Lady sings, we want an encore from the Silver Budgie!
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Old 27th Feb 2002, 01:06
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From NineMSN (quoting AAP as the source)

. .07:09 AEDST Wed 27 Feb 2002 . . . . . . . .Ansett deal reportedly facing collapse

The Ansett sale could be on the brink of collapse after Solomon Lew and Lindsay Fox reportedly walked away from talks with administrators on Tuesday night.

According to a report in the Herald Sun, final talks between the two parties failed to seal the $453 million sale of the airline to the Fox-Lew syndicate.

It came just hours after administrators secured the vital lease of the Sydney Airport terminal.

The newspaper said Mr Fox and Mr Lew were believed to have decided their business plan for a revived Ansett would not work.

A source confirmed administrators Anderson were in talks until the early hours of today.. . . . . .But he said they believed they had met all the requirements for the sale to go through by Thursday's deadline.

The Sydney Airport lease was regarded as a major stumbling block to the sale of Ansett to Tesna.

The newspaper said the chances of the talks resuming between the two parties were now slim.
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Old 27th Feb 2002, 02:06
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Well she is singing now. . .You lot with the rose coloured glasses can take them off now. It is all over.
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Old 27th Feb 2002, 02:16
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ABC News Net

Wed, Feb 27 2002 8:43 AM AEDT

. . . .Fears Ansett deal could collapse

There is confusion this morning about the future of Ansett.

A crucial part of the deal has been agreed to, but there are reports that the airline's prospective owners are having second thoughts about the purchase.

The Sydney Airports Corporation says it has formally agreed to give Tesna the Ansett Domestic Terminal lease at Sydney Airport.

The corporation says it has written to Ansett's administrators advising them of the news.

It has released a statement saying the corporation has negotiated a deal in good faith and delivered in time for the administrators and Tesna to complete the sale process on February 28.

The Civil Aviation Safety Authority (CASA) says it is willing to issue Tesna with an air operators' certificate, provided crucial documents are handed over today.

CASA has given the consortium until midday AEDT to submit the documentation.

A spokesman for the authority says once that happens, CASA will be in a position to transfer the air operators' certificate from the administrators to Tesna by midnight Thursday, allowing the consortium to take to the skies on Friday.

However, newspaper reports this morning suggest Ansett's prospective new owners, Solomon Lew and Lindsay Fox, may be experiencing doubts about the deal, and that an overnight meeting between them and the administrators broke up without resolution.

Meanwhile, a spokesman for Federal Transport Minister John Anderson says the Federal Government has done everything within its power to make the deal a reality.
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Old 27th Feb 2002, 02:27
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From the Financial Review

Tesna ends talks on Ansett. .Feb 27 09:07. .Giles Parkinson

. .Mr Solomon Lew and Mr Lindsay Fox said on Wednesday that talks between their syndicate, Tesna Holdings, and the administrators of the failed Ansett Airlines have ceased.

Tesna said agreement could not be reached on assigning domestic terminal leases to the syndicate and on matters such as environmental risk and the use of Ansett's IATA designator code.

"Discussion have taken place with the administrators concerning options for resolving the outstanding issues and finalising the sale,'' Tesna said in a statement.

"In light of those discussion, and in consideration of our advice, we have reluctantly reached the conclusion that the sale agreement is not capable of completion, and that the process involving Tesna and the administrators cease.''

The statement said the failure of the deal was not attributable to the failure of merger talks with Virgin Blue.

"We have spent the past five months doing little else but working towards the finalisation of the Ansett purchase,'' the statement said.

"We have committed an enormous amount of resources, our professional advisors have worked tirelessly, but the obstacles and hurdles we have encountered from a range of parties have had the effect of consuming both resources and time.

"In all of the circumstance and to our great disappointment, time has run out.''

. .I hope to all, still with Ansett some good comes of this shocking outcome
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Old 27th Feb 2002, 03:17
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After five months of hoping it is sad to see it come to this.

No matter who the people are or your views on other historical matters, the fact remains that firstly as many as 16,000 and more recently 4,000 staff have been cruelly strung along by various parties only to be dumped on the garbage heap again.
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Old 27th Feb 2002, 03:22
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Red face

Mr Corrigan and the Lang Corp will be able to get there bounty afterall - and at a far more attractive price.

What next?? <img src="confused.gif" border="0">
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Old 3rd Mar 2002, 12:46
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The Fat lady has sung, where now for Aviation as a career in this Country? I have seen the future and it does not look good. One possible future is Qantas chopping off its domestic arm, as it will not be able to compete with Virgin Blue's low costs. Qantas domestic may go the same way as Ansett. I see Australia as simply a training ground for Pilots who will head off to greener pastures O/S.. .. .Any comments??. .. . <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="eek.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="eek.gif" />
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