Ansett,TAA and the good old days!
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Ansett,TAA and the good old days!
Remember the times years ago when we had a two airline policy, a duopoly and a regulated airline enviroment?. .. .Times were good weren't they? The airlines were healthy, a good place to work. We all pulled together in our respective airline. We overnighted together in Darwin, Cairns, Alice Springs , Adelaide and Perth.. .. .TAA and Ansett together with wit and repartee.Both flying the same A/C type .Both departing the next day within 5 minutes of each other. The biggest challenge being who would taxi out first! Only the colour of the shirts was the difference between us!. .. .Then the " tree huggers " and the " bleeding hearts " came on the scene closely followed by the " economic rationalists " , the republicans and the ' free trade " theorists!. .. .We must deregulate they said, introduce competition, lower air fares and provide air travel to the lowest common denominator!. .. .Well, we have been doing that for 12 years now! . .. .And what a gigantic cock up it has been!!. .. .Now at last we are back to the good old days. Two airlines in Australia...albeit one of them catering to the lowest common denominator, mores the pity.. .. .The days when airline flying was for the privileged and the elite are far gone unfortunately. The days when as a pilot , hostess, flight engineer,lame, traffic clerk, baggage handler etc we all pulled together..all gone , and we all know why!. .. .But , in a quasi return to those days we will see Virgin replacing Ansett in competition with "TAA". Hopefully the end of ridiculous fares, perhaps the return of a little bit of class and even the return of some of the "couth and and grace " of passengers of old!. .. .If only!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" />. . . . <small>[ 15 March 2002, 09:39: Message edited by: amos2 ]</small>
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Absolutely, old bean. Much better class of person in those days, what? By jove, people treated pilots with respect, as did the hosties, because they knew who was boss, oh yes indeed. But then women accepted a little slap around occasionally in those days to remind them of their place. And golly, it all worked spiffingly, what?. .. .I blame it on the republicans. And there's not enough discipline in the schools either. Bloody lefties.
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Guys Im just as romantic about the old days as you are. Get me at the bar with you lot and we would still be reminising over our fifly-fiflth beer at stumps. But Im also a realist. It was a great alright but those days are over, gone, kaput. Aviation world over is now run by industrialists and banks, not by gentlemen who loved the sound of an aeroplane on finals or the smell of an oily rag. Slowley going too are whats left of real pilots. Next time ask your FMC-breastfed kid in the right seat if hed like to join you for some aeros in a Moth later on down the club. I can easily foretell the reply! Or pull out your WAC chart and ask him where we are without referance to the toys. Its enough to make you weep.. .. .Those who adapt survive. Its no use sayin how great things were and that the full circle will turn. I can tell you now it wont.. .. .Now, whos for some aeros? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" />
Moderate, Modest & Mild.
.....and there was a "seniority system" which guaranteed every pilots'length of employment time with the company was recognised.. .The 5 minute difference was really seen as same-time departures, and as you said Amos, the winner was determined by who called for taxi clearance or "ready" first (by taking an intersection departure), or occasionally by a high speed climb on an offset parallel track and getting ahead.. .Employees felt secure.. .The rivalry at work was matched by the friendly social competitive events (eg. the cricket matches) that were regularly held.. .. .You're right Slasher - I flew with an F/O the other day who had absolutely NO concept of track miles or descent profiles (height vs dist to run), but used only the FMS generated (bs in = bs out) info. His idea of a visual approach was to drag the @rse in from 20 miles out and enter downwind at 1500', gear down <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="rolleyes.gif" /> ......all concept of fuel and time saving non-existent (the new concept of being "time efficient" is to taxi at Vr speed) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="mad.gif" /> . And this guy is one of the "senior F/O's who will see his command within a year!!!!. .. .Who knows WHEN stability will return to the Oz airline industry - esp. with the prospect of Spirit and Australian Airlines starting up before year's end.. .. .BTW, Ansett really WAS the better of the two!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="cool.gif" />
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Whiskery,. .No, the "cold pot" belonged to the piston era when a big mag drop was detected and the aircraft returned to the tarmac with the good mag off so that the engineers could detect which "cold pot" needed a plug or lead change. And a pack of cigs was 25 pence and bread 15 pence or so. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" /> . .. .amos2,. .The REAL Ansett and TAA was before the blue shirts at AN. Blue shirts came with Abeles. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="mad.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="frown.gif" />
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There was stuff that needed to be cleaned out sure...but there was gold too.. .. .There was a time when Australia SET world standards in jet operations rather than following them or having them made up by Dick S.. .. .DC9 training in TAA in the early 1970's was gold plated...are there any Frank Fischers, Eddie Clarks, Don Winchs, Bill Maloneys etc out there now? These guys were part of an outfit that was first in so many things.. .. .The things I teach my F/Os now are the things I learned then. I was taught them by pilots who learned the "hard way" in WW2 and in the early days of piston airliners.. .. .Frank Ball was the last great airline CEO in Australia. An absolute gentleman who had well and truly "been there and done that". Business Schools will one day start studying the reasons our industry became a laughing stock ( a follower rather than a leader) and it will be finally deduced that it was when people like Frank left that it all started falling apart.. .. .But it was good while it lasted.. .. .Safe flying. .. .Sherm
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It's enough to make you weep, they were indeed the good ol days.. .. .You can get as bolshie as you like about the new breed of great unwashed traveller, but for those of us in west dunnunda forced to endure 4 or 5 hours of real up close and personal with them every other day or so the pioneering introduction and I think it was by Ansett, of Premium Economy or Business Class got my money every time.. .Your fellow J class person might not have been all that less unwashed and maybe only just a better class of criminal but at least you weren't cheek by jowl with them.. .. .BTW an interesting 'bit' fell out of the radio talk back from a former Reg Ansett Airways employee a former "air hostess" now enjoying her great grandchildren.. .It may be a chicken and egg thing but, apparently the Govt as part of the WW11 effort and for reasons known only to them, banned interstate airline flights. Reg and the others I guess, being the ever resourceful persons airline owners tend to be, arranged that you flew/drive to the border of the state into which you wished to travel then crossed the border to fly from there to the Capital.. .Hamilton/Penola and Albury/Wodonga were probably quite busy airfields, the rest as they say is history.. .. .Once again Government has a peculiar way of breeding resourcefulness against bureaucracy.. .. .As the anthropologist guy in Jurassic Park 11 said "life will find a way" <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" /> . .. .Anyone got any history on this.
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You know,one might now hope that as Virgin are about to become " the other airline " in Australia's new two airline policy ( please don't mention Spirit ! ) that they might now drop this el cheapo budget price nonsense that really only applies and appeals to the poms!. .. .After all the only people that support budget airlines are budget people more suited to the bus lines!. .. .Sure, you and I buy a ticket with Virgin but only because of the stupid price!. .. .Well, I did that once but never again, and as my wife said..." you may not have standards but I do. ". .. .I mean it was bad enough that they only had peanuts and coke ( which you pay for ) but they had run out of peanuts and coke!!. .. .Anyway, I travel to Sydney these days on a regular basis and I fly Qantas, and that's a pain too because of you know what, but budget airlines ...no thanks!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" />
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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica">After all the only people that support budget airlines are budget people more suited to the bus lines!</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica">I doubt that the airlines care WHO the money comes from, black, white, brown, brindle, tall, short, fat, thin, garbos or doctors - the value of their dollar is equal. Personally I'd prefer to travel with Virgin Blue to support my mates there, but if Qantas is flogging off cheaper seats and travelling at the times I want to go, then I'll fly with them (and I will be in April - because they are flying at the times I want to go, whereas Air Sheep was considerably cheaper, but their times are cr@p).. .. .Have you never eaten at McDonald's, Burger King. or Sizzlers, Amos? Or is that only for Poms and "budget people more suited to the bus lines" as well?. .. .However, I think that your statement illustrates that there is a percentage of the population, such as you and the missus, Amos, who would make a third, non-budget airline feasible in Oz, and might well be Mike Dickson's entree for his SPIRIT Airlines.
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Well, I gotta tell you M...I don't eat at Mcdonalds, Sizzlers and... was it Burger King?. .. .And not just because they are also el cheapo...but because the food ain't that good. And it certainly ain't good for you!. .. .Look, we all know you get what you pay for...If you want quality you have to pay for it. You don't have to be a brain surgeon to work that out.. .. .The thing that disturbs me is that your mates in Virgin are also my mates and they are being paid money that you certainly wouldn't work for and neither will I.They have their reasons for being back here but that doesn't mean they should be paid peanuts!. .. .Budget airlines mean budget pilots...what sort of respect does that engender for current Virgin pilots...very little I would suggest...and they deserve more than that! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="smile.gif" />
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Pterodactyl me old china, actually the blue shirts came well before Abeles.. .Remember the meeting with RM at the Jet Engine workshop in Niddrie in '72? The one where he said:" No one shall tell ME if I can talk to my pilots!!", Well, the Chocolate Soldier was approached by someone, who said something like: " C.. - why don't we alter the style of our uniform a bit so we don't look like the other mob?". .The CS said "No!". .Within a year, we had single breasted uniforms without gilt buttons, and blue shirts.. .Yessee, the CS only worked when you wound him up.
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Sub-Sonic MB,. .You may well be right about that. The old noggin is not quite the steel trap that it used to be. I wasn't at that meeting at the engine shop.. .. .Chocolate Soldier? Stir the embers a little for me. I recall quite a few of the seagull and other nomenclature but that one escapes me at the moment...most probably will flash up later.. .. .But there were many interesting nicknames such as Walter Mitty,Captain Kot**, The Count, Mirror, The Vicar and The Bishop, Dusty and several others of the earlier era and later, Billy the Kid or Cane Toad, Dr No etc. And of course many others throughout the network.. .. .It was a relief to get rid of the double breaster with the brass buttons as well as the White plastic topped caps which went to complete the image of a Spanish Admiral. Think the caps went also when the shirts changed. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" />. . . . <small>[ 17 March 2002, 23:20: Message edited by: pterodactyl ]</small>
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Sub-Sonic MB,. .Got it!! in a flash...Col C.....?. .Knew it would flash up on screen when I least expected it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" />