Ansett Mk II Folds Nov. 12
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Ansett Mk II Folds Nov. 12
Heard on the "gripe" vine that what ever way The Election goes that AN Mk II will cease very shortly after Nov 11. According to Fin Review yesterday they need 200 mil to survive NOW! ALP making all the right noises but after Nov 11 even if they fall over the line the cheque will be cancelled.
The only AN outfit that is viable doesn't even have a buyer according to my sources in the west, Skywest.
The administrators and unions have really played the unfortunate staff for a bunch of suckers.
Any Thoughts?
The only AN outfit that is viable doesn't even have a buyer according to my sources in the west, Skywest.
The administrators and unions have really played the unfortunate staff for a bunch of suckers.
Any Thoughts?
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Whatever your feelings and views are that sort of remark is just not necessary here.
W
Up Up and Away those of us that still can.
[ 02 November 2001: Message edited by: Woomera ]
W
Up Up and Away those of us that still can.
[ 02 November 2001: Message edited by: Woomera ]
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The word on the "gripe" vine in the west is that there are six definately interested parties in Skywest, including the big "Q".
Final submissions by these folk is reported to be end of November.
Final submissions by these folk is reported to be end of November.
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sniffer,i take it YOURE not going to lose YOURE house over this debacle,all must be fine then.Likewise two wrongs don't make it right. W
[ 02 November 2001: Message edited by: Woomera ]
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I wouldn't count Skywest out just yet!
And I hope the 2 Marks for their sake, leave the Ansett piggy bank with at least as much money in it as they started with.
[ 02 November 2001: Message edited by: gaunty ]
And I hope the 2 Marks for their sake, leave the Ansett piggy bank with at least as much money in it as they started with.
[ 02 November 2001: Message edited by: gaunty ]
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Mentha has been concerned about the loss of some A320 crews,needs them for the obvious and consequently has met a group to allay their fears.
Has the airnz money in the kitty and would announce a buyer of AN before the election if the government guarantees the ticket tax funds.
Have some nice real estate I`m gambling on but if any of the above mouths would like a wager on the side,say a nice bottle of Henschke,I`d be happy to further gamble that AN will survive beyond the election.
Has the airnz money in the kitty and would announce a buyer of AN before the election if the government guarantees the ticket tax funds.
Have some nice real estate I`m gambling on but if any of the above mouths would like a wager on the side,say a nice bottle of Henschke,I`d be happy to further gamble that AN will survive beyond the election.
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Ah Cooda nothing like the chatter of the financially illeterate..
AN Mk II to continue to minimum January and a buyer by mid November.
Hmm Wind coming from south Tarzan..............
Thank you Cheetah,,,,,,,,,,,,,
AN Mk II to continue to minimum January and a buyer by mid November.
Hmm Wind coming from south Tarzan..............
Thank you Cheetah,,,,,,,,,,,,,
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In actual fact, things are looking very positive at AN from behind the scenes at 501.
You blokes only know what the ******** journos have to say. The Administrator's phasers are still well and truly powered up.
You blokes only know what the ******** journos have to say. The Administrator's phasers are still well and truly powered up.
B'ar
Not commenting on ANII's prognosis.
Simply that if it folds the Administrators will be the only group to do well out of it.
Or does that only happen in the non-aviation fields?
Not commenting on ANII's prognosis.
Simply that if it folds the Administrators will be the only group to do well out of it.
Or does that only happen in the non-aviation fields?
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OK Woomera I accept that I was out of line, point taken.
However I was once a loyal employee of that once great outfit and had it taken away from me by the avarice of a few at the expense of so many.
Those that are now howling to be saved must take some of the blame for the demise of AN
along with policies introduced by "the fat man" in the late 70's & 80's.
And to those bleeding hearts carrying on about losing houses, etc where was your sympathy when it was happening to us after being shafted by the "fat man " and the "silver budgie" because we wanted to stand on our principals and exercise our right to be free to carryon our profession without being subservient to tyrannical managment. All you weak sods could do was charge back with your tail between your legs. WELL NOW YOU ARE PAYING THE PRICE.
Unfortunately for most of you, you will now have to find new vocations or hopefully live off your immoral earnings for the rest of your lives if it will last. Because not only has the "cash cow" gone down but Sept 11 dealt you a mortal blow so much so that IF you could find a position most O/S Co's have a strong post '89 influence which would bar your way.
Cheers "The Dog"
However I was once a loyal employee of that once great outfit and had it taken away from me by the avarice of a few at the expense of so many.
Those that are now howling to be saved must take some of the blame for the demise of AN
along with policies introduced by "the fat man" in the late 70's & 80's.
And to those bleeding hearts carrying on about losing houses, etc where was your sympathy when it was happening to us after being shafted by the "fat man " and the "silver budgie" because we wanted to stand on our principals and exercise our right to be free to carryon our profession without being subservient to tyrannical managment. All you weak sods could do was charge back with your tail between your legs. WELL NOW YOU ARE PAYING THE PRICE.
Unfortunately for most of you, you will now have to find new vocations or hopefully live off your immoral earnings for the rest of your lives if it will last. Because not only has the "cash cow" gone down but Sept 11 dealt you a mortal blow so much so that IF you could find a position most O/S Co's have a strong post '89 influence which would bar your way.
Cheers "The Dog"
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Will the administrator do well out of it, or will he face legal action from disaffected staff when (if) it all falls over.
Example
F/Os in a regional are being paid around 75% of the casual award.
Argument is they agreed (were coerced). However an employee can not give up there award entitlements without the 'no disadvantage test being applied'
Southern Skies P/L v Koch K.K.K (1998)
The awards are still valid, except that it has had standdown clauses inserted, i.e if there is no work for you don't get paid..
However, all of the Regional (Airline) awards provide for seniority, i.e. last on first off. And there is no provision for the use of casual staff. Therefore, it can be concluded that standowns have been applied to the wrong staff, that is the most senior should still be at work with the most junior stood down (first).
A problem arises with the issue of (more) senior staff not being current on a former type. In this case it could probably be successfully argued that that person no longer met the statutory requirement(for the former position). However, if one and only one person within the organisation, has received any recurrency trainning to revalidate themselves, then the issue of being not current is redundant.
In summary
1) I am not a P1ssed off Ansett Pilot.
2) Work for the correct wage troops, and go after them if they are shafting you. Don't accept, the we can not afford to pay you ****, it's been heard before.
3) The senior guys that are being shafted, get together and get some good legal advise.
Example
F/Os in a regional are being paid around 75% of the casual award.
Argument is they agreed (were coerced). However an employee can not give up there award entitlements without the 'no disadvantage test being applied'
Southern Skies P/L v Koch K.K.K (1998)
The awards are still valid, except that it has had standdown clauses inserted, i.e if there is no work for you don't get paid..
However, all of the Regional (Airline) awards provide for seniority, i.e. last on first off. And there is no provision for the use of casual staff. Therefore, it can be concluded that standowns have been applied to the wrong staff, that is the most senior should still be at work with the most junior stood down (first).
A problem arises with the issue of (more) senior staff not being current on a former type. In this case it could probably be successfully argued that that person no longer met the statutory requirement(for the former position). However, if one and only one person within the organisation, has received any recurrency trainning to revalidate themselves, then the issue of being not current is redundant.
In summary
1) I am not a P1ssed off Ansett Pilot.
2) Work for the correct wage troops, and go after them if they are shafting you. Don't accept, the we can not afford to pay you ****, it's been heard before.
3) The senior guys that are being shafted, get together and get some good legal advise.
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sniffer dog,
Don't talk about principles. The fact is that it was about a pay increaseof about 30% for doing an average of 35 stick hours a month.
Without excusing Abeles and Hawke for their outrageous tactics let us not forget that you were delivered into your predicament by an ego driven incompetent bunch of posers.
Having been trapped into resigning and therefore losing all legal right to be re- employed and maintain previous seniority and other benefits not to mention forfeiture of a months pay in lieu and the long service benefits of those with less than 10 years service amounting to a gift to the enemy of about $50 million you did not then confront reality.
The reality was, whether you like it or not, that the ONLY way forward from there was to make your own decisions becaiuse there was nothing the AFAP could do to rectify the damage they had wrought.
In your blind endeavour, then and now, to seek revenge you have ignored the plight of other people both inside the company and in business who lost homes AND businesses as a result of that debacle perpetrated by the AFAP.
So, for the sake of revenge on 200 or so you are quite happy for the balance of 16000 company employees as well as countless others to suffer on your account.
And, by the way, since you talk of 30 pieces of silver from Abeles and you had such a view of his character, how come you were happy to accept the money before?
Don't talk about principles. The fact is that it was about a pay increaseof about 30% for doing an average of 35 stick hours a month.
Without excusing Abeles and Hawke for their outrageous tactics let us not forget that you were delivered into your predicament by an ego driven incompetent bunch of posers.
Having been trapped into resigning and therefore losing all legal right to be re- employed and maintain previous seniority and other benefits not to mention forfeiture of a months pay in lieu and the long service benefits of those with less than 10 years service amounting to a gift to the enemy of about $50 million you did not then confront reality.
The reality was, whether you like it or not, that the ONLY way forward from there was to make your own decisions becaiuse there was nothing the AFAP could do to rectify the damage they had wrought.
In your blind endeavour, then and now, to seek revenge you have ignored the plight of other people both inside the company and in business who lost homes AND businesses as a result of that debacle perpetrated by the AFAP.
So, for the sake of revenge on 200 or so you are quite happy for the balance of 16000 company employees as well as countless others to suffer on your account.
And, by the way, since you talk of 30 pieces of silver from Abeles and you had such a view of his character, how come you were happy to accept the money before?
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Thought you guys would like to know just had a call from a "journo" mate of mine that Howard will get past the post BUT AN Mk II WON'T. No time frame mentioned the betting is sooner rather than later.
Evertonian
FSU.
You beat me to it. They never mention the 30% or the resignations do they?
I hear that Lang corp. are possibly another interested buyer. They seem to want SQ to run it though.
You beat me to it. They never mention the 30% or the resignations do they?
I hear that Lang corp. are possibly another interested buyer. They seem to want SQ to run it though.