Legal Windows and re-installing W8
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From: Walton on the Naze Essex.
Legal Windows and re-installing W8
I'll keep this separate from the sound thread and I've touched on this before, but I am still confused about the W7 installation on this Asus UX31A. Despite the MS deal being it can be changed back to W7 from W8, I have a feeling this 'Ultimate' has been erm, acquired.
There seems no motive for this apart from getting away from the madness of the full installation. That left 68 gig - I think 5 being used for quick start alone. Nice, but costly when you've only got 123 gig total. The first machine on W8 really did boot in about ten seconds, but with this solid drive the computer is up and running in about twenty-seconds anyway. Hardly worth another partition and loss of 5% of the remaining space.
How do I find out if a copy of MS is genuine? And indeed, what version is 'given' when one reverts from W8. This one is showing Service Pack 1
I'm still confused as to the procedure for loading W8 from scratch. A USB stick seems the only option according to the vendor. He went on to say one puts in the Serial number of the notebook - and indeed I knew the key is imbedded in the firmware - but is this all that's necessary?
There seems no motive for this apart from getting away from the madness of the full installation. That left 68 gig - I think 5 being used for quick start alone. Nice, but costly when you've only got 123 gig total. The first machine on W8 really did boot in about ten seconds, but with this solid drive the computer is up and running in about twenty-seconds anyway. Hardly worth another partition and loss of 5% of the remaining space.
How do I find out if a copy of MS is genuine? And indeed, what version is 'given' when one reverts from W8. This one is showing Service Pack 1
I'm still confused as to the procedure for loading W8 from scratch. A USB stick seems the only option according to the vendor. He went on to say one puts in the Serial number of the notebook - and indeed I knew the key is imbedded in the firmware - but is this all that's necessary?
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L. Rivits
"but I am still confused about the W7 installation on this Asus UX31A."
Please see here. Have you tried this sequence.
How to Check if Windows 7 is Genuine? - Help Desk Geek
or
Genuine Windows: frequently asked questions - Microsoft Windows
CAT III
Please see here. Have you tried this sequence.
How to Check if Windows 7 is Genuine? - Help Desk Geek
or
Genuine Windows: frequently asked questions - Microsoft Windows
CAT III
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From: Walton on the Naze Essex.
Thanks CAT III, I'll come back after a probe round - having just started at 00:30.
mixture, it has a Windows8 sticker on the bottom, just like the one from Bust Buy but this one is in good condition. A bit more about that.
When I got the display model from BB, the sticker was in a tatty condition, about 20mm square and it looked as if they'd removed the number part I thought perhaps because people steal them. Their Geek Squad said, No, its identity is now stored in the machine. Seemed a good ploy to protect software and I thought no more about it, well, not the sticker anyway. I was concerned about trying to breath life into it if it failed 'down the route.' (I'd got a UK friend's Vista going again this summer with my backup discs.)
It all became academic when I returned the unit. However, now I'm in the same boat again.
The computer was advertised on Craig$list and sold by a young chap who is employed by a local tech company. He had purchased a Mac. It seemed his trade's interface software would not work on W8 and he had stated the Asus was running W7. I assumed he'd rolled it back from 8 as per MS agreement, but he, like me, objected to the bizarre number of logical drives devoted to the system and recovery. I was pleased about that until he dropped the bombshell about the source of the soft while in my house. He assured me A, that it was kosher, and B, that he'd put it back to W8 if I wished. It's a bit of a drive to his workshops, plus a lot of hanging around, so I'd like to do it myself it possible. Now, here's the thing. If I do the normal re-install, I'm stuck with the partitions again. Erm, I am, aren't I? Or is that quite separate Asus issue?
The other thing is that it's an Ultimate version on it now. I somehow doubt the roll-back would have been that. Difficult one, and I want to get this right before loading my Office etc., as I'd already loaded that on the one I returned and am wondering about MS and the number of times I can do that. (A 3 seat copy.) I'm sure life was never this complicated.
Ah, but then this doesn't have such a compartment. 
I have to say in these early hours, I'm a little worried. Having run though the checks CAT linked, I see it hasn't been activated. I'm just wondering what I'm going to find next.
It's not just the money, but I stood talking on my drive for half an hour with this guy and got so involved with chatting I didn't even make a note of his Reg number which I normally do. I'd be greatly saddened if he was being dishonest. But then, I'm the most gullible person on Earth. Because I wouldn't dump my problems on someone, I more often than not assume they won't do it to me. Doh!
.
mixture, it has a Windows8 sticker on the bottom, just like the one from Bust Buy but this one is in good condition. A bit more about that.
When I got the display model from BB, the sticker was in a tatty condition, about 20mm square and it looked as if they'd removed the number part I thought perhaps because people steal them. Their Geek Squad said, No, its identity is now stored in the machine. Seemed a good ploy to protect software and I thought no more about it, well, not the sticker anyway. I was concerned about trying to breath life into it if it failed 'down the route.' (I'd got a UK friend's Vista going again this summer with my backup discs.)
It all became academic when I returned the unit. However, now I'm in the same boat again.
The computer was advertised on Craig$list and sold by a young chap who is employed by a local tech company. He had purchased a Mac. It seemed his trade's interface software would not work on W8 and he had stated the Asus was running W7. I assumed he'd rolled it back from 8 as per MS agreement, but he, like me, objected to the bizarre number of logical drives devoted to the system and recovery. I was pleased about that until he dropped the bombshell about the source of the soft while in my house. He assured me A, that it was kosher, and B, that he'd put it back to W8 if I wished. It's a bit of a drive to his workshops, plus a lot of hanging around, so I'd like to do it myself it possible. Now, here's the thing. If I do the normal re-install, I'm stuck with the partitions again. Erm, I am, aren't I? Or is that quite separate Asus issue?
The other thing is that it's an Ultimate version on it now. I somehow doubt the roll-back would have been that. Difficult one, and I want to get this right before loading my Office etc., as I'd already loaded that on the one I returned and am wondering about MS and the number of times I can do that. (A 3 seat copy.) I'm sure life was never this complicated.
You can typically find the COA sticker on the body of the computer or, for some newer laptops, inside the battery compartment.
this fishy smelling laptop you've acquired ?
It's not just the money, but I stood talking on my drive for half an hour with this guy and got so involved with chatting I didn't even make a note of his Reg number which I normally do. I'd be greatly saddened if he was being dishonest. But then, I'm the most gullible person on Earth. Because I wouldn't dump my problems on someone, I more often than not assume they won't do it to me. Doh!
.
Last edited by Loose rivets; 22nd December 2013 at 06:58.
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From: Earth
it has a Windows8 sticker on the bottom
Getting hold of the OEM media to reinstall might be a bit of a challenge, but the original hardware manufacturer (Asus) might be happy to oblige ?
The other option (which admittedly would involve parting with more money) would just be to buy a retail copy of Windows to install on your laptop. This would have the added benefit of being a transferrable license (unlike the OEM license), so perhaps giving you a little extra flexibility in the future.
. Now, here's the thing. If I do the normal re-install, I'm stuck with the partitions again. Erm, I am, aren't I?
Used to be easy in the old days when Microsoft gold hologram CDs were distributed with the hardware, but now with electronic media, you either need the manufacturer's assistance or access to the right parts of the Microsoft website (do you have a kosher PC repair shop near you who might be willing to burn a DVD for you ?).
Their Geek Squad said, No, its identity is now stored in the machine.
Since time immemorial (and I don't think they've changed the policy with Windows 8), Microsoft have made it a contractual requirement for system manufacturers / system builders / whatever you want to call them to affix the OEM (COA) sticker to the machine if they are bundling an OEM Windows license with the machine.
The OEM Windows license lives and dies with the machine, hence the policy requirement of affixing the tamper-proof sticker to the machine.
Evidence of tampering with said sticker does not bode well, and infact, if you're not going to do anything else, you should at least anonymously report the seller to Microsoft via the anonymous FAST system.
But then, I'm the most gullible person on Earth.
Major aspects of software licensing are easy for most to get a grasp on and blatantly obvious to spot.
But nitty gritty stuff like this... you have to have a had a few years experience in the industry to be able to spot it on a whim. Its easy to spot when you know what you're looking for, but most people only ever buy one or two PCs and refresh them every five or more years... so they don't get the practice of looking out for stuff.
Bit like buying second hand cars really... I'd probably end up buying a lemon if left to my own devices with Craig$list.
Last edited by mixture; 22nd December 2013 at 11:39.
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From: Walton on the Naze Essex.
I'll give BB and Asus a call very soon. I'll also talk to the vendor at some length - this time sticking to the point. (I don't suppose you've guessed my mind tends to grasshopper about.)
The W8 sticker is in mint condition, almost a square with the top tilted at the angle of the windows which change colour from green to reddish brown. Hard to forge I'd imagine. Not a hint of a Key in it.
The vendor pointed to a long number and bar code on the 'transformer' saying that was an easy way to see the Serial Number. Time will tell. I certainly have never heard of putting the SN in in lieu of a key.
Cars on Craig$list. I've sold three on there, including the @#$@$ Mercedes. In each case I gave the purchaser a list of tech info. The MB had an End of contract check at a main dealership, the buyer having been appraised of the replacement of almost everything over 20,000 miles. Now they even changed the hydraulically-damped engine mounts for good measure - all on my insurance. The bloke had owned it for about 60 seconds when the warning system told of a fuel sensor failure. $1,300. My team paid for that. So he was slightly better off with Craig$list than I was with the original MB Warranty which side-stepped nicely the gearbox failure - dumping it on my insurers despite it being a known fault.
Thanks for all your input on this.
The W8 sticker is in mint condition, almost a square with the top tilted at the angle of the windows which change colour from green to reddish brown. Hard to forge I'd imagine. Not a hint of a Key in it.
The vendor pointed to a long number and bar code on the 'transformer' saying that was an easy way to see the Serial Number. Time will tell. I certainly have never heard of putting the SN in in lieu of a key.
Cars on Craig$list. I've sold three on there, including the @#$@$ Mercedes. In each case I gave the purchaser a list of tech info. The MB had an End of contract check at a main dealership, the buyer having been appraised of the replacement of almost everything over 20,000 miles. Now they even changed the hydraulically-damped engine mounts for good measure - all on my insurance. The bloke had owned it for about 60 seconds when the warning system told of a fuel sensor failure. $1,300. My team paid for that. So he was slightly better off with Craig$list than I was with the original MB Warranty which side-stepped nicely the gearbox failure - dumping it on my insurers despite it being a known fault.
Thanks for all your input on this.
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From: Walton on the Naze Essex.
Okay, being Texas, the Geek was alive and well on a Sunday.
"The Key is imbedded in the motherboard. You no longer have to put in a key."
He says, they plug in a DVD player. (has to be external as this thing is as thin as a razor blade.) and load W8. The software looks at that particular computer and okays it . . . or not.
So, I need to download it or get a DVD attachment, $39 on the big river, and then make a stick to carry if I don't want to lug the DVD. Okay, doable. Then I have to roll back the soft to W7 to get back to where I am. (don't need Ultimate.)
This should do two things. A, get me kosher with MS, and it seems logical that law enforcement folk would feed stolen kit into a MS database and wait for it to be registered. I wonder if that happens.
Right, now to see what Asus say about it. May have to wait 'till Monday for that.
"The Key is imbedded in the motherboard. You no longer have to put in a key."
He says, they plug in a DVD player. (has to be external as this thing is as thin as a razor blade.) and load W8. The software looks at that particular computer and okays it . . . or not.
So, I need to download it or get a DVD attachment, $39 on the big river, and then make a stick to carry if I don't want to lug the DVD. Okay, doable. Then I have to roll back the soft to W7 to get back to where I am. (don't need Ultimate.)
This should do two things. A, get me kosher with MS, and it seems logical that law enforcement folk would feed stolen kit into a MS database and wait for it to be registered. I wonder if that happens.
Right, now to see what Asus say about it. May have to wait 'till Monday for that.
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From: Walton on the Naze Essex.
Well, 04:00 Monday and fading fast. Just to say I got through to Asus and they said just pour in the software and it, and the computer will recognize each other.
I'm concerned with what I'd have left if this handshake didn't take place.
I'm concerned with what I'd have left if this handshake didn't take place.
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From: Walton on the Naze Essex.
Just mooching about in forums while waiting to visit the kids. I'm getting concerned.
There seems to be continuous reference to
There seems to be continuous reference to
. One of the improvements Microsoft is making to Activation 3.0 for newly built machines that come preloaded with Windows 8, you won’t have a COA (Certificate of Authenticity) sticker attached to the machine anymore. Instead, this will be embedded in the BIOS. This will avoid product keys from being compromised and OEMs will buy what they need.
Last edited by Loose rivets; 25th December 2013 at 18:50.
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From: Earth
Loose rivets,
For the "horses' mouth" version, see here....
How to Tell ? Hardware
Namely "A properly licensed PC should include either a Genuine Microsoft Label or a Certificate of Authenticity (COA) Label. See the following examples of labels to look for."
So it does look like the larger manufacturers get to take advantage of Activation 3.0.
Still leaves you in need of obtaining the correct version of Windows 8 I guess....
Maybe I misunderstood what you were asking, but it is a day of festivities and I've been doing the cooking !
For the "horses' mouth" version, see here....
How to Tell ? Hardware
Namely "A properly licensed PC should include either a Genuine Microsoft Label or a Certificate of Authenticity (COA) Label. See the following examples of labels to look for."
So it does look like the larger manufacturers get to take advantage of Activation 3.0.
Still leaves you in need of obtaining the correct version of Windows 8 I guess....
Maybe I misunderstood what you were asking, but it is a day of festivities and I've been doing the cooking !
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From: Walton on the Naze Essex.
Hah! I didn't expect anyone on the sensible forums tonight. I've just escaped while the family play poker . . . two miles away, so I can't have a drink.
I think you may have hit the nail on the head about obtaining the correct version of 8. I'll have to talk to Asus again. Last time they didn't seem to put much effort into the details.
Have a relaxing Boxing day.
I think you may have hit the nail on the head about obtaining the correct version of 8. I'll have to talk to Asus again. Last time they didn't seem to put much effort into the details.
Have a relaxing Boxing day.
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From: Timbuktu
mixture, I think that you can now legally and officially use a windows 8 sticker in place of a COA, if you fulfil some requirements e.g. UEFI / Secure Boot. This was introduced due to devices with increasingly little "hidden" surface area e.g. tablets, where every side is "for show", and for devices with non-removable batteries.
In this case, the serial number of the machine might indeed be part of the COA.
As for downgrading to W7, I imagine you'd need to speak to MS, probably on the phone, to turn that OEM license into an actual key for W7. AFAIK only the Pro version has "downgrade rights".
In this case, the serial number of the machine might indeed be part of the COA.
As for downgrading to W7, I imagine you'd need to speak to MS, probably on the phone, to turn that OEM license into an actual key for W7. AFAIK only the Pro version has "downgrade rights".
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From: Walton on the Naze Essex.
Okay, here I am hours into messing with this thing and wiser but not certain of the truth.
Asus say they don't supply software. I'm going to test this statement. But I just pour in W8 and it'll go.
Forums say you have to obtain the Key with some free software and have that ready. Time and time again I was taken to getting the key from the existing OS despite searching for CLEAN install.
Best Buy have the discs and they would just port it on. Yesterday, young man said they don't have to enter the Key. He said he'd do it for me, but I'm expecting his manager to levy a charge. (family together has spent several thousands in that store and I was hoping for a freebie) So, I pressed on.
Got through to MS in double-quick time!! Nice man a long way away said it will work - but I was totally confused. Not during the conversation, but when I entered this link he gave me.
Microsoft Corporation (that has to be com, surely)/en-us/windows-8/upgrade(yes, I questioned that)-product-key-only
It didn't run. More
However, he did two things. One was to refer me to the Office 2010* and the other was to say they might make me a special case and issue me with a temporary Key should all else fail. So, there's hope.
Even so, there is confusion on weather I can load 8.1 right away. Some say yes, and some no. It's a loooooong upgrade from 8 to 8.1, and I'm sure stuff is left behind.
I need 8.1 in particular because this upgrade allows making a USB stick recover backup - freeing the miniscule 123gig SS drive of three partitions for recover.
*Since I'd been a bit quick loading Office on the Asus I'd returned to Best Buy, I was worried about losing one of my installations. MS Office-specific department took some minutes to check but then confirmed I had another 'seat' available on my 3 seat copy.
Asus say they don't supply software. I'm going to test this statement. But I just pour in W8 and it'll go.
Forums say you have to obtain the Key with some free software and have that ready. Time and time again I was taken to getting the key from the existing OS despite searching for CLEAN install.
Best Buy have the discs and they would just port it on. Yesterday, young man said they don't have to enter the Key. He said he'd do it for me, but I'm expecting his manager to levy a charge. (family together has spent several thousands in that store and I was hoping for a freebie) So, I pressed on.
Got through to MS in double-quick time!! Nice man a long way away said it will work - but I was totally confused. Not during the conversation, but when I entered this link he gave me.
Microsoft Corporation (that has to be com, surely)/en-us/windows-8/upgrade(yes, I questioned that)-product-key-only
It didn't run. More
However, he did two things. One was to refer me to the Office 2010* and the other was to say they might make me a special case and issue me with a temporary Key should all else fail. So, there's hope.
Even so, there is confusion on weather I can load 8.1 right away. Some say yes, and some no. It's a loooooong upgrade from 8 to 8.1, and I'm sure stuff is left behind.
I need 8.1 in particular because this upgrade allows making a USB stick recover backup - freeing the miniscule 123gig SS drive of three partitions for recover.
*Since I'd been a bit quick loading Office on the Asus I'd returned to Best Buy, I was worried about losing one of my installations. MS Office-specific department took some minutes to check but then confirmed I had another 'seat' available on my 3 seat copy.
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From: Walton on the Naze Essex.
I've just posted this on the HowTo Geek forum. They e me routinely, and I happened to spot a relevant thread.
At this point in time I am awaiting the full W8.1 discs from MS. They're a fraction of the price and it did take supervisor level intervention, but you know, there's is still a principal involved here. I'm paying cash out to use my machine with MY Key. A key that seemingly is cunningly hidden from its owner. Just don't get it - in both senses of the phrase.
At this point in time I am awaiting the full W8.1 discs from MS. They're a fraction of the price and it did take supervisor level intervention, but you know, there's is still a principal involved here. I'm paying cash out to use my machine with MY Key. A key that seemingly is cunningly hidden from its owner. Just don't get it - in both senses of the phrase.
I purchased an Asus UX31A from somewhere you can buy the best stuff. I upgraded to 8.1
I subsequently purchased another one, this time for half the price. It was running W7 and I assumed he'd rolled it back legally. Now I find he did not, and what's more, one can not roll back to 7 without 8 being Professional. Lots of misinformation when buying kit these days.
Tallked to MS. Asus, BB, several times each. Even MS bod did not agree with his colleague on the matter of putting in the Key. Asus, BB and MS have all said put the new software in ( on a clean install) and the computer / software will recognize each other and it will work. Yeh, right. Finally, up to supervisor level and they let someone have the case number that is sending a full version. But there's a charge. A bargain really, but still somewhat galling to think I can't just download and put MY key in.
I'm aware there are utilities to extract this Key from the BIOS or wherever it lies, but every one I found is looking into the OS software. Oh, my. DOS was so much easier.
So now I have to buy a USB DVD to start proceedings unless I can run the DVD - to USB stick conversion on another computer. I MUST NOT risk the second machine by having the discs start an instal.
So, can this be done safely on another (W7) machine with full version 8.1 discs making the USB bootable? SAFELY.
Sorry, my shouting is involuntary. wink
I subsequently purchased another one, this time for half the price. It was running W7 and I assumed he'd rolled it back legally. Now I find he did not, and what's more, one can not roll back to 7 without 8 being Professional. Lots of misinformation when buying kit these days.
Tallked to MS. Asus, BB, several times each. Even MS bod did not agree with his colleague on the matter of putting in the Key. Asus, BB and MS have all said put the new software in ( on a clean install) and the computer / software will recognize each other and it will work. Yeh, right. Finally, up to supervisor level and they let someone have the case number that is sending a full version. But there's a charge. A bargain really, but still somewhat galling to think I can't just download and put MY key in.
I'm aware there are utilities to extract this Key from the BIOS or wherever it lies, but every one I found is looking into the OS software. Oh, my. DOS was so much easier.
So now I have to buy a USB DVD to start proceedings unless I can run the DVD - to USB stick conversion on another computer. I MUST NOT risk the second machine by having the discs start an instal.
So, can this be done safely on another (W7) machine with full version 8.1 discs making the USB bootable? SAFELY.
Sorry, my shouting is involuntary. wink
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From: Timbuktu
LR, just grab an empty flash drive with 8gb or more space, download and install the "Windows 7 USB download tool" (here) , and follow the instructions.
Despite its name it works perfectly well with versions of Windows that are newer than 7 (as well as Windows Server).
Despite its name it works perfectly well with versions of Windows that are newer than 7 (as well as Windows Server).
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From: Walton on the Naze Essex.
Mmm, well I got as far as being told to browse for the ISO file, and that was it.
Totally lost pretty well right away.
Doing all again from scratch went differently, no uninstall/repair box jamming the procedure, but shortly asked for the ISO file again. Looked down the path in the icon properties, and after about five sub directories, came to a blank. Not the folders I in the path, and those that were there were empty.
Trouble is, with so little knowledge, I'm flummoxed all too easily. I know what an ISO file is, but I've never been asked to browse for one with no knowledge of where to look.
A few clues lead me here. Could it be I need this?
Time to give up - maybe tomorrow my brain will have revived.
Totally lost pretty well right away.
First Attempt and then Uninstall. Also, running the download left me with nothing but a selection box for repair and uninstalling. If I tried to shut that down it asked if I wanted to cancel the download program installation. Which of course, I didn't.
Finally I ignored that and just ran from the icon on the desktop which looked very professional. That's when I got the browse thing which just looked at the local discs. Odd.
Finally I ignored that and just ran from the icon on the desktop which looked very professional. That's when I got the browse thing which just looked at the local discs. Odd.
Trouble is, with so little knowledge, I'm flummoxed all too easily. I know what an ISO file is, but I've never been asked to browse for one with no knowledge of where to look.
The following are frequently asked questions about using the Windows 7 USB/DVD Download Tool:
Where can I download .NET framework 2.0?
The .NET framework can be downloaded here.
Where can I download .NET framework 2.0?
The .NET framework can be downloaded here.
Time to give up - maybe tomorrow my brain will have revived.
Last edited by Loose rivets; 3rd January 2014 at 05:18.