I hate fan noise. PWM control.
Psychophysiological entity
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I hate fan noise. PWM control.
I'm in the wrong place for someone that hates fan noise. It's part of life here, but my den is very, very quiet. The HP is near to perfect after a momentary burst of fan on start-up, it settles to almost silent running.
The home build I got second-hand, has a system fan that's a pain, though it has a BIOS which shows speed settings. It also has a 4 pin plug for the fan, but only a three wire fan. Easy I thought, buy a better fan. But, the HP only has three wires as well! Back to the drawing board.
Anyone had experience of this issue, and a sure way to find out how to proceed? Also, an idea of some of the obscure settings in the BIOS. Temp on etc., is simple enough, but they talk of Slope and other mysterious terms.
The home build I got second-hand, has a system fan that's a pain, though it has a BIOS which shows speed settings. It also has a 4 pin plug for the fan, but only a three wire fan. Easy I thought, buy a better fan. But, the HP only has three wires as well! Back to the drawing board.
Anyone had experience of this issue, and a sure way to find out how to proceed? Also, an idea of some of the obscure settings in the BIOS. Temp on etc., is simple enough, but they talk of Slope and other mysterious terms.
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I've built many PCs. Always use high quality Sanyo (San Ace) 12V fans and run them off 5V. Nice and quiet but plenty powerful 
The ten-bob cheap fans used in all PCs are almost guaranteed to seize up within 2-3 years.
The ten-bob cheap fans used in all PCs are almost guaranteed to seize up within 2-3 years.
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If it is controllable, it will be in the BIOS, probably under power settings and probably called speed fan or Q-fan or similar- it'll be an on/off option.
The burst of fan noise you hear on the hp, is the fan being fully powered before the BIOS directs the system to cut the power as it reads the system temperature data. My home box does the same.
Not all BIOS'es have it, you may find you're plain out of luck.
Edit: I've just looked in my BIOS for you & it lives in Power optios>Hardware monitor and it's called Q fan and is either enabled or disabled.
The burst of fan noise you hear on the hp, is the fan being fully powered before the BIOS directs the system to cut the power as it reads the system temperature data. My home box does the same.
Not all BIOS'es have it, you may find you're plain out of luck.
Edit: I've just looked in my BIOS for you & it lives in Power optios>Hardware monitor and it's called Q fan and is either enabled or disabled.
Psychophysiological entity
Thread Starter
I like the idea of using the low voltage on a good quality fan, but as I mentioned 
I do have the settings in the BIOS - it's just that they don't do anything.
Cheap case I know, but I don't want to get a 4 wire fan only to find that's not the answer. That was the - perhaps obscure - reason that I mentioned the HP. It varies the speed with only three wires.
I'll get back with the settings options
I do have the settings in the BIOS - it's just that they don't do anything. Cheap case I know, but I don't want to get a 4 wire fan only to find that's not the answer. That was the - perhaps obscure - reason that I mentioned the HP. It varies the speed with only three wires.
I'll get back with the settings options
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Why the dislike of fan noise, LR? Does it, perhaps, mask the rattle of loose rivets in the case?
Have you considered those ear insert things kindly provided by decent airlines,especially on overnighters?
Have you considered those ear insert things kindly provided by decent airlines,especially on overnighters?
Psychophysiological entity
Thread Starter
As one that never hears silence - since spending an obscene amount of time shooting pistol - I'm very aware of any white noise. Here, cars are often at 120f on entering, and the noise of fans goes from there and continues into the home. Horrible.
I'm almost done with the new build, it'll do until I get W7 licensed copy, but before I box up, I must get it quiet. I suppose I could scope the output to the fan...the pulse width should vary on one of the pins. Hardly a space to put the scope at the moment.
BIOS I'm leaving the CPU fan at Full On Mode
The Off PWM temperature is set to [40]. So high that it should always be off.
Start PWM temp I set to 41, not really knowing what hysteresis to allow.
But then it gets more confusing. I've got Start PWM value requiring a Dec number
Got me there. and...
Slope PWM value. is set to 2.
All this is academic, if the bloke purchased a cheap fan. However, it would be nice to know what these other parameters are about.
I'm almost done with the new build, it'll do until I get W7 licensed copy, but before I box up, I must get it quiet. I suppose I could scope the output to the fan...the pulse width should vary on one of the pins. Hardly a space to put the scope at the moment.
BIOS I'm leaving the CPU fan at Full On Mode
The Off PWM temperature is set to [40]. So high that it should always be off.
Start PWM temp I set to 41, not really knowing what hysteresis to allow.
But then it gets more confusing. I've got Start PWM value requiring a Dec number
Got me there. and...
Slope PWM value. is set to 2.
All this is academic, if the bloke purchased a cheap fan. However, it would be nice to know what these other parameters are about.
Psychophysiological entity
Thread Starter
Read the f***** manual.
There was no doubt that the Foxconn site went to the wrong page after finding ONE reference to the MB. However, the kid that sold it to me suddenly, a few hours ago and just as I was leaving from getting the last few things, handed me two rather encrusted discs. One was the MB disc, with a superb manual. Just got it loaded.
Yes, they seem to offer a device that looks like a 1950's chrome juke box that takes over all BIOS functions. It explains slope, but not why there are seemingly two temperature figures to start the fan.
The first thing is to get a fan that obeys the BIOS. One will win, but the time taken is getting out of all proportion. The manual was 100 pages long, a lot of it straightforward, but a few things totally new to this dinosaur.
NB His flat was like a scene from 'The Yong Ones.' and I took home a Flatron W1952. TQ as part of the deal. I didn't want it, but when I...erm, liberated it from a mixture of kebab sauce and porridge, it's fantastic. 75hz refresh at 1440. and a more practical size than the 24" which I'll dedicate to photography.
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You don't want Foxconn, you want the BIOS makers site. American Megatrends, Phoenix, Mr. BIOS or whoever. Or rather you do if you want to obtain a bios manual to understand the settings at the BIOS level.
A quick look at Foxconn's site shows they do supply utility software and I attach the link to the page, but I would strongly urge that you understand what you're downloading before you do so.
Computer BIOS links
Foxconn - Support - Downloads
A quick look at Foxconn's site shows they do supply utility software and I attach the link to the page, but I would strongly urge that you understand what you're downloading before you do so.
Computer BIOS links
Foxconn - Support - Downloads
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Mr Rivets doesn't want the Bios manufacturer site, he wants Foxconn. All the manuals he needs are there, together with the utilities such as Fox LiveUpdate that will keep all his drivers and BIOS tickety-boo. If I remember this is a A7GM-S, and Google shows a link to download page for the manual as the sixth item from where I'm sat. American Megatrends BIOSes are particular to the individual motherboard in terms of default settings and general control set. For example, the AM site is unlikely to have any documentation on the Fox Intelligent Stepping feature in the BIOS.
Both the CPU and case fan headers are 4-pin: they expect PWM fans with control and sense lines. As with Intel motherboards, you can get by with a 3-pin fan but then you won't have speed control on pin 4. Since Mr Rivets says the BIOS settings don't do anything to the fan, I suggest it's a 3-pin fan.
Rivets, hysteresis is the difference between the turn-on temperature and the turn-off temperature, for example. Using a hypothetical fan in a hypothetical computer, a hysteresis of 3 means that if a fan turns on as the temperature passes through 40C, it will turn off at 37C on the way down. This stops the fan hunting around trigger point.
If the fan is too noisy for you, buy a bigger one: moving the same volume of air through slower blades. And at least read enough of the manual to discover the "Cool 'n Quiet" feature (with the right fan).
Both the CPU and case fan headers are 4-pin: they expect PWM fans with control and sense lines. As with Intel motherboards, you can get by with a 3-pin fan but then you won't have speed control on pin 4. Since Mr Rivets says the BIOS settings don't do anything to the fan, I suggest it's a 3-pin fan.
Rivets, hysteresis is the difference between the turn-on temperature and the turn-off temperature, for example. Using a hypothetical fan in a hypothetical computer, a hysteresis of 3 means that if a fan turns on as the temperature passes through 40C, it will turn off at 37C on the way down. This stops the fan hunting around trigger point.
If the fan is too noisy for you, buy a bigger one: moving the same volume of air through slower blades. And at least read enough of the manual to discover the "Cool 'n Quiet" feature (with the right fan).
Psychophysiological entity
Thread Starter
I'm getting there. Hysteresis was just a word I plonked in there . . . their way of putting two start figures will become apparent when I get the fan I guess.
All in all it's showing a huge improvement in performance compared to the HP 640p When I walk back to the other desk it really does seem slow.
As you I think mentioned, the on board graphics are splendid. I have to disappoint a Craigslist guy who wants to sell me a 1Gig PCI X something. I can't see that it could be much better for still photography. Very much better than the other machine with a half Gig board in it.
Right now I've just registered W7 second copy RC on this. Also the Office 2010 Beta. The W7 started flashing at me within 24 hours to get me to register.
I don't know how long the Office Beta lasts for.
I learned a though lesson with the old machine. I put the new LG on it, and it didn't auto set up. Lots of fluffing around, and I realized that I'd extended the lead years ago and the second half was made from a lead that didn't have a full compliment of pins. As soon as I changed the lead, it set itself up to perfection. I don't think they had reverse telemetry in those days.
All in all it's showing a huge improvement in performance compared to the HP 640p When I walk back to the other desk it really does seem slow.
As you I think mentioned, the on board graphics are splendid. I have to disappoint a Craigslist guy who wants to sell me a 1Gig PCI X something. I can't see that it could be much better for still photography. Very much better than the other machine with a half Gig board in it.
Right now I've just registered W7 second copy RC on this. Also the Office 2010 Beta. The W7 started flashing at me within 24 hours to get me to register.
I don't know how long the Office Beta lasts for.
I learned a though lesson with the old machine. I put the new LG on it, and it didn't auto set up. Lots of fluffing around, and I realized that I'd extended the lead years ago and the second half was made from a lead that didn't have a full compliment of pins. As soon as I changed the lead, it set itself up to perfection. I don't think they had reverse telemetry in those days.
Psychophysiological entity
Thread Starter
Went all the way to CompUSA, only to find they hadn't got a 4 wire fan in the place. Told me to go to NewEgg!
So, back to mod the old fan...can't wait any longer. The labeled 12v gives 2750 rpm. A lot quieter now that I've greased the bearings, but still a bore. 5v gives 1300...still moves air, but a tad on the low side.
Now I was in for a surprise. 15 Ohms set it about right at 1890 rpm, but only a 2 watt wire-wound resistor stayed cool enough to be safe! So, a 'simple pot' would not do. The Maplins' gizmo must have had a chopper circuit in it, or been a hefty wire-wound device.
So, back to mod the old fan...can't wait any longer. The labeled 12v gives 2750 rpm. A lot quieter now that I've greased the bearings, but still a bore. 5v gives 1300...still moves air, but a tad on the low side.
Now I was in for a surprise. 15 Ohms set it about right at 1890 rpm, but only a 2 watt wire-wound resistor stayed cool enough to be safe! So, a 'simple pot' would not do. The Maplins' gizmo must have had a chopper circuit in it, or been a hefty wire-wound device.
Psychophysiological entity
Thread Starter
Since I've had to put this in PhotoBucket for the other thread, here is the ww resistor. I would have put switch in with a 33ohm giving full, 1890, and 1330. (not linear due motor windings) but that'll have to wait for a time when I catch up with odd jobs. ie, never.
it's positioned so that some of the CPU cooler changes the air round it a little.
it's positioned so that some of the CPU cooler changes the air round it a little.
