Headscratching Connection Problem
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,068
Likes: 0
From: Brighton. UK. (Via Liverpool).
Thanks for the replies so far, much appreciated.
It look like the water in the box is the problem then. I will get on to them and see if they can relocate it.
Yesterday I did ping pprune when it was all running ok and this evening when it all stopped, I ran the ping thingy again. Here are the results....
It look like the water in the box is the problem then. I will get on to them and see if they can relocate it.
Yesterday I did ping pprune when it was all running ok and this evening when it all stopped, I ran the ping thingy again. Here are the results....
Microsoft Windows [Version 6.0.6002]
Copyright (c) 2006 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
C
Users\Paul>tracert www.pprune.org
Tracing route to www.pprune.org [67.201.16.181]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 1 ms 1 ms 3 ms 192.168.1.1
2 126 ms * * 10.10.140.1
3 86 ms 9 ms 10 ms brig-core-1a-ge-110-2566.network.virginmedia.net
[80.3.65.33]
4 12 ms 147 ms 29 ms gfd-bb-a-so-020-0.network.virginmedia.net [212.4
3.162.221]
5 164 ms * 138 ms 213.152.245.49
6 192 ms * * so-1-3-0.mpr1.lhr3.uk.above.net [64.125.28.197]
7 128 ms 213 ms 127 ms linx.ge0-3.cr01.lhr01.mzima.net [195.66.227.15]
8 * 276 ms 214 ms eos1-0.cr01.lga02.us.mzima.net [216.193.255.45]
9 * 171 ms 214 ms xe1-0.cr01.lga01.us.mzima.net [216.193.255.213]
10 273 ms 251 ms 127 ms te1-7.cr01.ord01.us.mzima.net [69.174.120.74]
11 * 189 ms 253 ms te0-0.cr02.sjc02.us.mzima.net [69.174.120.9]
12 289 ms 178 ms 232 ms te0-1.cr01.lax02.us.mzima.net [69.174.120.85]
13 * * 240 ms xe1-0.cr01.lax01.mzima.net [64.235.224.181]
14 231 ms 269 ms 359 ms xe0-0.cr01.lax06.us.mzima.net [216.193.255.98]
15 * 243 ms * pprune.org [67.201.16.181]
16 205 ms 251 ms 389 ms pprune.org [67.201.16.181]
Trace complete.
CUsers\Paul>
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Microsoft Windows [Version 6.0.6002]
Copyright (c) 2006 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
CUsers\Paul>tracert www.pprune.org
Tracing route to www.pprune.org [67.201.16.181]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 2 ms 2 ms 2 ms 192.168.1.1
2 * * 40 ms 10.10.140.1
3 10 ms 9 ms 12 ms brig-core-1a-ge-110-2566.network.virginmedia.net
[80.3.65.33]
4 114 ms 156 ms 13 ms gfd-bb-a-so-020-0.network.virginmedia.net [212.4
3.162.221]
5 63 ms * 58 ms 213.152.245.49
6 * * * Request timed out.
7 181 ms 107 ms 108 ms linx.ge0-3.cr01.lhr01.mzima.net [195.66.227.15]
8 120 ms * 137 ms eos1-0.cr01.lga02.us.mzima.net [216.193.255.45]
9 179 ms 105 ms 142 ms xe1-0.cr01.lga01.us.mzima.net [216.193.255.213]
10 * 132 ms * te1-7.cr01.ord01.us.mzima.net [69.174.120.74]
11 * * * Request timed out.
12 318 ms * * te0-1.cr01.lax02.us.mzima.net [69.174.120.85]
13 * 178 ms * xe1-0.cr01.lax01.mzima.net [64.235.224.181]
14 196 ms 181 ms * xe0-0.cr01.lax06.us.mzima.net [216.193.255.98]
15 200 ms 178 ms * pprune.org [67.201.16.181]
16 * * 180 ms pprune.org [67.201.16.181]
Trace complete.
CUsers\Paul>
Copyright (c) 2006 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
C
Users\Paul>tracert www.pprune.orgTracing route to www.pprune.org [67.201.16.181]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 1 ms 1 ms 3 ms 192.168.1.1
2 126 ms * * 10.10.140.1
3 86 ms 9 ms 10 ms brig-core-1a-ge-110-2566.network.virginmedia.net
[80.3.65.33]
4 12 ms 147 ms 29 ms gfd-bb-a-so-020-0.network.virginmedia.net [212.4
3.162.221]
5 164 ms * 138 ms 213.152.245.49
6 192 ms * * so-1-3-0.mpr1.lhr3.uk.above.net [64.125.28.197]
7 128 ms 213 ms 127 ms linx.ge0-3.cr01.lhr01.mzima.net [195.66.227.15]
8 * 276 ms 214 ms eos1-0.cr01.lga02.us.mzima.net [216.193.255.45]
9 * 171 ms 214 ms xe1-0.cr01.lga01.us.mzima.net [216.193.255.213]
10 273 ms 251 ms 127 ms te1-7.cr01.ord01.us.mzima.net [69.174.120.74]
11 * 189 ms 253 ms te0-0.cr02.sjc02.us.mzima.net [69.174.120.9]
12 289 ms 178 ms 232 ms te0-1.cr01.lax02.us.mzima.net [69.174.120.85]
13 * * 240 ms xe1-0.cr01.lax01.mzima.net [64.235.224.181]
14 231 ms 269 ms 359 ms xe0-0.cr01.lax06.us.mzima.net [216.193.255.98]
15 * 243 ms * pprune.org [67.201.16.181]
16 205 ms 251 ms 389 ms pprune.org [67.201.16.181]
Trace complete.
C
Users\Paul>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Microsoft Windows [Version 6.0.6002]
Copyright (c) 2006 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
C
Users\Paul>tracert www.pprune.orgTracing route to www.pprune.org [67.201.16.181]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 2 ms 2 ms 2 ms 192.168.1.1
2 * * 40 ms 10.10.140.1
3 10 ms 9 ms 12 ms brig-core-1a-ge-110-2566.network.virginmedia.net
[80.3.65.33]
4 114 ms 156 ms 13 ms gfd-bb-a-so-020-0.network.virginmedia.net [212.4
3.162.221]
5 63 ms * 58 ms 213.152.245.49
6 * * * Request timed out.
7 181 ms 107 ms 108 ms linx.ge0-3.cr01.lhr01.mzima.net [195.66.227.15]
8 120 ms * 137 ms eos1-0.cr01.lga02.us.mzima.net [216.193.255.45]
9 179 ms 105 ms 142 ms xe1-0.cr01.lga01.us.mzima.net [216.193.255.213]
10 * 132 ms * te1-7.cr01.ord01.us.mzima.net [69.174.120.74]
11 * * * Request timed out.
12 318 ms * * te0-1.cr01.lax02.us.mzima.net [69.174.120.85]
13 * 178 ms * xe1-0.cr01.lax01.mzima.net [64.235.224.181]
14 196 ms 181 ms * xe0-0.cr01.lax06.us.mzima.net [216.193.255.98]
15 200 ms 178 ms * pprune.org [67.201.16.181]
16 * * 180 ms pprune.org [67.201.16.181]
Trace complete.
C
Users\Paul>Administrator
Joined: Mar 2001
Aviation Qualifications: PPL
Posts: 8,121
Likes: 686
From: Twickenham, home of rugby
Yes,
It looks like it is working - sort of, only just.
There are long delays for very close devices and lots of time-outs (the * signs). This suggests that the line is very poor.
My average round-trip time to PPRUNE is 155ms - it's taking you nearly that long to get to your 4th hop!
It would explain why email works when everything else doesn't - email is not "real time", in the sense that it can continue trying in the background when you aren't looking, while with web browsing the delays are self-evident, and when the delay is too great, your web browser gives up and reports an error. The protocol for email is also "smaller", and the data transfer is generally much less than with web traffic (large attachments excepted).
I just hope this doesn't fall between two companies - BT for the landline connection and Virgin for the ADSL, with both blaming the other.
SD
It looks like it is working - sort of, only just.
There are long delays for very close devices and lots of time-outs (the * signs). This suggests that the line is very poor.
My average round-trip time to PPRUNE is 155ms - it's taking you nearly that long to get to your 4th hop!
4 114 ms 156 ms 13 ms gfd-bb-a-so-020-0.network.virginmedia.net [212.4
3.162.221]
3.162.221]
I just hope this doesn't fall between two companies - BT for the landline connection and Virgin for the ADSL, with both blaming the other.
SD
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,663
Likes: 0
From: Earth
There are long delays for very close devices and lots of time-outs (the * signs). This suggests that the line is very poor.
Traceroutes in the wrong hands can be a waste of time and give the wrong impression.
All sorts of technical wizardry can give the impression of time outs..... (e.g. packet filters a.k.a. firewalls that you encounter along the way).
Try something like MTR (http://www.bitwizard.nl/mtr/) if you want a more useful traceroute.... (but bear in mind that the same potential for taceroute weaknesses apply)
Administrator
Joined: Mar 2001
Aviation Qualifications: PPL
Posts: 8,121
Likes: 686
From: Twickenham, home of rugby
Mixture,
When you get some responses and some * from the same host, that's an indication of excessive delays. When you get some * from the next-hop device, you KNOW it's delay!
All *, yes, that can mean other things.
A firewall does one of two things - forwards a packet or drops it, based on the rules it has been configured with. It doesn't introduce random delays. This is where you tend to see all *, where it has been configured not to forward ICMP traffic.
Traffic shaping, on the other hand, can prioritise certain types of traffic, and could possibly be responsible for dropping lower priority ICMP packets.
Traceroute analysis in the wrong hands can be a waste of time and give the wrong impression.
SD
When you get some responses and some * from the same host, that's an indication of excessive delays. When you get some * from the next-hop device, you KNOW it's delay!
All *, yes, that can mean other things.
A firewall does one of two things - forwards a packet or drops it, based on the rules it has been configured with. It doesn't introduce random delays. This is where you tend to see all *, where it has been configured not to forward ICMP traffic.
Traffic shaping, on the other hand, can prioritise certain types of traffic, and could possibly be responsible for dropping lower priority ICMP packets.
Traceroute analysis in the wrong hands can be a waste of time and give the wrong impression.
SD
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,663
Likes: 0
From: Earth
SD,
Don't want to drift this thread any further, PPRuNe isn't really the place for discussing nitty gritty of ISP networks...
Random delays are to be expected on the internet, there are bottlenecks here and there ..... good ISPs know how to use the weapons in their arsenal to take care of routing around it....
However, sort of back on-topic, I should remind you that your most ADSL/Cable type connections do not come with any SLAs, so you get what you pay for in terms of potentially unpredictable performance because you are at the bottom of the ISP customer food chain.
Don't want to drift this thread any further, PPRuNe isn't really the place for discussing nitty gritty of ISP networks...
Random delays are to be expected on the internet, there are bottlenecks here and there ..... good ISPs know how to use the weapons in their arsenal to take care of routing around it....
However, sort of back on-topic, I should remind you that your most ADSL/Cable type connections do not come with any SLAs, so you get what you pay for in terms of potentially unpredictable performance because you are at the bottom of the ISP customer food chain.
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,068
Likes: 0
From: Brighton. UK. (Via Liverpool).
For those interested here is the traceroute whilst the connection was good, followed by one just done when the connection dropped out again just now.
(If you are wondering why it is a Sky.com rather than Virgin, the Sky account still works over a year after I stopped using Sky and it is better than the web based Virgin/NTL mail which I hate!!)
(If you are wondering why it is a Sky.com rather than Virgin, the Sky account still works over a year after I stopped using Sky and it is better than the web based Virgin/NTL mail which I hate!!)
Microsoft Windows [Version 6.0.6002]
Copyright (c) 2006 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
CUsers\Paul>tracert smtp.tools.sky.com
Tracing route to bskyb-smtp.l.google.com [74.125.43.208]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 2 ms 1 ms 1 ms 192.168.1.1
2 26 ms 10 ms 40 ms 10.10.140.1
3 * 61 ms 38 ms brig-core-1a-ge-111-2567.network.virginmedia.net
[80.3.65.37]
4 34 ms 100 ms 59 ms gfd-bb-a-so-020-0.network.virginmedia.net [212.4
3.162.221]
5 20 ms 91 ms 87 ms gfd-bb-b-ae0-0.network.virginmedia.net [213.105.
172.6]
6 20 ms 25 ms 40 ms man-bb-a-ae3-0.network.virginmedia.net [213.105.
175.145]
7 112 ms 20 ms 49 ms man-bb-b-ae0-0.network.virginmedia.net [62.253.1
87.178]
8 51 ms 26 ms 92 ms tele-ic-3-ae0-0.network.virginmedia.net [212.43.
163.70]
9 56 ms 108 ms 65 ms 162-14-250-212.static.virginmedia.com [212.250.1
4.162]
10 * 52 ms 41 ms 209.85.252.76
11 208 ms 60 ms 146 ms 216.239.43.123
12 75 ms 100 ms 74 ms 66.249.95.133
13 134 ms 94 ms 93 ms 216.239.48.5
14 53 ms 38 ms 88 ms 64.233.174.53
15 42 ms 106 ms 73 ms 209.85.255.249
16 117 ms 91 ms 142 ms bw-in-f208.1e100.net [74.125.43.208]
Trace complete.
CUsers\Paul>
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Microsoft Windows [Version 6.0.6002]
Copyright (c) 2006 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
CUsers\Paul>tracert smtp.tools.sky.com
Tracing route to bskyb-smtp.l.google.com [74.125.77.208]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 4 ms 4 ms 3 ms 192.168.1.1
2 114 ms 49 ms * 10.10.140.1
3 * 102 ms 70 ms brig-core-1a-ge-111-2567.network.virginmedia.net
[80.3.65.37]
4 162 ms 30 ms 66 ms gfd-bb-a-so-020-0.network.virginmedia.net [212.4
3.162.221]
5 93 ms 85 ms 128 ms gfd-bb-b-ae0-0.network.virginmedia.net [213.105.
172.6]
6 22 ms 191 ms 103 ms man-bb-a-ae3-0.network.virginmedia.net [213.105.
175.145]
7 180 ms * 47 ms man-bb-b-ae0-0.network.virginmedia.net [62.253.1
87.178]
8 35 ms 58 ms 26 ms tele-ic-3-ae0-0.network.virginmedia.net [212.43.
163.70]
9 43 ms 28 ms 27 ms 162-14-250-212.static.virginmedia.com [212.250.1
4.162]
10 99 ms 180 ms * 209.85.252.76
11 * 41 ms 32 ms 216.239.43.123
12 42 ms 44 ms 241 ms 72.14.239.199
13 103 ms 143 ms * 209.85.255.102
14 110 ms 64 ms * ew-in-f208.1e100.net [74.125.77.208]
15 45 ms 34 ms * ew-in-f208.1e100.net [74.125.77.208]
16 35 ms * * ew-in-f208.1e100.net [74.125.77.208]
17 61 ms 153 ms * ew-in-f208.1e100.net [74.125.77.208]
18 * * 35 ms ew-in-f208.1e100.net [74.125.77.208]
Trace complete.
CUsers\Paul>
Copyright (c) 2006 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
C
Users\Paul>tracert smtp.tools.sky.comTracing route to bskyb-smtp.l.google.com [74.125.43.208]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 2 ms 1 ms 1 ms 192.168.1.1
2 26 ms 10 ms 40 ms 10.10.140.1
3 * 61 ms 38 ms brig-core-1a-ge-111-2567.network.virginmedia.net
[80.3.65.37]
4 34 ms 100 ms 59 ms gfd-bb-a-so-020-0.network.virginmedia.net [212.4
3.162.221]
5 20 ms 91 ms 87 ms gfd-bb-b-ae0-0.network.virginmedia.net [213.105.
172.6]
6 20 ms 25 ms 40 ms man-bb-a-ae3-0.network.virginmedia.net [213.105.
175.145]
7 112 ms 20 ms 49 ms man-bb-b-ae0-0.network.virginmedia.net [62.253.1
87.178]
8 51 ms 26 ms 92 ms tele-ic-3-ae0-0.network.virginmedia.net [212.43.
163.70]
9 56 ms 108 ms 65 ms 162-14-250-212.static.virginmedia.com [212.250.1
4.162]
10 * 52 ms 41 ms 209.85.252.76
11 208 ms 60 ms 146 ms 216.239.43.123
12 75 ms 100 ms 74 ms 66.249.95.133
13 134 ms 94 ms 93 ms 216.239.48.5
14 53 ms 38 ms 88 ms 64.233.174.53
15 42 ms 106 ms 73 ms 209.85.255.249
16 117 ms 91 ms 142 ms bw-in-f208.1e100.net [74.125.43.208]
Trace complete.
C
Users\Paul>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Microsoft Windows [Version 6.0.6002]
Copyright (c) 2006 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
C
Users\Paul>tracert smtp.tools.sky.comTracing route to bskyb-smtp.l.google.com [74.125.77.208]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 4 ms 4 ms 3 ms 192.168.1.1
2 114 ms 49 ms * 10.10.140.1
3 * 102 ms 70 ms brig-core-1a-ge-111-2567.network.virginmedia.net
[80.3.65.37]
4 162 ms 30 ms 66 ms gfd-bb-a-so-020-0.network.virginmedia.net [212.4
3.162.221]
5 93 ms 85 ms 128 ms gfd-bb-b-ae0-0.network.virginmedia.net [213.105.
172.6]
6 22 ms 191 ms 103 ms man-bb-a-ae3-0.network.virginmedia.net [213.105.
175.145]
7 180 ms * 47 ms man-bb-b-ae0-0.network.virginmedia.net [62.253.1
87.178]
8 35 ms 58 ms 26 ms tele-ic-3-ae0-0.network.virginmedia.net [212.43.
163.70]
9 43 ms 28 ms 27 ms 162-14-250-212.static.virginmedia.com [212.250.1
4.162]
10 99 ms 180 ms * 209.85.252.76
11 * 41 ms 32 ms 216.239.43.123
12 42 ms 44 ms 241 ms 72.14.239.199
13 103 ms 143 ms * 209.85.255.102
14 110 ms 64 ms * ew-in-f208.1e100.net [74.125.77.208]
15 45 ms 34 ms * ew-in-f208.1e100.net [74.125.77.208]
16 35 ms * * ew-in-f208.1e100.net [74.125.77.208]
17 61 ms 153 ms * ew-in-f208.1e100.net [74.125.77.208]
18 * * 35 ms ew-in-f208.1e100.net [74.125.77.208]
Trace complete.
C
Users\Paul>
