There is no hate, sure I was a bit blunt though.

What I was pointing out that there is without doubt more Canadian pilots working ion other countries than pilots form other countries working in Canada.

If you want to stop foreign pilots in Canada, then how about stop Canadian being pilots in other countries, then watch the real mayhem as many experienced folks who also many of them don't take crap from some dodgy operators that seem to get away with it Canada. How many more unemployed pilots would there be.

You can't have it both ways.

OK, it's not both ways though. What you need to remember through, is that the majority of those pilots are working off shore because they have no choice. How many business failures have there been (in the Canadian aviation scene) in the last 15 years? I'm quite sure that most of those guys really had no choice, they had to make the decision to go abroad to work just to feed the family. They have a legal licence to work in a foreign country, and are a needed profession. (Read up on that subject, there's tons of info out there.) You can't put the blame on them if your career path is stalled when they come back home...and like I said previously, most of them are coming home to retire and won't be in your way. Those returning pilots have a legal right to return to Canada and if there's a job they qualify for, they can apply just like you. What irks me is that the TFW program is being challenged by a bunch of sleazy operators and non Canadian pilots are flying in Canadian seats...that's your real issue, not returning Canadians.

How many Canadian pilots are flying for Australian Aircraft Operators after said operators claimed to the Australian Governement that there was a pilot shortage in Australia, that they had attempted to recruit Australian pilots but had been unable to hire sufficient numbers and had no choice but to look abroad for foreign pilots ? Zero

I can make the same statement for New Zealand, the United Kingdom, Germany, the Netherlands, Belgium, the United States, the Czech Republic........

In all these countries, local aircraft operators hire local pilots who are legally allowed to work in the country and who are also licenced to fly in the country (or in the EU for EASA member countries)

These Canadian Aircraft Operators that use the Temporary Foreign Worker Program (TFWP) recruit abroad and sponsor the foreign pilots into Canada with a job offer and a work permit after claiming to the Government of Canada that no Canadian pilot qualified for the job.

This year, they are taking it a step further by claiming that a bunch of Freshly laid off Canadian B737NG pilot are not "suitable" and that they need foreign pilots instead........

Other high time and older Canadian B737NG Captains are being turned away by being told that they would be offered low paying seasonal First Officer positions while all the Seasonal Captain position, although advertised in Canada, would go to TFW pilots from Europe (a contract requirement)

Circular logic nonsense. The whole point of the original post was to try and mitigate ignorance surrounding the issue, obviously it didn't quite succeed.

The vast majority of Canadian pilots working overseas are not displacing native citizens of their host countries. They are in the places where expat pilots are needed to fill the gap. To use one example, Emirates Airline in the UAE has pilots from over 80 nations - including Canada - working for them. There are no Emirati pilots sitting around unemployed because more Canadians are working in the UAE than Emirati pilots in Canada. I promise. Likewise for any other of the carriers in the Middle East, China, Indonesia, etc.

Totally different in Canada. Lots of experienced pilots in Canada, companies like Sunwing just don't want to pay to train them on their equipment, but would rather take the Euro pilots who have paid for their own training. Good business move, of course. Keep costs as low as possible. But what is good for the narrow interests of one company, hardly benefits the whole.

So the farcical situation results, of qualified Canadian pilots collecting employment insurance from the government, while a corporation brings in foreigners to collect tax-free wages. And the market distorts, as the incumbents attempt to compete with the cost advantage enjoyed by Sunwing.

Protectionism you say? Is it not a rather important mandate of any government to try and protect its citizens? The government has failed spectacularly in that regard.

But the theory of Canadian expat pilots returning en masse to Canada is ridiculous, they couldn't afford the crap wages and high taxes. Besides, most wouldn't even be "qualified" to work at Sunwing, they way they have structured their job descriptions. So, no heavy captains coming to take those NG FO jobs. :ugh:

Best post yet Nolimit.

Even in Europe?

I'm quite sure that most of those guys really had no choice, they had to make the decision to go abroad to work just to feed the family. They have a legal licence to work in a foreign country, and are a needed profession. (Read up on that subject, there's tons of info out there.)

Exactly what I am saying, this is why there are foreign pilots in Canada.

I flew in there, till I realized how weak TC was. :mad: (It was kind of fun till it was bloody dangerous) I paid Canadian taxes, legally converted an ATPL, was given a work visa in 4 days and flew. It is Canadian law that allowed and pretty much invited me to do this, you see Canadian pilots did the opposite and worked in other countries, because they wanted to, yes they were displacing other locals, that's how the cookie crumbles, they also never broke the law. Whats the problem ?

Yes, I agree that some Canadian operators are expert airwork operators that are not taking local jobs. But most Canadians I know, are taking local jobs, but many of the pilots form that country are now flying in Canada.

Personally I have no problem if Canada pulls out of Intl treaties and agreements, many more Canadian will unfortunately have work visa revoked though and end up in Canada fighting for the jobs.

No...they aren't displacing anyone! Are there enough (to use one already very well covered example!) Emerati pilots to keep both airlines in the UAE properly staffed? Nope...or how about China? Nope...or Qatar? Nope...Saudis? Nope... India? Nope...shall I go on? All those countries utilise foreign pilots properly to staff their airlines. The USA (and the FAA) don't allow it, but for some reason Canada does. We are not talking even reciprocity here, that's never been the issue. The problem is allowing TFW pilots, via a crooked system and sleazy operators, there are TFW pilots working when QUALIFIED (yes I'm shouting...) pilots are collecting EI...Open your eyes...please...we are getting tired of repeating the obvious!

Ramifications?
 

It would be good to have an understanding of the situation as it is inconceivable that a Canadian company would hire foreign pilots unless there was a substantial financial advantage. Some questions come to mind:

1. Do foreign pilots work under more lax duty regulations?
2. Are foreign pilots paid less than Canadian pilots?
3. Do the foreign pilots have superior experience/qualifications?
4. What are the financial ramifications for a Canadian company having seaonal employees?

It is surprising that qualified foreign pilots would accept a job with Sunwing when there are so many much more lucrative global contracts available. If their qualifications are not sufficient for the Middle East/Far East carriers then possibly the MOT should be scrutinizing their credentials a bit more closely rather than applying the "rubber stamp".

Those pilots who are stubborn and passionate enough to peruse an aviation career, even after seeing how underhanded and unethical the industry tends to be, then consider the Middle/Far East as there are plenty of opportunities. There is a high price to pay for being so far away from Canada, but for the Middle East in particular, there are positions for a long term career. Harsh conditions, but this is turning into a harsh profession.