Thumperdown, I am quite surprised at your attitude about a strike which doesn't affect you personally (You are BACON aren't you, or am I missing something?).

I would have thought that anyone who has just been shafted by WW's big giveaway to flybe would be glad to see the little pr!ck get his comeuppance.

I have family who are both mainline crew and they are adamant they have had enough of BA's lying and constant cost-cutting at their expense. Fair play to them... Go girls (and boys!) and see if the shareholders are still happy with the leprechaun!

Get Real
 

The reality Sigmond is that CC are considered a liability by management. The current woes re pensions, ask yourself, who created the problem by underestimating the monies required. Your T&C's, who agreed to them and now want to change them, and not improve them. Who does managements "dirty work" on site and then gets "blamed" for the bad decisions made by management.

Another reality is that the cult of managerialism that pervades the business world at the moment is that it is all based on theory. Most airline managers at the moment would not have a clue as to the day to day trials and tribulations of airline crew. It is all about money, taking it out of your wallet and putting it into theirs.

Reverse thruster I have read your post this evening and I applaude you. Like yourself I thank BA for many things. I love the the quality of life that flying for BA provides me with. Like you, I also recognise that we are treated well (mbts and pay) in comparison to other peeps doing the same job elsewhere. However I WILL NOT roll over and bark to Willy Wonkas beck and call. I voted YES and this evening after hours of watching the news, reading the bassa website and ess forums I am proud of myself that I did!!

Today is a proud day for us. we have proved that we are united and p*$@ed off to an airline that pecieves everything to be rosy. I am not crazy enough to think that WW is hiding behind his sofa, like some people have been stating elsewhere!!! I think when he does rear his ugly head he will put up an even uglier fight. It was ugly at Air Lingus and I am sure he will use the media to his advantage just as he did then.

Are we ready? I hope so. I am first to admit the thought of a strike terrifies me. I hope it wont come to that...... but i think somehow I may be deluded to think that it wont. Its not about loosing money as to my reason. Its the hope that we dont cause too much commercial damage why we try to fight our corner. I love my country and to me, working for any other airline other than our flag carrier just doesnt do it for me!! I love wearing our red white and blue....... I am not prepared to settle for plain old Virgin red without a damn good fight!!!!!!!!!!!

Rythm don't be too suprised - I would love to see willy wonka get it where it hurts. :D I also think that the BA cabin crew, on occasion, have had a somewhat condescending view of the rest of the aviation industry. (i.e. when we were described as a bunch of pipefitters and electricians). Whilst I do not wish to see anybody lose anything they have, the real world outside of BA is coming faster than some may think. BA cabin crew are not exempt from the real word or willy wonka. I hope it works out well for all and without too much inconvenience to the fare paying pax. :)

Lots of posts here about BA cabin crew having to get real, and consider what others earn etc.
But the fact is we earn a wage, and have done for many years, that we rely on to support ourselves and our children.

I would understand the need for us to change our terms and conditions should the company be in a postion similar to 9/11, when we did change our t & c significantly in order to survive.

But this attack on our t & c is at a time when the company is doing well, thanks in no small part to our efforts post 9/11, and not to those of an opportunistic management, many of whom weren't around in those difficult times.

P.S. I have no doubt that many posts on this forum are from BA managers in disguise, rumour mongering, scare tactics....dirty tricks....

Ok so you took one crew member off a 747, but what else have you done since 9/11?

I read these pages with interest. I am not crew but fly around 80 times a year for business using mainly BA. After the announcement regarding strike action, like an earlier post, our company issued instructions this afternoon, with immediate effect to use alternative airlines to BA.

As a business our employees cannot afford to be left 'flightless' or 'stranded' by the actions of an airline or its staff. Whilst we are not the largest customer of BA by any means we are not your average holiday maker or traveller taking a couple of flights a year. I estimate as a company we use BA anything up to 750 times a year.

Whilst I wish you well in your negotiations, please also consider the impact of your customer. There are too many choices in the market these days, and whilst the service may not be as good, at the end of the day other providers will also get me from A to B.

Gaining public support
 

Many of the e-mails on here are "inward looking". If BA CC are to succeed with their strikes, they must gain public support. I'm not convinced that current "sickness" levels in BA - at more than twice the UK average, and current working time arrangements (working half the time of teachers), will help BA CC gain public support. I think that CC need to pick an issue which will be supported by the public. The current tactic of complaining about everything is not a good tactic. As with other customers who have posted here - I have a choice and do not have to fly with BA. I happen to prefer to fly with BA, but I need certainty.

gone too far
 

Kedhandi, the descision to vote yes was taken with the impact to our customers in mind, that in itself should tell you how far we have been pushed by our heavy handed, confrontational management. a lot of those who voted in favour of a yes vote did so in the hope that it would make those that run our company wake up and stop taking from the 'little' people while lining their own pockets.
i am sorry to read that you have been told to take your business elsewhere, after all it is the cabin crew, mostly, that are the face of British Airways and give the customer service that brings you back time and time again. we have now been pushed way too far and need to redress that balance and if that means we have to take it all the way to the wall, then we will.

Looked like it when you were all cheering on the telly!

You have to be realistic for this to work - and statements like

simply don't help. Since 9/11 I've worked on SH and LH and for whatever reason BASSA has given no alleviations other than the (paid for) working one down on the 74. In my experience crew have still walked off the a/c at the first limiting opportunity, still made bunk rest on transatlantics a SOP and still refused to do fixed links at LHR.

I despise our managers as much as you do - but I fear for the response you will get. WW cannot afford to be seen to be soft, whatever the rightness of your position (and for gods sake no more cheering on telly please). Make sure you know the legal situation re being sacked too. You can be - and yes it will be illegal but dont expect to get much compo as a result. See the thread on General for details.

The cheering was more for the the actual numbers involved as people and management had been saying that it would be a poor return. To get a 96% yes vote and more importantly an 80% return was a FIRST in ALL transport IR ballots. We made history yesterday - that was what got everyone on their feet. It was relief that a strong message has been sent to our management ( sigmond did you get it?) so we can avert a strike and NOT inconvenience our pax.

BUT if management keep sticking to this mantra that we have to achieve a 10% operating margin ( bearing in mind we are already the most profitable legacy carrier with a margin of 8.2%) then I'm sorry we WILL strike. I'm not prepared to loose alot of my T&C's just because "its in the business plan".

We will not gain public support and we know it. Nurses and police officers have a hard enough time getting any public support, i think our chances are nil.

The large majority of UK public is interested in the cheapest fare they can get with the maximum amount of perks thrown in....end of.
They are not really bothered with the impact this has on pay or working conditions.

A bit like a pair of Nike training shoes. Would the average shopper pay £200 for a pair of trainers made in the UK? Or £80 for the same trainers made in a sweatshop in Cambodia?

I think the 'success' of any industrial action is dependant on the unity of the workforce involved. And with a 80% return and 96.1% 'yes' vote the unity is certainly there.

The true 'success' now rests with the union and BA being able to sit down and thrash out a fair deal for both sides.



FACT: The post '97 basic pay at BA LHR is the market rate.

FACT: The starting basic salary for crew at LGW is significantly below the market average. The LGW take home is in-line (or lower) than most UK LCC's.

FACT: LHR variable pay is generally much better than most UK airlines. But this is VARIABLE. We are not guaranteed a penny of 'variable' income per month. BA are under no obligation to roster us ANY flying. If they wanted we could have 3 months of standby with no flying at all and a takehome pay of around £850.

FACT: When sick we do not have the opportunity to hide behind a desk or 'work from home' with a laptop. The prospect of going to the developing world for a trip when you are not feeling well is not great either. The pilots also whinge about EG300.

FACT: There are un-doubtably a number of BA cabin crew that take the p#ss with attendance. Time off during school holidays, sporting events etc. But EG300 seems to punish the genuinely sick. Yet if you 'play' the system strategically and are careful with dates you can abuse it.

FACT: There is room for change within in-flight service that could save BA money. But there is also a lot of changes that BA could make to improve the working lives of their crews that would not cost a lot and would bring our conditions in line with other airlines. Such as a decent staff travel system (able to have a set number of any nominees, the ability to buy Club ID90 tickets, not having to wait 10 years for our first freebie). A decent bidding system for long-haul (we can request two trips per year and cannot swap any -except back to backs-). A little 'give and take' maybe?

The media and the net chatrooms tend to include the two extremes: the extreme militant faction of cabin crew and those that seem to have a personal grudge against cabin crew. It is usually these two groups that scream the loudest and gain the most attention.

The overwhelming majority of us are just looking for a solution without the need for a strike. However a solution that does not see us being walked all over like a bunch of doormats.

What people who are attacking us on the forum are forgetting is that we are not asking for more, we just want to keep what we've got, I understand the need to stay competitive in the market place but shouldn't management also streamline and not just be lineing their pockets.

/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////EVENING STANDARD 09/AUG/2006//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

£75M SHARES POT TO REWARD BA,s BOSSES

BRITISH AIRWAYS is setting aside 20 million shares currently worth £75m to reward its top brass, headed by chief executive Willie Walsh.

The share will be ring-fenced in a special savings scheme which pays out to BA executives depending on their success in running the business.

The future looks brights for the airlines' executives directors after a 57% leap in first quarter profits gave them a flying start in the quest to drive up performance.

Walsh, who received a total of £961,000 from his May 2005 start date to BA's year end in March,can earn a bonus equivalent to 100% of salary split between cash and shares.

Last year, Walsh who stepped into the chief executives role in october was awarded a £270,000 bonus on top of his £548,000 pro-rata basic pay. His pay has since increased to £600,000.

Other likely beneficiaries of the executive share option scheme-open to middle management up to board director level-include chief financial Kieth Williams.

//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

But Rach BA have no announced plans to change your terms and conditions at all, BASSA are trying to make it sound like they are but there is no actual proposal. When there is I will happily picket with you.

Hotel mode wake up. There have been many proposals to cut cabin crew terms. Increase the retirement age to 65. Get penalised for going sick.
Removal of pursers so reducing chances of promotion further. Shafting of crew based at gatwick.
So please dont think for 1 minute BA cabin crew are being pedantic. They are fighting for what every employee deserves.

Which has been negotiated away should you wish it.

Which your union agreed to and you happily took 1000 pounds for

Worth striking for loss of 20% of senior crew on 30% of fleet? Ie a 6% reduction in promotion. Especially as once again your union has agreed to 2 supervisory crew on the 777 at LGW.

Which again your union has already agreed to.

Every employee deserves to maintain their current T+C as an absolute minimum. Again show me where BA are trying to reduce your current T+C's? I personally hope the new contract crew get some more money especially the Gatwick crew who have the worst T+C mostly cos BASSA dont care if its not LHR.

BASSA want to increase the new contract pay so that it transitions onto the old contract payscales. That, by any definition, is asking for more.

Once again we seem to be hell bent on not supporting cabin crew at a time when they are being targeted left right and centre for ridiculous cost cutting demands.
We could debate on here for hours about the finer details of eroding terms, but still there are the same bitter pilots who regard their cabin collegues as waste of space and use the same management rhetoric that has caused the 96% vote of yes.
Its a shame because we fly on the same aircraft, the same routes, albeit doing a very different job, surely a bit more understanding and compassion wouldnt go amiss.
Maybe because the company has now agreed to inject a further £9million into pilots pension, the 'im alright jack' mentality seems to be spreading. Well im sure not too far down the road Mr walsh will move to the sharp end of the aircraft and see where savings can be made.
Happy Flying.:cool:

If BA were actually after your T+C then you would have my unqualified support but they're not (at the moment) Nowhere in this or the other thread has anyone given a sensible, unemotional reason why the 12 items are worth bringing the company to a standstill for. What happens when they actually go for something significant? like the hourly rate or short haul scheduling do you think the crew will have the stomach for another strike?


I presume you wont be accepting the 6m BALPA negotiated for you in the pension settlement either?

Perhaps you could be more specific on these ridiculous cost cutting issues that BA are targetting you with. Can you justify the MAN base? 5 supervisory crew out of 15?

The fact is despite your union inspired petty sniping at the flight crew there arent actually many savings to be made with us, we work maximum hours with no silly scheduling agreements at a competitive salary by worldwide standards. Fortunately rather than always saying no our union chose to engage the company producing savings for the company and lifestyle improvements for us.

As for the 96% yes vote well what did you expect? Noone knows what they voted yes to and certainly have no idea what they'll go back to work fot but who cares, we got the vote.

Honest question now had you considered strike action on anything other than the pension a possibility before BASSA's famous show of hands in Nov? None of my friends in crew did. Do you not find that odd

I can well understand the euphoria from BASSA members at such a large YES vote, but a YES vote based on what?:}

The 12 points as I understand them:
1. EG300. Not ideal, but since BA cabin crew have such an appalling sickness level what else do you suggest. You signed up for it and took the money!!
2. Down route report times. :ugh:
3. Preferred Duty Free Seller. Best person for the job seems fair to me.
4. Fixed Links. Excellent idea for the 21st century.:D
5. Buses (for commuters). Trivia, all local buses at LHR are free for crew use.
6. Manchester Base. What?:ugh: It's gone.
7. Working Times. BASSA want 900 hrs and stop working, even if it is within the max 2000 hrs duty.
8. Loss of CSD in Eurofleet. CSDs not rqd in S/H, particularly on single isle aircraft!
9. Purser/Junior Swap on 744. What other job do you know that has one big boss & 4 smaller bosses to 'manage' 10 people?:ugh:
10. 1997 Payscales. Have sympathy on this one, but you cannot expect BA to suddenly offer a major increase - UNLESS you guys give up some of your archaic practices: destination payments, one-down payments, MBTs, lack of flexibility re industrial limits etc etc.
11. Pensions. BASSA lied through their teeth! A 'decent' pension decision had already been agredd.
12. LGW Bfst Allow. the need for a bfst allow in L/H is totally different to S/H. Anyway BASSA have totally ignored and deserted the LGW people over the years - so was this just a guilt thing.

I am still totally bewildered at the number of cabin crew that voted YES, but had no idea what they were voting YES for. lots of them still seemed to be under the impression that it was about hourly pay!!!:ugh:

I think WW will take BASSA on, because Rod E did not seem to have the bottle for it.

Sporran are you BA crew? Are you serious?

It seems we have management plants on here too! Hello, the powers that be are going to pocket huge bonuses if they can pull through all the targeted cost savings from cabin crew.We just want what every employee in the 21st century deserves:
To have the chance for promotion,
To get rewarded at a level that is equal or more than we are currently getting,
To be able to report sick without persecution,
To be be provided accomodation on trips that is deemed safe,
To be able to retire at 55 with an achievable pension that means stability.

If only some of the negative comments about our hardest working employees could be directed to the fat cats that are draining our profits, then that would be refreshing.

You guys are not flying for DHL, we actually have customers who pay your wages sitting behind you. It is the cabin crew who bring them back time and time again. Not the latest management cost cutting spin.

As for :ugh: , thats what its like posting on here, as the message doesnt seem to get through.

Pacific Blue

At least 3 out of 5 of your "wish list" are not on the BASSA strike agenda, and 1 (the pension) has fufillled your wish!!

Awaiting results
 

Talks have now ended and BA have requested BASSA to put forward their final proposal re the strike issues by Friday am.

I doubt that BA will accept it. With neither side backing down it's going to be even worse than 97 with that leprechaun at the helm and we'll all be caught up in a nasty dispute that no-one really wants.

I understand frustration from loyal pax, but if you look at the past few years, it's actually never been the fault of CC for any distruption. Ground Staff wildcat strike - nothing to do with us, staff shortages couple of years ago resulting in severe disruption - nothing to do with us in fact BA actually made public statement taking blame, GG/baggage loaders illegal strike - nothing to do with us. Fog, cross debacle, lost baggage, etc etc,

I attended a 'csd in touch' forum with BA managers other day. They said they were 'not suprised' by the the 96% yes vote. That saddens me. What kind of managemet skills have they bought to the company then if such a large majority of their staff feel so unhappy, yet there are soooooo many managers there at our service? There are 3000 pilots at BA with fewer than 20 odd managers. The CC comminity have hundreds! Want to cost cut? OK put your money where your mouth is then guys. All for one and one for all!!

I don't need a CSD, PUR, PE, CCM, DOM etc etc. I'm happy with my direct managers on borad being my CSD/PUR and a DOM for any needs on the ground. My IFA's (of which there are many) relfect I'm doing a great job. I couldn't even tell you my PE's or CCM's name? I've never needed them. Never met them. If I have a problem, there's a perfectly functional DOM on duty all the time.

If they want to save some dosh, fair enough - but lead by example then. You first ...............

By the way, take it from me, (new contractor) BA are NOT as highly paid as the public think.

I think sporran must be taking some of whatever WW and the rest of the waterside flumps are taking.
Point 1 was never agreed to by most areas of BA but instead forced upon staff without any fight from the unions.
If point 3 is true i can't see a problem with that because it eans a beter cut for the crew at the end of the day.
Point 8 is wasted comment from you because the 757/767 do require a CSD.
A reply to point 9 is loo at Waterside or the Compass Centre and thats where a huge similarity exists.There are more senior/junior managers,PA's,assistants to PA's in these places who really don't do alot to help the staff who keep the company going through the hard times or care about the passangers but instead are only interested in their own personal ego.

And there has been no official word from the unions to the staff throughout the company about any agreed pension deal.the members have not agreed to anything and once again it looks like BA has issued another bunch of lies just to ensure the shareprice goes up and to try and deceive everyone.I for one back the cabin crew strike 100% and would also back any action taken buy ground staff.WW is just a bully and since his arriva at BA has set out to demoralise every staff member and change every thing that the company used to stand for.A one point BA was an icon it's now just the laughing stock of the industry.

That's probably the most perceptive comment made on this subject on this or any of the other threads running on this topic.
Good luck

Test post/cc denial post
 

Err do I detect a thread drift here? (Moved from BA strike post) Good luck to you guys and girls, don't let the bast:mad: grind you down. Main thing is, none of you have experience of working a picket line, I trust you'll be picketing?

Tell you this, the nice cops you knew at LGW will no longer be nice cops.
a) They will chat as old pals. Never EVER talk about the union plans/your thoughts about the strike. All is fed back to the Met/Gov Depts/BA in this order.

b) Never, EVER (on your own) talk to members of the press.

I wish you all well, and a speedy victory. I'll be at LGW with coffee and sandwiches to support you guys/gals. But don't expect your parking privileages, BA will 'knock them on the head' for all strikers/people who want a living wage. Train/bus will be the transport to LGW.

Dave
.

They said they were 'not suprised' by the the 96% yes vote. That saddens me. What kind of managemet skills have they bought to the company then if such a large majority of their staff feel so unhappy.

BA has lost touch with the people that drive it's business. It has put cost over both staff and passengers. This strike did not happen over night, it has been brewing for a while for many different reasons. The cabin crew are just voicing what many BA staff already feel.

BA needs to re-examine their HR policies and the rethink the current relationship on the ground and in the Air if they wish to continue to be a world class leader.

The EG 300 'Sickness Policy' can only be described as 'disgraceful' . as it does infringe on many basic Human rights. A destructive policy which punish's the group instead of those responsible, whilist slowly posioning the staff against the airline.

Yes , We need to protect decent working conditions, as well as reasonable pay, which is not an "unreasonable" request.

The numerous contracts and scheduling agreement's which have been introducted into the Regional crew's and ground staff over the past 8 years, is alarming and caused much ill feeling. Mainline has so far escaped the many changes to staff working conditions by remaining united. Well done. :ok:

Hope TU can resolve this with swift talks, and move forward, as punishing the passenger is route most BA staff do not wish to see happen.

Twrecks

At last, some postive posts on here that see the true picture.
What BA want is to have the same sweeping changes to inflight services at LHR that has been imposed at single fleet gatwick. ( and yes hotelmode, we know that this was agreed, A BIG MISTAKE.)
All gatwick crew now have 2 days off after every long haul flight (instead of 3), work 2 crew down on a 777 and only 3 crew on 737. But most importantly only get £2.48 an hour duty pay.
Not only are they stuggling to complete a normal cabin service in under 4 hours they cant afford their average take home of £1200 a month after tax.

I would like to ask any pilot to imagine for 1 minute that they are cabin crew at LHR. If you could either fight for what you already have or let management take it all, which option would you choose?

We are not all as fortunate to be in such a highly qualified role as flight crew, but that doesnt mean our careers as cabin crew are not important. Someone mentioned we need to accept 'change' and 'modernisation', these are just buzzwords from america that have created giants like ryanair, where their terms are a joke.
Imagine if a whole new approach was taken, whereby all frontline staff feel valued, rewarded and proud of their management and company. This would make BA the real money machine that everyone wants.

just deviating off the topic slightly but i'm on annual leave at the moment up until the end of jan, (i didn't request it off, they had to allocate it to me before the end of the tax year) anyway, just wondering, if a strike was to go ahead and they needed cover for flights would they call me in off my annual leave? thanks guys :}

No is the short answer.

...by the way.....LGW hourly rate is 2,32 per hour :(

:ugh: :ugh: :ugh: :ugh: :ugh: They want it all! Woe is me................:{

Where were the CC when LGW/MAN/EDI/GLA etc got turned upside down??????? Double standards? Yep.

I've lost all sympathy with the crews as I have since learned LHR longhaul crews live on another planet. Can BA survive yet more terrible press? What a shameful national carrier.

I terms of ground operations why should the crew show any proactive signs to back the changes to LGW/EDI/GLA/MAN.**** boy Walsh is only interested in T5 and wants rid of the regions and is trying to do it as sneakily as possible.If he can get away with shafting the ground staff whats to say he won't continue to treat the crew like crap and continue to make many illegal moves to further line his own pocket.

Tristar2

What "illegal" moves has Walsh made so far? I don't like him anymore than you but could you please quantify your statement?

I log on to this site occasionally and and always leave it feeling disappointed that I did.
The same old names keep on popping up: CarnageMatey and Sporran, in particular, to add their little gems of wisdom. It saddens me that there should be such divide between our cabin crew and our flight crew. I have noticed on a lot of the other threads, Flight crew from other airlines (Australia and the US) seem to be more supportive of their cabin crew colleagues and the theme that they are doing "a great job" seems a common one. I thought that perhaps this breakdown in CRM has become pervasive, but I have noticed to my relief that without exception, all the flight crew I have flown with since the start of these current IR issues, have had little in common with the thoughts of CarnageMatey or Sporran. I am glad the days of "us" and "them" is firmly behind us.
And as for the :ugh: : I just don't get it. That should be our response to your opinions. You have asked the SAME old questions over and over again. And we have responded over and over again, only to be faced with the same list of questions. Do you feel that if you state your views enough times, that will cause them to miraculously become true?
I am proud that we have, in my opinion, some of the world's finest flight crew and I am equally proud that we are some of the world's finest cabin crew. So I just don't understand the beef some seem to have over other's incomes and working conditions.
It is simply not true that crew didn't even know to what they were saying "Yes". Weeks ago, some may have mistakenly believed that the hourly rate was part of the ballot, but all the various forms of communication from the union set them straight.
I am a reasonable, rational person. I have an Honours degree from a recognised university and have turned my back on an office-based career to do something I love and I know I am good at. If you flew with me, you'd know I was a credit to the company from both a crew and a passenger perspective. But if someone as level-headed (IMHO) as I am unhappy with my management, then there is something wrong. Some of these 12 issues have been on the table now for almost 10 years. A 96.1% "Yes" vote paints a rather dire picture and points to a very disaffected workforce.
I believe BALPA is a good union and, as a result, I get the impression that our pilots are, on the whole, happy with their wages and with their working conditions. So I would argue that it is perhaps difficult for them to try and walk a mile (or 7) in our shoes.
I have friends who work for Delta and Virgin as Flight attendants/cabin crew, and I would agree that we have fairly decent working conditions and pay (there are SOME things I would like to change in my favour, but hey-ho...), and I would like to hold on to them. I don't want us to become easyjet/Ryanair/Delta or even Virgin. We are one of the world's best airlines and we should maintain that image. None of us wants a strike. It is just so sad that the first time the management have actually listened to our grievances is in the face of industrial action. Let's hope that the current talk are fruitful and that we can put this all behind us.
Happy flying everyone!

I'm afraid the bad old days of "us" and "them" never went away. We've tried very hard with CRM to bring the cabin crew community into the team (heck must of us even steer well clear of talking about this ludicrous ballot in the workplace just to keep a lid on things). Unfortunately an awful lot of crew seem to think that CRM means they can do what they damn well please. I have lost count of the number of times I've encountered crew who have had to be either corrected (diplomatically) or occasionally reprimanded by someone, only to find they see no error on their own part and accuse the flight crew of "bad CRM". Here are some very current examples of great team work from the IFS side:

LGW trainers instructing trainees they must not give flight crew first class food. (This is presumably out of spite)
LGW trainers telling trainees the above is necessary as flight crew get thousands of pounds each year not to eat it. (An outright lie)
BASSA intervening to stop the B2B bus routing from T4 to the car park to the crew hotel (presumably to spite the pilots again)
BASSA reps telling hotels they must not offer room upgrades to FOs unless the CSD can also be upgraded.
BASSA reps telling their members they were prevented from attending pensions meetings (they weren't) and BALPA have stolen their members money to fund the pilots pensions (they haven't).


Thats five examples straight off the top of my jetlagged head, all occurring within the last 12 months. With that sort of provocation on a continual basis do you wonder why relations are strained?

Perhaps it is in your OWN experience that the "bad old days never went away". I work a lot on the Upper Deck and I have almost always enjoyed a good relationship with the flight crew - of course there are a few bad apples, but aren't there everywhere? I try not to take it personally and tar the entire flight crew community with the same brush. Some people bring their own little issues to work, so one tries not to take the bait...
I must say: it is the first time I have come across the purported LGW training methods. As I have no first-hand knowledge, I can only assume that it is either part of the rumour mill or an isolated case (perhaps ANOTHER person with an axe to grind?). If those allegations were even slightly true, I think that's all pretty sad really. Of course we are told on our training courses what is and is not allowed on the flight deck and where the flight crew catering can be located, but a little rule-breaking and goodwill go a long way. I treat others as I would hope they would treat me. Apart from a few exceptions, I treat the flight crew with respect, kindness and humour and it is reciprocated.
I confess I am ignorant, too, of the accusations of BASSA's behaviour that you mention. It does seem wholly reasonable to me, with regard to the bus and the car park, that majority rule would dictate that 11/15 people should be catered for before the remaining 2.
And I imagine that it would be fair to ask that a CSD also be upgraded should the flight crew get upgrades. Crikey, BAPLA negotiated better seats for flight crew when positioning than their cabin crew colleagues get - so give us something, won't you?
And as for the BASSA/Pension meeting clash: BASSA was given a date for a meeting by the T&G. When it came to the Pensions meeting. BASSA informed the management that they could make any meeting apart from THAT day, so the management chose to hold it then, thereby forcing BASSA to choose between sorting out the ballot issue and the Pension issue.
And I am tired of hearing the same old drum being beaten: "What have you given up as cabin crew since Sept 11th?" "How have you saved the company any money". Now I know you think we are morons (and you are entitled to any opnion you choose), but you must think us REALLY soft in the head if you expect us to say, "Hell, yeah, please DO take back some of my money as I have SO much left over at the end of every month; please take some more crew off our aircraft so we can aspire to the heady heights of Aeroflot, please make me work until I am in a wheelchair and of course I'll make a bigger contribution to my pension to get less back when I am old (how much does cat food really cost anyway?). Because, like the present British goverment and taxation, I just KNOW that my cost-saving and money will be put to great use. How else can we employ yet more cabin crew "managers"? How else can we organise yet MORE useless courses to put crew on and take them away from their flying duties; and how else could we give our executives super-fat bonuses? How, indeed, are we to lure outsiders in with golden hellos and hefty pay-deals to allow them to attempt to drive this airline into the ground in their 2 or 3 year internship, before sending them off on their way with golden handshakes (but if they've been particularly naughty, let's put them on gardening leave!).
We have saved the company money in ways that are not entirely quantifiable: since Sept 11th, it has become part of our working practice to save the company money on every flight that we do. We are not ORDERED to, good sense dicates that we operate thus: I will use my own examples, but I know that it is the norm. It may take me longer and slow the service, but I only open wines as they are required; If only one passenger is drinking a certain wine on the Upper Deck, I run up and down those blasted stairs to share an opened bottle of wine with the main deck - the same goes for juices; I replace every piece of catering and round-trip it in order that salad dressings, raid the larder, etc, may be re-used either on the return sector, or on another flight; after all the passengers have disembarked, I go through all the seat backs to save the magazines, and washbags. Those stairs and baggage "slope" outside Compass are treacherous (don't laugh: YOU do it in heels!), but we grudgingly negotiate them when using the BA1 service (now that the Central Area bus service has been withdrawn) and during back-to-backs; I think you'll also find that with the airlines that pay their crew peanuts, many of them are on the fiddle: I have never had the "pleasure" of working for a charter company (yet?), but I have many colleagues who have, and who swear that it is the rule rather than the exception to cook the books on the selling of alcohol, and that they were used to seeing everything that wasn't nailed down disappear from the aircraft, something at BA, that would be unthinkable. Boy, was that a boring illustration! I think I nodded of half-way, so please excuse any spelling or grammatical mistakes (I, too, am jet-lagged).
So, let's get on with it. You concentrate on your pay and conditions and we will look after our own. We KNOW we are going to get shafted, but at least we are putting up as much of a fight as we can - if we didn't, YOU would be writing in 6 months time about how we "agreed" to the conditions and "signed up to them". The only reason we have the conditions we enjoy at LHR, is sheer numbers and a stubborn union.