Don't you just hate these people??
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Don't you just hate these people??
I hope you will take the time to read this 'blog' - and then keep your eyes peeled for the time you have this little t*rd on your flight. Make sure he has a really lovely trip (down the steps, I mean)
I still give you my undivided attention, although I know most of the briefings by heart!
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I still give you my undivided attention, although I know most of the briefings by heart!
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Last edited by quartermilltopo; 19th Sep 2008 at 12:13. Reason: More information
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Absolutley delighted that he doesn't give a rats, however who is he to decide that other people around him don't care... This behaviour is rude and inconsiderate of the punters around, and most certainly the flightys that are simply doing their job.
All in all, his sentiments are correct, the information is rarely required, however I'd love to be a fly on his wall the one time that it is!
And also, its a CAA requirement to perform the demo, and what to cover. The airlines wouldn't be volunteering to do this unless they had to! Good research jack ar#e...
All in all, his sentiments are correct, the information is rarely required, however I'd love to be a fly on his wall the one time that it is!
And also, its a CAA requirement to perform the demo, and what to cover. The airlines wouldn't be volunteering to do this unless they had to! Good research jack ar#e...
Last edited by urok; 19th Sep 2008 at 01:27. Reason: grammer...
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He has a point let's be honest. In the real world, the only time a landing on water has been attempted by a large airliner was the hijacked Ethiopian B767 that smashed apart on impact. He is correct in saying that hitting water at any speed is very much like hitting concrete. Should my 747 ever find itself gently afloat, then I will put my life jacket on, however 747 flying into a hundred pieces at speed is more likely.
It's also noticeable that cabin crew, like the Police and certain other profession have a "them and us" mentality. The man actually makes a real point in a humourous manner. I always make a point to know where the nearest exit is and where my life jacket is stowed. However I don't have a realistic expectation that I will be delighted that it saves my life. Honestly.
If you want to see "good research" on lifejackets then google the tape of the Ethiopian B767 going in at slow speed into a controlled water landing.......
Also, seeking confrontation with those that disagree with you in order to punish them has no place in a grown up workplace.
It's also noticeable that cabin crew, like the Police and certain other profession have a "them and us" mentality. The man actually makes a real point in a humourous manner. I always make a point to know where the nearest exit is and where my life jacket is stowed. However I don't have a realistic expectation that I will be delighted that it saves my life. Honestly.
If you want to see "good research" on lifejackets then google the tape of the Ethiopian B767 going in at slow speed into a controlled water landing.......
I can't wait to offload the first smart who's trying to argue himself into trouble
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With regards to the Ethiopian 767, the fact that the pilots were wrestling with the hijackers at the time probably had a lot to do with one wing dipping and causing the catastrophic results. Even then, some people survived the impact, some of those made it out, whereas others inflated their life jacket INSIDE the aircraft and were unable to get to the exits of the submerging aircraft and drowned. (If I was utterly cynical I'd suggest that these were the people who ignored the part of the safety brief that tells you to inflate the life jacket only after leaving the aircraft.)
Other aircraft HAVE ditched with better success rates: Pan Am and Aeroflot from memory, and a few others.
Aircraft overrunning the runway and ending up in water is a far more likely scenario than actually ditching into the middle of the ocean, and there have been several cases of people drowning in such conditions where a life jacket may have made the difference.
Of course it's unlikely you'll ever need a life jacket and it's much more fun to make sneery comments as a couple of hapless hosties try and demonstrate the procedures that they know all to well are unlikely to be needed, but a safety briefing is a mandated part of commercial flight and deliberately "having loud conversations with an imaginary friend" is a puerile response.
Other aircraft HAVE ditched with better success rates: Pan Am and Aeroflot from memory, and a few others.
Aircraft overrunning the runway and ending up in water is a far more likely scenario than actually ditching into the middle of the ocean, and there have been several cases of people drowning in such conditions where a life jacket may have made the difference.
Of course it's unlikely you'll ever need a life jacket and it's much more fun to make sneery comments as a couple of hapless hosties try and demonstrate the procedures that they know all to well are unlikely to be needed, but a safety briefing is a mandated part of commercial flight and deliberately "having loud conversations with an imaginary friend" is a puerile response.
Water ditching
In fact there is a chance of surviving a controlled ditching in water.
A 747 in landing configuration touches down at a survivable speed for something of that size... I think around 160 knots... issues such as height and direction of swell come into play, as does temperature of water, weather etc.
Many people survived the ditching referred to earlier.
A 747 in landing configuration touches down at a survivable speed for something of that size... I think around 160 knots... issues such as height and direction of swell come into play, as does temperature of water, weather etc.
Many people survived the ditching referred to earlier.
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Well, I still hate them!!
An interesting cross-section of views and opinions; all of which are valid, depending on your point of view. I have observed turkeys (such as the man who featured in the original post - Duncan??) exactly like him, and sometimes I feel like remonstrating with them - but I'm the one who would be locked up for confronting the idiot. I still despise their ilk!!
There was a case of an RAF Nimrod (ok not civillian but the airframe is based on the comet airliner) which sucessfully ditched off the coast of scotland a few years back. I remember seeing the pictures of it floating on the surface.
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Is this guy for real???
Would love to have him in my flight.
Don't know why but for some reason i just remembered a scene in Snakes on Crack (or was it Snakes on A Plane) where some fella fed a huge snake someone's little dog and then the fella got eaten by the snake...
Fictional? Yes. Would i feel sorry if it wasn't and it happened to this guy? No.
Would love to have him in my flight.
Don't know why but for some reason i just remembered a scene in Snakes on Crack (or was it Snakes on A Plane) where some fella fed a huge snake someone's little dog and then the fella got eaten by the snake...
Fictional? Yes. Would i feel sorry if it wasn't and it happened to this guy? No.
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I can't wait to offload the first smart who's trying to argue himself into trouble
About the Ethiopian 767: Quite a few more people would have survived the incident if they would have adhered to 'Do not inflate your lifejacket inside the aircraft.'.
I admit, surviving a ditching is a miracle, but some of those guys did. More could have. The off chance of the information giving me a 0.0001% higher chance to survive will make me pay attention every time. But that's just me, of course.
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Sheesh....some of the comments here!!!
Life jackets are of course a very neccesarry part of our equipment. A ditching may not be as black and white as some of you portray (ahem skipness one echo ahem ahem). What about the China Airlines 747 that went off the end of the runway at Kai Tak? It was one of the few evacuations that actually successfully got passengers into rafts!
Two years ago I was in a situation where we had a very real chance of going off the end of the runway into water in the Carib. I was also stationed at doors one so myself and my SCCM were both aware that chances our part of the aircraft would be submerged. Life jackets were out, passengers were shown how to wear them EXACTLY as per your mans article AND STILL THE GOT IT WRONG!!!!
Also, the Ethiopian incident actually had survivors. Many of those who did not survive were those who inflated their life jackets before the impact. It is believed many more may have survived had they listened to the demo more carefully.
Now I could go into his jargon about the 02 masks but to be honest Id rather not, because I would not mind if he ashpyxiated himself next time he is in a depressurisation over high terrain!
Apols for the spelling mistakes, cant get my spell check to work!
Life jackets are of course a very neccesarry part of our equipment. A ditching may not be as black and white as some of you portray (ahem skipness one echo ahem ahem). What about the China Airlines 747 that went off the end of the runway at Kai Tak? It was one of the few evacuations that actually successfully got passengers into rafts!
Two years ago I was in a situation where we had a very real chance of going off the end of the runway into water in the Carib. I was also stationed at doors one so myself and my SCCM were both aware that chances our part of the aircraft would be submerged. Life jackets were out, passengers were shown how to wear them EXACTLY as per your mans article AND STILL THE GOT IT WRONG!!!!
Also, the Ethiopian incident actually had survivors. Many of those who did not survive were those who inflated their life jackets before the impact. It is believed many more may have survived had they listened to the demo more carefully.
Now I could go into his jargon about the 02 masks but to be honest Id rather not, because I would not mind if he ashpyxiated himself next time he is in a depressurisation over high terrain!
Apols for the spelling mistakes, cant get my spell check to work!
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Skipness One Echo
He has a point let's be honest.
Do you or would you therefore advocate that all SEP equipment should be stripped from all commercial aircraft? (apart from the crews off course
)A simple yes or no would be just fine........
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Given the stressful nature of a ditching I would imagine it would take a lot of self-discipline not to inflate a lifejacket, plus someone popping theirs would lead to pax copying in panic. One only has to look at other threads on this forum about Pax behaviour!
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A lot of people who perish in accidents don't even manage to unfasten their seatbelt as they are in a total and blind panic.
However.......many do survive, thanks to the courage, training and procedures of flight and cabin crew alike. Anyone who makes a mockery of this, trivialises this or displays a sense of forgone conclusion (i.e. whats the point I will die anyway) is an insult to the great peeps in aviation (not just in the air - but very much on the ground as well - I mean, what's the point in having a fire brigade at an aerodrome everyone will have died anyway right?
(....)) who are there to save your life one day (and not to take insults, sexual harassement, dirty nappies etc like many in society seem to think these days)!
However.......many do survive, thanks to the courage, training and procedures of flight and cabin crew alike. Anyone who makes a mockery of this, trivialises this or displays a sense of forgone conclusion (i.e. whats the point I will die anyway) is an insult to the great peeps in aviation (not just in the air - but very much on the ground as well - I mean, what's the point in having a fire brigade at an aerodrome everyone will have died anyway right?
(....)) who are there to save your life one day (and not to take insults, sexual harassement, dirty nappies etc like many in society seem to think these days)!