QF Bid Period 238
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QF Bid Period 238
Yet another lie has been told. All those QF long haul Australian based cabin crew (especially the juniors) who were told that they would not suffer financially as a result of the opening of the London base. If I recall the General Manager of Cabin Crew saying that talk of a $20,000 a year lose in pay was ridiculous and that all cabin crew would still have access to destinations with generous allowances. Well have a look at the rosters of junior based cabin crew out of Sydney for bid period 238. Gone are the the LHR and FRA patterns, replaced by 150 hours of AKL returns, CNS returns, 2 day Perth’s and Mumbai’s. Look’s like at least 20k to me!!
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Sick-out
Not sure what happened to 238 but everyone is spewing about it.
Have heard there is talk of a massive sick-out in protest.
Not sure of the date but the talk is day one of BP238 to skip the week 8 pay protection.
Nothing to do with the FAAA as they have nothing to do...! Well it appears that way anyhow.
Anybody else hear about this protest?
Have heard there is talk of a massive sick-out in protest.
Not sure of the date but the talk is day one of BP238 to skip the week 8 pay protection.
Nothing to do with the FAAA as they have nothing to do...! Well it appears that way anyhow.
Anybody else hear about this protest?
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The Reasons
1.The voting up of EBA6
2.The treachery of shorthaul
3.The absolute stupidity of the previous FAAA executive aka "the 3 blind mice".
EBA6 spelt the death knell and WE voted it up .We have no one to blame but ourselves...we should have taken industrial action..too late ..spilt milk.Time for an exit strategy.
2.The treachery of shorthaul
3.The absolute stupidity of the previous FAAA executive aka "the 3 blind mice".
EBA6 spelt the death knell and WE voted it up .We have no one to blame but ourselves...we should have taken industrial action..too late ..spilt milk.Time for an exit strategy.
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I agree bid period 238 is beyond belief, I have been allocated so many day trips that my roster looks like a short haul roster.
I do not do one day trips, It actually costs me money, looks like I will not be feeling well for most of this roster.
I agree with all the above, it was the treachery of the short haul union that "screwed us",
In the meantime as our flying changes, the FAAA is talking to the media about pantyhose and uniform shirts, who f@@@@ing cares, comments like that only reaffirms the public perception that we are petty.
I do not do one day trips, It actually costs me money, looks like I will not be feeling well for most of this roster.
I agree with all the above, it was the treachery of the short haul union that "screwed us",
In the meantime as our flying changes, the FAAA is talking to the media about pantyhose and uniform shirts, who f@@@@ing cares, comments like that only reaffirms the public perception that we are petty.
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Nihao there is no doubt now that the seniority system has become completely unfair for those who have started flying in the past 5 years. A long haul flight attendant who started at the beginning of 2001 has now a whole 81 people below them!! Nearly 5 years for 81 places, now there’s progression for you! The company has also made it clear that there will be no permanent recruitment in Australian based Long Haul for the foreseeable future. The laughable thing is that when you talk to seniors they all say ‘you have to do your time Blah blah blah!’ It’s a load of rubbish, juniors are going nowhere. Anyway rumour has it the seniority system will be going for the next EBA, if that’s the case I’ll be voting YES! It’s time to get rid of the dead wood!
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Pro Golffer,
In a way I agree with you about the seniority system, but what about people like myself, I have been flying for a long time, and Im in a category that makes me junior, I could drop back to being a f/a but obviously I dont want to, yet if they abolish the senioity system I will have spent the last 11 years in my category doing crap trips and the next 10 years doing carp trips as the seniority system has been aboished, yet all those junior CSS and CSM that have only been doing the job for 5 years or so will get those good trips that are left and that I have been waiting for.
In a way I agree with you about the seniority system, but what about people like myself, I have been flying for a long time, and Im in a category that makes me junior, I could drop back to being a f/a but obviously I dont want to, yet if they abolish the senioity system I will have spent the last 11 years in my category doing crap trips and the next 10 years doing carp trips as the seniority system has been aboished, yet all those junior CSS and CSM that have only been doing the job for 5 years or so will get those good trips that are left and that I have been waiting for.
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If the seniority system was challenged in a court it would not stand up for rostering practices as it would be deemed discriminatory.
However, the union could never try and change it because it would upset all the senior collegues.
However, the union could never try and change it because it would upset all the senior collegues.
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Jake I see your point and it would be very advantageous for those junior CSS’s and CSM’s no doubt about it. One would hope though that if the system was scrapped you would get a mixed bag of trips so you would be better off in the long run. I would assume that rosters would be constructed with long and short trips, trips with good allowances and not so good. This is probably ridiculously unrealistic! I mean progression in your category will most likely becoming to a complete stand still as well. For me personally I just want back to back LHR trips and I’m happy to do them for the next 20 years. I know this is unrealistic but if the company said to me we’ll give you your 3 LHR’s a roster as long as you’re happy to do a BOM or a JNB every roster as well and not call in sick for it I’d be happy as Larry!
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With the current situation, the junior ones who have no chance of ever getting a trip they want, a weekend off, or christmas at home will be the first ones to start leaving and finding greener pastures. As numbers begin to shrink in a couple of years, the company will just employ more contractors, casuals, etc. Bases will probably be expanded. Those at the bottom of the pile remain where they are.
Net result - those who are in the middle of the seniority pile slowly become more and more junior. Lifestyle continues it backwards slide.
Some airlines have a system whereby to do a 'good' trip (maybe high allowances, long slip time, exotic destination etc) you have to do a crap trip as well (ie JBurg, Bombay etc). The current rostering practices are causing problems for a lot of people for whom there is no escape.
A full rotating seniority system would be completely voted down by senior people, so why not a system that allocates flying more fairly. Perhaps everyone in order of seniority gets allocated one trip, before moving back up to the top of the pile and allocating a second trip. Therefore, all the highly desirable trips are allocated in the first round, the next most desirable in the second round, etc. Some resemblence of seniority is therefore kept, and the junior people at least get one or two more decent trips a roster.
Will duck back into my cave now as am expecting a wave of abuse for suggesting anything other than the seniority system as it stands. But for someone who has spent a lot of time in the bottom 5% of seniority, with no prospect of ever moving out of that band, unless things change I will be seeking alternative employment in the future.
Net result - those who are in the middle of the seniority pile slowly become more and more junior. Lifestyle continues it backwards slide.
Some airlines have a system whereby to do a 'good' trip (maybe high allowances, long slip time, exotic destination etc) you have to do a crap trip as well (ie JBurg, Bombay etc). The current rostering practices are causing problems for a lot of people for whom there is no escape.
A full rotating seniority system would be completely voted down by senior people, so why not a system that allocates flying more fairly. Perhaps everyone in order of seniority gets allocated one trip, before moving back up to the top of the pile and allocating a second trip. Therefore, all the highly desirable trips are allocated in the first round, the next most desirable in the second round, etc. Some resemblence of seniority is therefore kept, and the junior people at least get one or two more decent trips a roster.
Will duck back into my cave now as am expecting a wave of abuse for suggesting anything other than the seniority system as it stands. But for someone who has spent a lot of time in the bottom 5% of seniority, with no prospect of ever moving out of that band, unless things change I will be seeking alternative employment in the future.
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Highly desirable?
Everyone has different preferences.Personally I don`t care where I go as long as I can have certain days off.At present I am away every weekend to achieve this end.Having worked under an allocated roster system what we currently have is better.We have become too destination oriented.I am half way up in my category and have done crap for nearly 20 years.I knew what I was getting into when I applied for a promotion and it has never bothered me ..I have taken the good (not much of that)with the bad(plenty of that)Whatever changes are made someone is going to be unhappy.
Rotating seniority appears to be the most fair.You may not however get the highest seniority over Christmas or your Birthday..It will still be the luck of the draw.
Allocating flying more fairly ...what does that mean?An old cliche"one persons food is another persons poison"
At the end of the day we all still get paid.If your life is predicated on allowances more fool you.
Rotating seniority appears to be the most fair.You may not however get the highest seniority over Christmas or your Birthday..It will still be the luck of the draw.
Allocating flying more fairly ...what does that mean?An old cliche"one persons food is another persons poison"
At the end of the day we all still get paid.If your life is predicated on allowances more fool you.
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"unless things change I will be seeking alternative employment in the future."
I was just wondering what 'greener pastures' you think are out there.
Do you mean Australian? Virgin? or JetStar? Or going offshore with Emirates et al?
I guess it just depends on what are your priorities.
A fulltime permanent position within the airline industry in the best paid division (LH) would be first choice for a lot of crew about to complete an 11 month contract with QF ( including myself) and the hundreds of MAM casuals currently hoping for something, but unfortunately out of the question for the foreseeable future.
Do you REALLY TRULY beleive that you will achieve a better job/lifestyle elsewhere given your qualifications and experience?
Yes, there are a lot of problems with QF...seniority for one, shocking morale.
But at the end of the day, you still have a permanent well-paid job in the airline industry.
You do not have to move to fnq, you do not have to clean the aircraft at the end of the flight, you do not have to do toilet dumps ( Airforce Crew Attendants), you do not have to move to London, you have not had your base pay reduced, you do not have to wear orange, you have meals to serve, you are potentially getting more crew per flight to LAX, you get paid more than $50,000pa and have more days off than the average Australian per month for that salary range, you have horizontal rest on long range flights ( with blankets! and pillows! and a curtain so you aren't awoken by light or other crew!), you get Staff Travel benefits- not only for yourself but a nominated partner!!!!), you get to work for a bit then rest for a bit, then work some more and then more rest and its paid for, you don't stay in 4 star hotels...would you like me to go on?????????????
Enjoy it while it lasts because you are all sure as hell going to lose what you have sooner than later.....
I was just wondering what 'greener pastures' you think are out there.
Do you mean Australian? Virgin? or JetStar? Or going offshore with Emirates et al?
I guess it just depends on what are your priorities.
A fulltime permanent position within the airline industry in the best paid division (LH) would be first choice for a lot of crew about to complete an 11 month contract with QF ( including myself) and the hundreds of MAM casuals currently hoping for something, but unfortunately out of the question for the foreseeable future.
Do you REALLY TRULY beleive that you will achieve a better job/lifestyle elsewhere given your qualifications and experience?
Yes, there are a lot of problems with QF...seniority for one, shocking morale.
But at the end of the day, you still have a permanent well-paid job in the airline industry.
You do not have to move to fnq, you do not have to clean the aircraft at the end of the flight, you do not have to do toilet dumps ( Airforce Crew Attendants), you do not have to move to London, you have not had your base pay reduced, you do not have to wear orange, you have meals to serve, you are potentially getting more crew per flight to LAX, you get paid more than $50,000pa and have more days off than the average Australian per month for that salary range, you have horizontal rest on long range flights ( with blankets! and pillows! and a curtain so you aren't awoken by light or other crew!), you get Staff Travel benefits- not only for yourself but a nominated partner!!!!), you get to work for a bit then rest for a bit, then work some more and then more rest and its paid for, you don't stay in 4 star hotels...would you like me to go on?????????????
Enjoy it while it lasts because you are all sure as hell going to lose what you have sooner than later.....
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AintNoMtnHiEnuff
dear AintNoMtnHiEnuff
you meantioned all the conditions above, how in the hell do you think we got those work conditions, they are now being eroded by ***** like you.
I have always tried hard to write good reports for the 11 month contractors hoping that they be made permanent, reading your post made my blood boil, in your case im glad your contract is nearind its end, people like you have no idea how we had to fight for those conditions, yet you and your fellow contractors are the first the whinge and whine about not being permanent, what do you think we are fighting for! Permanent jobs !!!!!
you meantioned all the conditions above, how in the hell do you think we got those work conditions, they are now being eroded by ***** like you.
I have always tried hard to write good reports for the 11 month contractors hoping that they be made permanent, reading your post made my blood boil, in your case im glad your contract is nearind its end, people like you have no idea how we had to fight for those conditions, yet you and your fellow contractors are the first the whinge and whine about not being permanent, what do you think we are fighting for! Permanent jobs !!!!!
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By greener pastures I meant leaving the industry altogether (putting 5 years of part time uni study and previous work experience into practice). Not going to another airline. QF has the balance of lifestyle (living in Aus), and relatively a good payscale when compared to the same job with others. Just unfair rostering practices in the current climate.
Sure I can earn over $50K with no qaulifications and experience, but the lifestyle is only going to get worse, and on a relative scale the pay is only going to get worse in the years to come. Gone are the days where we could earn more than university graduates in law, medicine and engineering could in their first years out in the workforce, and travel the world having a good time.
Enjoy it while it lasts. Protect it if you can.
Sure I can earn over $50K with no qaulifications and experience, but the lifestyle is only going to get worse, and on a relative scale the pay is only going to get worse in the years to come. Gone are the days where we could earn more than university graduates in law, medicine and engineering could in their first years out in the workforce, and travel the world having a good time.
Enjoy it while it lasts. Protect it if you can.
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franck
franck,
you better read my post properly, I cant see anywhere that I have written that contractors are eroding our conditions, I am referring to an individual that will accept anything, as as far as fighting for them, well I can assure you that the FAAA and many F/A want all those people to be permanent.
Its in all our interest that these people are permanent.
you better read my post properly, I cant see anywhere that I have written that contractors are eroding our conditions, I am referring to an individual that will accept anything, as as far as fighting for them, well I can assure you that the FAAA and many F/A want all those people to be permanent.
Its in all our interest that these people are permanent.