Cabin Crew trained in use of firearms....
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Cabin Crew trained in use of firearms....
I heard that the FAA were looking at firearms training for cabin crew.
With all the recent Sky Marshall business maybe they think that having cabin crew trained in recognising and dealing with terrorists/sabotage threats involving guns would be useful.
I think that the Sky Marshalls are just too expensive and cabin crew being already in situ are the cheapest alternative....
Anyone else heard any such rumour?
With all the recent Sky Marshall business maybe they think that having cabin crew trained in recognising and dealing with terrorists/sabotage threats involving guns would be useful.
I think that the Sky Marshalls are just too expensive and cabin crew being already in situ are the cheapest alternative....
Anyone else heard any such rumour?
Join Date: Apr 2004
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Just 1 objection that I can see, and before I get flamed I would like to state that I am not Cabin Crew for any airline... but my head tells me this:
A: Dont Cabin Crew have a lot of things to be trained in already, eg Emergency procedures etc, and these qualifications that you have to stay current on, then to add a weapons proficency? Its not enough to simply issue everyone (or the aircraft) with weapons and expect a 1 day course at initial training will do it for the rest of the time spent serving, weapons training is on-going, and required frequent practice to stop us shooting the people we are trying to protect!
B: A sky Marshal, (as I understand the plan here in OZ) Is a random, undercover officer. Therfore, a Terrorist will not know who the marshall is, and cannot take steps to subdue him/ her and strip them of their weapon. If Cabin Crew were armed, there you have a whole crews worth of weapons, and they are sitting ducks for any problems.
I do agree however that anti-terrorist training could be useful, as in spotting potential threats, but I do state that I dont know it this is already a part of the curriculum. (pardon the spelling)
JB
PS: Disagree with me if you will!
A: Dont Cabin Crew have a lot of things to be trained in already, eg Emergency procedures etc, and these qualifications that you have to stay current on, then to add a weapons proficency? Its not enough to simply issue everyone (or the aircraft) with weapons and expect a 1 day course at initial training will do it for the rest of the time spent serving, weapons training is on-going, and required frequent practice to stop us shooting the people we are trying to protect!
B: A sky Marshal, (as I understand the plan here in OZ) Is a random, undercover officer. Therfore, a Terrorist will not know who the marshall is, and cannot take steps to subdue him/ her and strip them of their weapon. If Cabin Crew were armed, there you have a whole crews worth of weapons, and they are sitting ducks for any problems.
I do agree however that anti-terrorist training could be useful, as in spotting potential threats, but I do state that I dont know it this is already a part of the curriculum. (pardon the spelling)
JB
PS: Disagree with me if you will!
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I don't think firearms should be on aircraft at all to be honest.... Just a personal view.
I'd rather see (if its really needed) CF spray - won't kill anyone (especially cabin crew if used against them), but will certainly put someone on their backside so they can be restrained.
I'd rather see (if its really needed) CF spray - won't kill anyone (especially cabin crew if used against them), but will certainly put someone on their backside so they can be restrained.
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Have been crew for quite a while and as a female have actually taken on passengers three times. (Drunken ) or just off their head. I dont think that there should be any kind of weapons on board just eneough training so that one can restrain the passenger if they need to. I do believe that there should be a couple of crew members on board (male) but to be honest with you only one of the incidents they were of help. If a passenger has his head set on taking over the flight they will (9/11) Air marshalls will only cause more of a problem. I have worked for an airline befoe who had air marshalls. And to be honest with you they would stick out like a sore thumb. And i have seen them playing with their guns mid flight. And one of the incidents that i was talking about they were no where to be seen when needed (747 - would all congregate to play cards after service) apart from the one outside the cockpit door. The airline even had a hijack because air marshalls were too busy buying duty free. (they didnt stop an aircraft from being blown up in that incident) So no i dont think it will help.
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I hadn't heard about the prospective training and do not know about the specifics, but..
I would be very surprised if the intention was to arm CC to cut down the cost of air marshals,
I think it would be more aimed at showing those who might be handed the weapon after a hijacker was subdued which was the dangerous end, where the safety catch is likely to be and how to unload it without pulling the trigger! As to whether this would have a periodical currency requirement is up for debate - but it would certainly be useful to have been taught once.
I would be very surprised if the intention was to arm CC to cut down the cost of air marshals,
I think it would be more aimed at showing those who might be handed the weapon after a hijacker was subdued which was the dangerous end, where the safety catch is likely to be and how to unload it without pulling the trigger! As to whether this would have a periodical currency requirement is up for debate - but it would certainly be useful to have been taught once.
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How many loaded guns are we going to end up with on one plane, in one cabin? 
Even EL AL don't arm their cabin crew, and I for one have no interest in challenging anyone with a gun.
Let's mainly focus on stopping them from getting on in the first place.
Even EL AL don't arm their cabin crew, and I for one have no interest in challenging anyone with a gun.
Let's mainly focus on stopping them from getting on in the first place.
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I like the Idea of pepper spray more than loaded guns.
If the cabin crew are to be armed, I think it is a good idea if only a percentage were and no one knew who.
That way terrorists wouldn't pick out the smallest just to get their gun, and yet still have the detterent of trained, armed crew onboard.
Also as the amount of crew to be trained would be less, the training could be more intensive
If the cabin crew are to be armed, I think it is a good idea if only a percentage were and no one knew who.
That way terrorists wouldn't pick out the smallest just to get their gun, and yet still have the detterent of trained, armed crew onboard.
Also as the amount of crew to be trained would be less, the training could be more intensive
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I dont see how you could successfully carry a pistol and expect to carry out all the duties required of a Cabin Crew member.
Pistols are heavy, bulky and not verry easy to conceal, unless your airline makes you keep a jacket on at all times, and you wear it cross draw, or similar, but they are very tiring, and really do stand out very easily. (Im not Cabin Crew, but I do have Military experience, and a pistol is not much better to carry then a rifle as far as weight and bulk is concerned... and it is tiring to have it in a holster on a long flight i can imagine)
I agree with the proposal for non-lethal forms of restraint, suck as pepper sprays etc, with the obvious precaution of use when neccesary, as they can cause pretty serious side effects to a person who catches some of the overspray etc, even death if an allergic reaction is to happen. However, much less lethal then a 9mm round.... and easier to treat in a first aid situation.
As far as knowing the ins and outs of a firearm, well... It woudlnt be a bad thing I guess, I just wonder how many pistols find their way onto a flight, and in reality the best thing to do with it is leave it alone for the experts, on the assumption that the assaliant is restrained of course, as any ND or AD (accidental discharge) of the weapon will cause MAJOR problems... even if the round misses everyone, as it could penetrate the hull.
My opinion echoes the sentiments shown here by others, lets concentrate on keeping the pistols off the aircraft in the first place, and maybe some self defence training would be nice.
JB
Pistols are heavy, bulky and not verry easy to conceal, unless your airline makes you keep a jacket on at all times, and you wear it cross draw, or similar, but they are very tiring, and really do stand out very easily. (Im not Cabin Crew, but I do have Military experience, and a pistol is not much better to carry then a rifle as far as weight and bulk is concerned... and it is tiring to have it in a holster on a long flight i can imagine)
I agree with the proposal for non-lethal forms of restraint, suck as pepper sprays etc, with the obvious precaution of use when neccesary, as they can cause pretty serious side effects to a person who catches some of the overspray etc, even death if an allergic reaction is to happen. However, much less lethal then a 9mm round.... and easier to treat in a first aid situation.
As far as knowing the ins and outs of a firearm, well... It woudlnt be a bad thing I guess, I just wonder how many pistols find their way onto a flight, and in reality the best thing to do with it is leave it alone for the experts, on the assumption that the assaliant is restrained of course, as any ND or AD (accidental discharge) of the weapon will cause MAJOR problems... even if the round misses everyone, as it could penetrate the hull.
My opinion echoes the sentiments shown here by others, lets concentrate on keeping the pistols off the aircraft in the first place, and maybe some self defence training would be nice.
JB
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Dear Terrorist
Thankyou for booking your flight, please find enclosed your ticket.
For those of you concerned with getting a firearm unnoticed through customs to carry out your hijack, fear not!
We have supplied each aircraft with its own gun, stored in the flight deck (just follow the emergency floor lights forward to reach the door). And just incase the hijack is planned prematurely, for your convenience we have also trained all cabin crew on our flight to point the gun at the captain for you, so you dont even need to learn how to use it.
Happy Hijacking!
Thankyou for booking your flight, please find enclosed your ticket.
For those of you concerned with getting a firearm unnoticed through customs to carry out your hijack, fear not!
We have supplied each aircraft with its own gun, stored in the flight deck (just follow the emergency floor lights forward to reach the door). And just incase the hijack is planned prematurely, for your convenience we have also trained all cabin crew on our flight to point the gun at the captain for you, so you dont even need to learn how to use it.
Happy Hijacking!
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Someone mentioned that the use of Air Marshalls is the best idea. I agree.
Someone mentioned the use of CC spary as a non-lethal means of stoping a dangerous and or violent situation. I disagree. Remmember that All airlines have Airconditioning vents and by utilising this toy, it will have an enormous impact on the passengers, f/a and more importantly the Pilots. It will circulate.
Keep the air marshall and train the f/a's to improve thier skills in detecting sus activity..
Enjoy.
jonboy80
Someone mentioned the use of CC spary as a non-lethal means of stoping a dangerous and or violent situation. I disagree. Remmember that All airlines have Airconditioning vents and by utilising this toy, it will have an enormous impact on the passengers, f/a and more importantly the Pilots. It will circulate.
Keep the air marshall and train the f/a's to improve thier skills in detecting sus activity..
Enjoy.
jonboy80
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Good point..... However, CS / CF spray is only effective when sprayed directly to the face. You have to directly squirt quite a lot into the air reticulation vent for it to affect anyone else.
But you raise a very valid and like any other weapon it can always be used against those for whom it wasn't intended.
But you raise a very valid and like any other weapon it can always be used against those for whom it wasn't intended.
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Thank you, but OC spray is not always effective when sprayed directly into the face. Alot of tv shows display it that way, but their are some people in this world who can tolerate the pain and it doesnt effect them. You have to also understand that once OC is sprayed "directly to someone's face" it creates a small invisible cloud around them which causes the effects to the nerves/blood cells and membranes. Hence the excrutiating shock and pain and thus travelling into the air vents. It is actually illegal to carry it on aeroplanes due to the cabin pressure which can cause the substance to explode. Read up on it. .Sad news but true news.. I think a tazzor gun would be great. A good zap and they are down and out of it. But i suppose like that would only work if approved by the AA
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As said earlier firearms should be left to professionals and not a fresh trained person. Many years experience is needed to handle situations and should be left to police of SF personel.
Oh and in the UK or UK registered aircraft the use of a spray as an incapacitant is viewed as a use of a firearm offence.
Cor my spellings bad!!!!
Oh and in the UK or UK registered aircraft the use of a spray as an incapacitant is viewed as a use of a firearm offence.
Cor my spellings bad!!!!