Does your Roster = Fatigue?
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2003
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From: metal tube in the sky
Does your Roster = Fatigue?
I am just wondering if all airlines are now rostering crews maximum hours. Obviously low cost airlines work more than traditional scheduled and charter carriers or do they? I work for a low cost carrier and my roster is constantly 6 on 3 off, finishing on a late, starting on an early and ALWAYS getting called out on standbys! The dutys are not exactly easy either with domestic followed by a european leg e.g AGP, PMI...What I mean is that the days average out at 10-12 hours.
Most of the crews I have chatted to are absolutely knackered, nearing the point of fatigue and crewing have no sympathy, indeed some of the newer cabin crew are feeling pressurised into working sometimes illegally!!
Most of the crews I have chatted to are absolutely knackered, nearing the point of fatigue and crewing have no sympathy, indeed some of the newer cabin crew are feeling pressurised into working sometimes illegally!!
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 2,132
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From: on the golf course (Covid permitting)
Tilly
I don't know whether you are serious about 'illegal' rostering, but if you are then you should encourage reporting of this through Chirp .
This is a totally confidential reporting system where anyone involved in UK aviation can highlight issues that the CAA and other relevant authorities should know about. The authorities will look very seriously into malpractice and take the necessary actions without revealing the identities of individuals.
I don't know whether you are serious about 'illegal' rostering, but if you are then you should encourage reporting of this through Chirp .
This is a totally confidential reporting system where anyone involved in UK aviation can highlight issues that the CAA and other relevant authorities should know about. The authorities will look very seriously into malpractice and take the necessary actions without revealing the identities of individuals.
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 713
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From: 52N 20E
I'm afraid it's not just Cabin Crew but Flight Deck as well.
FTL's appear to be a target to aim for these days.
I really can't see the reason that you guys and girls are allowed to work an extra hour and have 1 hours less minimum rest.
Talk about divide and rule , certainly leads to a lot of bad feeeling and splits the crew up needlessly.
Fatigue is fatigue, end of story.
FTL's appear to be a target to aim for these days.
I really can't see the reason that you guys and girls are allowed to work an extra hour and have 1 hours less minimum rest.
Talk about divide and rule , certainly leads to a lot of bad feeeling and splits the crew up needlessly.
Fatigue is fatigue, end of story.
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,261
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From: Europe
Tilly,
before being in a flag carrier I was in a private airline (both schedule and charter), and my roster was dramatically different.
Having known something like what you describe, I really cannot complain now (even if some of my collegues do...). We have many rules (negotiated by the unions of course) that prevent the airline from savagely rostering us. Like (for MH) :
-no more than six days on in a row
-6 days on in a row maximum once a month
-when you are on 6 days in a row it's not possible to be in a 3 days on followed by another 3 days on or a 4 +2 (could be 2 +2+2, or 2+1+1+1 etc)
-6 days OFF in a row once a month.
-if one of your flights is cancelled you cannot be rostered on a flight exceeding the return time of your originally rostered flight
-when you are on STD-BY you can be assigned a flight covering only your STD-BY days.
-12 days off
- etc etc
An average month is between 56 and 65 flight hours (+ maybe 1 day or two on a ground course), max rosterable being 75, while it was 90-100 on my previous company.
As I said, this has all been negotiated by the CC Unions, and the company IS making money, just to discredit the belief that you have to treat personnel like slaves to make money.
before being in a flag carrier I was in a private airline (both schedule and charter), and my roster was dramatically different.
Having known something like what you describe, I really cannot complain now (even if some of my collegues do...). We have many rules (negotiated by the unions of course) that prevent the airline from savagely rostering us. Like (for MH) :
-no more than six days on in a row
-6 days on in a row maximum once a month
-when you are on 6 days in a row it's not possible to be in a 3 days on followed by another 3 days on or a 4 +2 (could be 2 +2+2, or 2+1+1+1 etc)
-6 days OFF in a row once a month.
-if one of your flights is cancelled you cannot be rostered on a flight exceeding the return time of your originally rostered flight
-when you are on STD-BY you can be assigned a flight covering only your STD-BY days.
-12 days off
- etc etc
An average month is between 56 and 65 flight hours (+ maybe 1 day or two on a ground course), max rosterable being 75, while it was 90-100 on my previous company.
As I said, this has all been negotiated by the CC Unions, and the company IS making money, just to discredit the belief that you have to treat personnel like slaves to make money.
Last edited by flyblue; 19th September 2003 at 04:28.
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2003
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From: metal tube in the sky
flyblue obviously the UK CAA has very different rules to what you describe. I am sure most UK based CAA will vouch for the fact we regularly work 6 consecutive days on a 6 on 3 off pattern, with some days (feels like most!) working 4 sectors. 
I am not too familiar on the CAA FTL rulings but from what I can make out UK CC are allowed to do 6 days on, but it must be followed by atleast 2 days off. We must have 2 off together every 2 weeks and 1 off every 7 days. We can work on the 7th day but only for positioning or so I believe.
Stay where you are, I'm coming to join you judging by those rulings!
I am not too familiar on the CAA FTL rulings but from what I can make out UK CC are allowed to do 6 days on, but it must be followed by atleast 2 days off. We must have 2 off together every 2 weeks and 1 off every 7 days. We can work on the 7th day but only for positioning or so I believe.
Stay where you are, I'm coming to join you judging by those rulings!
