Overflight & Landing Permits - GA
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Overflight & Landing Permits - GA
Good afternoon guys,
I'm about to finalize my Master, but before I need to write a memoire.
Main topics of it concerns Overflight and Landing permits within the General Aviation.
I would be quite interested to get all your comments on how does this process work.
I would like to differentiate Private flights and Non scheduled commercial flight.
Actually I'd like to understand how does the system work with Bilateral agreement btwn countries and any other specifications.
Is there some expert in that area?
Thank you so much for your answer, my fate is in your hands
I'm about to finalize my Master, but before I need to write a memoire.
Main topics of it concerns Overflight and Landing permits within the General Aviation.
I would be quite interested to get all your comments on how does this process work.
I would like to differentiate Private flights and Non scheduled commercial flight.
Actually I'd like to understand how does the system work with Bilateral agreement btwn countries and any other specifications.
Is there some expert in that area?
Thank you so much for your answer, my fate is in your hands
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Monsieur
The summary answer is, it depends.
On...
- type of flight, scheduled, non-scheduled, private, commercial
- country of registration and membership of ICAO and/or economic bloc such as ECAC
- sometimes number of seats on aircraft (eg. Turkey)
- aircraft load eg. carriage of DG
- the countries involved and/or any tensions, embargos, restrictions
- cabotage (stealing internal business, eg. Russia and Turkey)
Scheduled airlines normally have bilateral agreements, but non-scheduled charter flights require permits - as above. So, for example BA123 LHR-DXB flies under bilateral agreement and traffic rights, whereas a charter airline operating the same route as a one-off would encounter more economic and national hurdles.
The summary answer is, it depends.
On...
- type of flight, scheduled, non-scheduled, private, commercial
- country of registration and membership of ICAO and/or economic bloc such as ECAC
- sometimes number of seats on aircraft (eg. Turkey)
- aircraft load eg. carriage of DG
- the countries involved and/or any tensions, embargos, restrictions
- cabotage (stealing internal business, eg. Russia and Turkey)
Scheduled airlines normally have bilateral agreements, but non-scheduled charter flights require permits - as above. So, for example BA123 LHR-DXB flies under bilateral agreement and traffic rights, whereas a charter airline operating the same route as a one-off would encounter more economic and national hurdles.
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Thank you so much for your answer my lord !
I knew this topic would be a headache but as we say, "no pain no gain"..
Well basically after some researches i realized as you said that there isn't a unique way to proceed, and that OVF & landing permits vary from the operations type and all variant you mentioned.
I would like to concentrate my memoire only on private and non-scheduled commercial flights operated with biz jets.
According to what i've found here and there, for private flight, that's not a big deal, as you "only" need to comply with Entry requirements of the overflown country or the country you want to land at and wait for CAA overview and answer.
However, for non schedule commercial flights i would say it's the same as above, e.g complying with entry requirements.. but i was wondering if the fact that a bilateral agreement had been signed between the country of registration and the country you fly to would that change the deal and make things easier?
To my knowledge bilateral agreement deals with flight frequencies, designated operators, prices... But is there, a part from multilateral agreement (opensky EU/US and other?) agreement allowing any movement and/operator to perform flights between 2 different countries?
I'm not sure to be clear.. if not tell me I'll try to explain me differently
Thanks again Dallas
! I knew this topic would be a headache but as we say, "no pain no gain"..
Well basically after some researches i realized as you said that there isn't a unique way to proceed, and that OVF & landing permits vary from the operations type and all variant you mentioned.
I would like to concentrate my memoire only on private and non-scheduled commercial flights operated with biz jets.
According to what i've found here and there, for private flight, that's not a big deal, as you "only" need to comply with Entry requirements of the overflown country or the country you want to land at and wait for CAA overview and answer.
However, for non schedule commercial flights i would say it's the same as above, e.g complying with entry requirements.. but i was wondering if the fact that a bilateral agreement had been signed between the country of registration and the country you fly to would that change the deal and make things easier?
To my knowledge bilateral agreement deals with flight frequencies, designated operators, prices... But is there, a part from multilateral agreement (opensky EU/US and other?) agreement allowing any movement and/operator to perform flights between 2 different countries?
I'm not sure to be clear.. if not tell me I'll try to explain me differently
Thanks again Dallas
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Yep, you're basically right as below. Normally private flights have either no permit requirements, or they're a simple debt check and permit granted.
Commercial charter requirements vary depending on the items listed in my original reply. For example, our company arranged for a nonEU-reg bizjet to operate commercially within the EU. If it had been a EU reg it would have been unfettered under the ECAC Agreement, but as an outsider this required us to gain individual authority from the countries affected, all of whom have different levels of home market protectionism in place.
The same is true around the world. Many countries don't care about the type of the flight, but others will put operators through differing levels of checks - some cursory, others more detailed - but sometimes intended to put a stick in the spokes of a foreign OPR stepping on their turf! That said, with a handful of exceptions, most authorities are willing to help and will normally give approvals faster than published timescales. It also depends on the scale of the intended operation - a one off Global Express clearly has different implications to, say, a summer charter 767.
Bilateral agreements are by definition government to government deals, but I believe you're broadly right that MOU are exchanged for routes/carriers.
Commercial charter requirements vary depending on the items listed in my original reply. For example, our company arranged for a nonEU-reg bizjet to operate commercially within the EU. If it had been a EU reg it would have been unfettered under the ECAC Agreement, but as an outsider this required us to gain individual authority from the countries affected, all of whom have different levels of home market protectionism in place.
The same is true around the world. Many countries don't care about the type of the flight, but others will put operators through differing levels of checks - some cursory, others more detailed - but sometimes intended to put a stick in the spokes of a foreign OPR stepping on their turf! That said, with a handful of exceptions, most authorities are willing to help and will normally give approvals faster than published timescales. It also depends on the scale of the intended operation - a one off Global Express clearly has different implications to, say, a summer charter 767.
Bilateral agreements are by definition government to government deals, but I believe you're broadly right that MOU are exchanged for routes/carriers.
Last edited by dallas; 10th May 2015 at 09:54.
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Hi Crazy Dude,
I'd pretty much echo Dallas's comments but if you want some specific country information the Universal Aviation blog has some useful insights into entry requirements of different countries for both private and non-schedule commercial biz jet aircraft: - Universal®: Business Aviation Blog | Operational Insight Blog
I'd pretty much echo Dallas's comments but if you want some specific country information the Universal Aviation blog has some useful insights into entry requirements of different countries for both private and non-schedule commercial biz jet aircraft: - Universal®: Business Aviation Blog | Operational Insight Blog
I have done a lot of international flying, in private light aircraft.
In Europe/USA/South Africa/Australia and a few others one files a flight plan (sometimes a day or so before the flight) and goes. The sign of a civilised country (IMHO).
Outside these places it gets more complicated, previous permission needs to be obtained sometimes weeks ahead. Each country publishes a document called the "AIP" or "Air Pilot" which includes, amongst a lot of other stuff, what they want to know and who to ask. It gets more difficult when the relevant person never answers your request, in which case you have the choice of aborting the trip or just turning up and hoping for the best.
The other way of solving this problem is to use a clearance agent who often has agents in country who know who to ask and/or who's palm to grease to get quick permissions. This service costs of course.
In Europe/USA/South Africa/Australia and a few others one files a flight plan (sometimes a day or so before the flight) and goes. The sign of a civilised country (IMHO).
Outside these places it gets more complicated, previous permission needs to be obtained sometimes weeks ahead. Each country publishes a document called the "AIP" or "Air Pilot" which includes, amongst a lot of other stuff, what they want to know and who to ask. It gets more difficult when the relevant person never answers your request, in which case you have the choice of aborting the trip or just turning up and hoping for the best.
The other way of solving this problem is to use a clearance agent who often has agents in country who know who to ask and/or who's palm to grease to get quick permissions. This service costs of course.
Romeo Tango
When you say "Each country publishes a document called the "AIP" or "Air Pilot" which includes, amongst a lot of other stuff, what they want to know and who to ask", are you saying that AIP stands for "Air Pilot" or that some countries don't call it the AIP?
I have only ever heard of the AIP as short for Aeronautical Information Publication. In the US I had a book called FAR/AIM (Federal Aviation Regulations/ Aeronautical Information Manual).
When you say "Each country publishes a document called the "AIP" or "Air Pilot" which includes, amongst a lot of other stuff, what they want to know and who to ask", are you saying that AIP stands for "Air Pilot" or that some countries don't call it the AIP?
I have only ever heard of the AIP as short for Aeronautical Information Publication. In the US I had a book called FAR/AIM (Federal Aviation Regulations/ Aeronautical Information Manual).
Not sure but I guess it used to be the "Air Pilot" when it was thought of (1930s or 1940s?) based on "Marine Pilot" publications.
I am not sure if AIP (Aeronautical Information Publication) is generic. According to Wikipedia it is.
I can confirm that nearly all countries do publish one though many are not updated very often. In pre internet days I remember visiting some civil servants somewhere obscure in London where they maintained a library of them.
I am not sure if AIP (Aeronautical Information Publication) is generic. According to Wikipedia it is.
I can confirm that nearly all countries do publish one though many are not updated very often. In pre internet days I remember visiting some civil servants somewhere obscure in London where they maintained a library of them.
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Ah, those Non-Scheduled flights...such a big fun! 
Take Russian overflight using the Trans Siberian routes...for example RJAA - EHAM. The aircraft is let's say registered in one of the countries which does not have the bilateral agreement with Russia (and its National Carrier, i.e Aeroflot), operating under AOC as Non-Scheduled Commercial passenger traffic. It will only be a single overflight.
If there is no such agreement - please find your way via China-Kazakhstan, as you will only be permitted to overfly Russian territory entering via Caspian Sea, and then via Rostov FIR towards Belarus. Or bypassing Russia completely. You did not plan a fuel stop for that? Well...you better do somewhere in Astana or Baku
What I am trying to say is that many believe that there is no such thing as Bilateral agreements for Non-Scheduled commercial flights, and they are only in force for scheduled commercial service. Russia, however, is standing aside and it is one of the countries (if not the only one) where you must have this agreement with the Nat. Carrier before even attempting to submit your overflight request to FATA. Try to find it in Russian AIP, it's not there either!
Private flights are easy peasy stuff comparing to the above as long as you know lead times for permit applications, right contacts etc...
Another pain is - those flying under Temporary Airworthiness Certificates, but it is a different story.
Take Russian overflight using the Trans Siberian routes...for example RJAA - EHAM. The aircraft is let's say registered in one of the countries which does not have the bilateral agreement with Russia (and its National Carrier, i.e Aeroflot), operating under AOC as Non-Scheduled Commercial passenger traffic. It will only be a single overflight.
If there is no such agreement - please find your way via China-Kazakhstan, as you will only be permitted to overfly Russian territory entering via Caspian Sea, and then via Rostov FIR towards Belarus. Or bypassing Russia completely. You did not plan a fuel stop for that? Well...you better do somewhere in Astana or Baku
What I am trying to say is that many believe that there is no such thing as Bilateral agreements for Non-Scheduled commercial flights, and they are only in force for scheduled commercial service. Russia, however, is standing aside and it is one of the countries (if not the only one) where you must have this agreement with the Nat. Carrier before even attempting to submit your overflight request to FATA. Try to find it in Russian AIP, it's not there either!
Private flights are easy peasy stuff comparing to the above as long as you know lead times for permit applications, right contacts etc...
Another pain is - those flying under Temporary Airworthiness Certificates, but it is a different story.
