500 Hours Multi-Crew
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500 Hours Multi-Crew
It is now two years since the CAA stopped issuing ATPLs once you reached the 1500 hr mark plus various night requirements. Now we have to have 500 hrs multi-crew experience (out of a total of 1500 hrs) to get a JAR ATPL issued. It is nigh-on impossible to get those hours without working for a multi-crew operation, and there's the Catch 22.
Are requirements of the business operators who normally want ATPLs now beginning to reflect the fact that many people will not have the 500 hours multi-crew when they look at CVs? It is my feeling that companies will have to start accepting CPLs with 1500 hrs experience and ATPL exams, and then let you get the 500hrs with them, but I'm interested to hear whether anyone has actually experienced that yet.
Are requirements of the business operators who normally want ATPLs now beginning to reflect the fact that many people will not have the 500 hours multi-crew when they look at CVs? It is my feeling that companies will have to start accepting CPLs with 1500 hrs experience and ATPL exams, and then let you get the 500hrs with them, but I'm interested to hear whether anyone has actually experienced that yet.
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Read Lasors part F-10
There are guys that have the 500h experience abroad and getting the JAR ATPL reconversion.
Coming on the market with both experience and European Theory's still possible for those who went abroad to get experienced.
Of course, if the companys are looking for nationals that stayed around, they'll have to drop down a bit on requirements as guys that don't move around to get experience won't be experienced...
But what European companies look for is experienced people. They pay for that level and are searching for it... So definitly if you are a 0 time, It might be a good solution to move outside europe to pick up a low paid 0 time job to come back with the experience few years after....
That's basically what i'm doing now!
But it's certain that requirements will drop if there's a lack of experienced pilots, but not to the point of taking all the crowd of 0 time pilots....
tyfilou
There are guys that have the 500h experience abroad and getting the JAR ATPL reconversion.
Coming on the market with both experience and European Theory's still possible for those who went abroad to get experienced.
Of course, if the companys are looking for nationals that stayed around, they'll have to drop down a bit on requirements as guys that don't move around to get experience won't be experienced...
But what European companies look for is experienced people. They pay for that level and are searching for it... So definitly if you are a 0 time, It might be a good solution to move outside europe to pick up a low paid 0 time job to come back with the experience few years after....
That's basically what i'm doing now!
But it's certain that requirements will drop if there's a lack of experienced pilots, but not to the point of taking all the crowd of 0 time pilots....
tyfilou
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I see "eye in the skys " view point. How many hoops you gotta jump through before you get the licence? They keep on putting these extra requirements to protect the industry. Thats all seems to me as achieveing. Its the chicken before the egg theory, doesnt really work in practise. Just another reason why Im not bothering to go over there.....
Sheep
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Most of my contemporaries (out of commercial school 6 months ago and all still looking) would be delighted with any flying job. So very few of us will be getting multi crew time.
So it sees a good time to ask ...
1/ What is the time limit to unfreeze your (JAA) ATPL ?.
2/ If you don't meet all the parameters within the 1,500 hours, what happens then ...
3/ And if #2 is a bad answer, can people apply for more time, given the market conditions in the last 3 or 4 years ?.
Thanks,
D129
So it sees a good time to ask ...
1/ What is the time limit to unfreeze your (JAA) ATPL ?.
2/ If you don't meet all the parameters within the 1,500 hours, what happens then ...
3/ And if #2 is a bad answer, can people apply for more time, given the market conditions in the last 3 or 4 years ?.
Thanks,
D129
Join Date: Aug 2003
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Hi Folkes,
It's true, Netjets require a full ATPL (this seems to me to be a PR thing) but not sure about other operators. Seems to be a bit of a bu@@er but here's the thing, what are you going to use an ATPL for practically speaking? You need one to COMMAND an aircraft over 5,700kg which requires two pilots anyway. Now, do you really want to put someone in command of a multi-crew operation if they have little or no experience of multi-crew ops? Not really. So you can gain a position as FO on a multi-crew type with a frozen ATPL (they are out there, trust me), gain your 500 hours multi-crew and will probably still need a good deal more experience before you are ready to be upgraded. Don't get me wrong, I'm eager for my "Green Book", but it is an apprenticeship.
P.S. As far as I know, the ATPL subjects are locked in until you get your ATPL, i.e. indefinitely. If you haven't upgraded from CPL to ATPL before the licence runs out, it gets transfered to a JAA licence with ATPL theory credits. (You might want to confirm this elsewhere
)
You don't have to have all the requirements within the 1500 hours. 1500 hours is JUST ONE of the requirements of the ATPL. I have over 1500 hours and all the requirements for the ATPL bar the 500 hours multi-crew. So I have a CPL until I gain those multi-crew hours and then have to complete a flight test - most likely a type-rating/IR recurrent to "ATPL Standard".
Don't panic guys and gals, it all gets sorted out in the wash
Cheers,
Chips
It's true, Netjets require a full ATPL (this seems to me to be a PR thing) but not sure about other operators. Seems to be a bit of a bu@@er but here's the thing, what are you going to use an ATPL for practically speaking? You need one to COMMAND an aircraft over 5,700kg which requires two pilots anyway. Now, do you really want to put someone in command of a multi-crew operation if they have little or no experience of multi-crew ops? Not really. So you can gain a position as FO on a multi-crew type with a frozen ATPL (they are out there, trust me), gain your 500 hours multi-crew and will probably still need a good deal more experience before you are ready to be upgraded. Don't get me wrong, I'm eager for my "Green Book", but it is an apprenticeship.
P.S. As far as I know, the ATPL subjects are locked in until you get your ATPL, i.e. indefinitely. If you haven't upgraded from CPL to ATPL before the licence runs out, it gets transfered to a JAA licence with ATPL theory credits. (You might want to confirm this elsewhere
)You don't have to have all the requirements within the 1500 hours. 1500 hours is JUST ONE of the requirements of the ATPL. I have over 1500 hours and all the requirements for the ATPL bar the 500 hours multi-crew. So I have a CPL until I gain those multi-crew hours and then have to complete a flight test - most likely a type-rating/IR recurrent to "ATPL Standard".
Don't panic guys and gals, it all gets sorted out in the wash
Cheers,
Chips
