Aviation History and Nostalgia Whether working in aviation, retired, wannabee or just plain fascinated this forum welcomes all with a love of flight.

A300 is 50

Old 31st Oct 2022, 10:40
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: birmingham uk
Posts: 125
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
A300 is 50

Time flies .. Airbus A300 is 50 years since first flight, here is a nice short video from Airbus
simoncorbett is offline  
Old 1st Nov 2022, 09:55
  #2 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Ferrara
Posts: 5,438
Received 22 Likes on 12 Posts
Amazing! And I can remember a lot of people (especially amongst the Anglo-Saxons) saying it was a White Elephant....................
Asturias56 is offline  
Old 1st Nov 2022, 10:28
  #3 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2021
Location: UK
Posts: 40
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Asturias56 View Post
Amazing! And I can remember a lot of people (especially amongst the Anglo-Saxons) saying it was a White Elephant....................
The Anglo Saxons predicted the A300 over 1,000 years before its first flight?
Ohrly is offline  
Old 1st Nov 2022, 13:17
  #4 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 102
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Well, to start with it was. The clue is in the name Air-Bus, it was designed as a short/medium haul wide body in the belief that people connecting from a 747 long haul flight would want "wide body comfort" (remember that?). It turned out that there were hardly any short haul routes that could support A300 operations without reducing frequencies and those that tried lost custom to airlines operating narrow bodies at a greater frequency. The project was saved by the advent of ETOPS and they were able to develop the thing into a longer-range aircraft, whilst busily developing a short haul narrow body.
Alan Baker is online now  
Old 1st Nov 2022, 15:11
  #5 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Ferrara
Posts: 5,438
Received 22 Likes on 12 Posts
Actually I think they sold a load before ETOPS came in Airbus A300 twinjets, the first twin-engine wide-body aircraft, had been flying across the North Atlantic, the Bay of Bengal, and the Indian Ocean under a 90-minute ICAO rule since 1976.

I think ETOPS only came in formally when Boeing offered the 767 in about 1984


Asturias56 is offline  
Old 1st Nov 2022, 16:34
  #6 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: UK
Age: 65
Posts: 457
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Not that popular in UK - Laker ordered 10 but took only 3.

BCAL took 2 A310's (totally unsuitable for them in the end)

Monarch took 4 later build early 1990's A300-600R's fitted with 361Y seats, which were real workhorses for them and kept them busy until 2014, on both short and the many long haul flights to Egypt, Banjul, Mombasa, Goa, The Maldives, Agra, Trivandrum, Orlando, Denver, Calgary, Mexico and the Caribbean Islands, often filling in for a sick A330 but had to make a Tech stop for fuel on the way.
Weirdly Monarch had 767-300s on order from Boeing in the 1980s but these were cancelled and they took the A300-600R, which was way inferior to the long range of the 763.
This last version, the A300-600R had a tailplane fuel tank, PW4000 engine option, and higher gross weight options and longer range, a two crew modern cockpit, a redesigned rear fuselage, wing modifications, winglets, ETOPS, and other improvements for better fuel economy.

The first and second A300B prototypes were built to B1 standard. The third aircraft was of B2 standard and was longer than the original B1. First examples went to Air France, the launch customer and Lufthansa.
The B2-200 included Krueger leading edge flaps and different wheels and brakes; the B2-300 had increased weights for greater payload and multi stop capability and utilised the Pratt + Whitney JT9D-59A turbofan engine ordered by Iberia and SAS.
The A300-B4-100 was a heavier longer-range version of the original A300-B2-100 and the B4-200 had further weight increase, that features a centre fuel tank for increased fuel capacity (47,500 kg) and new wing root Krüger flaps which were later made available as an option for the B2.
A300B4-100
157.5 Metric Ton MTOW, first delivery to Germanair in 1975.
A300B4-200
165 Metric Ton MTOW, first delivery to Hapag-Lloyd Flug in 1980.

The Airbus A300 in its B2 and B4 versions wasn't a very long-legged machine, however it provided widebody comfort on the busy leisure routes from Northern Europe to the Mediterranean sunspots in a more economical package than the Tristar and DC-10.
The UK and Germany were the two biggest charter markets in Europe and the A300 was a major part of moving the masses for a variety of holiday airlines.
Back in the 1970's TEA, Transavia and Germanair were the first charter airlines to have them.

TEA
Their old 720s and 707-120s had been good aircraft for the start-up to use at the dawn of the 1970s package holiday market, but the oil crisis of the early-mid 70s made them rather unattractive due to their turbojet engines.
Founder George Gutelman looked for new more fuel-efficient equipment and lucked out in finding a rather desperate Airbus who were struggling to sell their new A300 aircraft. He cannily did a deal with them for the second production aircraft and OO-TEF was delivered on November 25, 1974.
OO-TEF named Aline, the second Airbus B1 prototype, "Aline" is name of the TEA founder's wife.
This was the second A300 "Airbus" to be built. C/N 002 was built as a prototype as a series B1. Only two B1s were built. This aircraft was built in 1973 and leased out to TEA in 1974. She was taken out of TEA service 1990.
Note the smaller fuselage, only 167 ft 2 in, as opposed to the 177 ft 4 in of the B2 and B4 series.
The B1 had a range of just 1850 nm.
The Trans European Airways B1 could accommodate 300Y passengers; when on the Air Algerie lease it could seat 323 passengers.

TEA took another Airbus in 1975, a new B4 msn 17 OO-TEG named Adrianus Andreas Jr with 314Y seats.
(Originally built for Iberia but NTU, it was then due to go to Transavia as PH-TEV but NTU)
Due to over capacity in April 1977 OO-TEG was leased to Egyptair for two years wearing an hybrid TEA livery. On July 2 1979 it was re registered and later resprayed in full Egyptair livery. It would never return to TEA as while on lease it was sold on to Hapag Lloyd to become D-AHLC in 1982.

Transavia took another one PH-TVL, named Apollo 76 with 314Y seats (which was a pre-used B2 of Air Siam msn 8)

Germanair in 1975 got Airbus A300B4's D-AMAX msn 12 named "Maximilian" and D-AMAY msn 20 named Ludwig I, fitted with 315Y seats.
Maximilian was also the first ever Airbus aircraft registered in Germany.
The airline merged in to Bavaria Germanair in 1977, and D-AMAZ was delivered to Bavaria Germanair.

Another B2C msn 9 destined for Air Siam was NTU - this was converted in 1974 to the latest B4 standard and in 1976 went to Air France as F-ODCY and was the first B4 to enter service. It was then stored until 1978 and it went to Bavaria Germanair as D-AMAP
(Dan Air had D-AMAP later as G-BMNB)
Bavaria Germanair merged again to Hapag Lloyd in 1979 taking over the A300 fleet, along with ordering 2 new aircraft themselves.
D-AMAZ was sold to PIA in 1986 who crashed it into the Himalayan mountains on approach to Kathmandu in 1992.

In 1979 Martinair became an early customer for the Airbus shortened A300 variant and ordered three 265Y seat A310-200s; although only two were eventually delivered in 1984, and the third A310 PH-MCG was NTU and went to KLM.
PH-MCA was named Prins Bernhard.
Given the airline's interest in Combi's it was no surprise that their second A310, PH-MCB Prins Maurits, was a Combi variant (indeed it was the only one made) Both A310s were operated by Martinair until 1995 on high density European holiday charter flights.

Condor would operate the A300 from 1983 until 1988 with examples leased from parent Lufthansa and TAA.

Luxair was also an early customer, and had ordered a new B4 msn 299 for delivery in 1984.
Painted up as LX-LGZ but it was not delivered/NTU (Stored until 12/1986 it then went to KAR-AIR as OH-LAA)
Instead Luxair a week later took a second-hand B4 msn 269 as LX-LGP, ex Singapore Airlines.
Luxair used it on IT charter flights and on the Luxavia/Trek Airways flights LUX to Johannesburg.
OH-LAA (Kar-Air, now Finnair Charter) would be later leased in 1998 to Air Scandic as G-TTMC (then subleased to Caledonian Airways)
along with sister ship OH-LAB as G-SWJW.

SAS took 4 PW JT9D-59A powered A300B4-320's in 1980 which were an unsuitable fit for the airline and so passed them all to Scanair in 1983 but one crashed while on sublease with MAS at KUL.
Scanair had the 4 aircraft modified to A300B4-120 standard with Aux fuel tanks, and higher MTOW.
With 295Y seats, the type could now make it to Las Palmas and Tenerife non-stop from Scandinavian airports.
These 3 then ended up sold to Conair of Denmark (only then to merge with Scanair to become Premiair)

The intention had been for Scanair to lease all four aircraft, but one crashed while on a short lease to Malaysia Airlines in the same year.
The version supplied to SAS had been something of a hybrid and could not even reach Las Palmas without refuelling, thus considerably limiting their operational capabilities. Later, additional fuel tanks were installed by Airbus and the aircraft was re-designated as an A300B4-120, although even this modification did not allow them to operate effectively on the longer-haul destinations such as Banjul, Mombasa and Colombo.
Despite this, Scanair achieved the highest recorded flight time in the world on its A300s with 9.05hrs per day compared with the world average of 6.42.
The 3 A300s were sold in 1987 to Conair, and were soon to be replaced by six DC-10 10s.
Even though Scanair was the world's best in utilizing its A300 fleet, SAS had lost money by keeping the type in the fleet. In 1985, SAS announced that it wanted full cost coverage for Scanair's Airbus fleet - in other words, the type's days were numbered.
SAS had already started hunting for buyers and was close to signing a contract with Iberia's charter company Aviaco. The deal collapsed, but the Spies-owned charter company Conair showed its interest. In 1986, contracts were signed and the following year Conair took over the three aircraft. Scanair now began to explore the possibilities for the DC-8 63 replacement.The SAS DC-10-30 had too much range for Scanair's needs.
Boeing 757 and 767 were studied, but also the Airbus A300-600R and A310-300.
The choice for Scanair finally fell on the DC-10 10 with 6 ex Western Airlines examples sought. 2 of these were then subleased to airlines in the USA.

In the 1980s and 90s the A300 was a common sight operating trunk leisure routes during the summer charter peak and then the winter Ski flights at weekends, before low-cost airlines and the internet impacted the inclusive tour market.
The big Airbus could be seen operating these flights, for the sheer size of the IT market from UK and Germany made sure that A300s were common as people movers from charter heavy airports like Gatwick Manchester Munich and Dusseldorf.

UK Charters, Orion in 1987, Dan Air in 1986, and then of course, Air Scandic would all take pairs of rather old A300's leased from LH, HF, and AY.

Dan Air had never operated widebody aircraft before and was facing challenges in the holiday charter market. It had been a firm believer in buying older aircraft and operating them cheaply, but by the 1980s however this policy was not working anymore as its fleet was made up of older BAC One-Elevens and Boeing 727s, which were less attractive to the holiday companies that booked its capacity and who were increasingly also creating their own in-house airlines.
Two 336Y seat A300s were sourced from Hapag Lloyd were to be used from 1986 on Dan Air's trunk charter routes to the likes of Corfu, Ibiza, Heraklion, Rhodes, Malaga, Alicante, Faro, The Canary Islands, and Palma.
The first A300 G-BMNA was only temporarily leased by Dan Air in basic Hapag colours and this A300 was returned once two other aircraft were delivered (NB and NC).
Unfortunately for Dan Air the Airbus coincided with a decrease in their contracted IT flying which the fleet modernisation didn't stop. The losses continued to mount and the A300s were returned. G-BMNC operated her last service in October 1990.

Orion Airways based at East Midlands would buy two ex Lufthansa A300's in 1987>
One each to be based at LGW and MAN, swapped around each week for Dan Air to do the engineering for them.
They seated 324Y passengers and were used for owner Horizon Holidays flights to the Med.
Video here of the Orion A300 introduction in 1987 -

Monarch Airlines was one of few to buy the newer more capable A300-600R in 1990, and then added the newer long range RR A330-200 in 1999.
The adoption of the long range A330 wide-bodies then permitted Monarch to serve long-haul charter destinations non-stop with a proper two class premium option seating configuration, which was a first for Monarch.
The airlines A300's were available to serve as back-ups when the A330's had a technical problem.
Both types leaving the fleet in 2014 and 2015.

Last edited by rog747; 2nd Nov 2022 at 10:31. Reason: some additions Orion A300 video and updates
rog747 is offline  
Old 1st Nov 2022, 17:04
  #7 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: under the sea
Posts: 2,738
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
The Monarch B767 order was delivered but went straight on lease.Mael did keep up the technical records for them.
tubby linton is offline  
Old 1st Nov 2022, 17:06
  #8 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: UK
Age: 65
Posts: 457
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by tubby linton View Post
The Monarch B767 order was delivered but went straight on lease.Mael did keep up the technical records for them.
I think they went to Ansett or was it Alitalia > ? AWAS 767-33A/ER
rog747 is offline  
Old 1st Nov 2022, 18:30
  #9 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: under the sea
Posts: 2,738
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
I thought they went to Eva and then Aeroflot.MSN 25076 and 25117
tubby linton is offline  
Old 1st Nov 2022, 19:53
  #10 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Reading, UK
Posts: 14,602
Likes: 0
Received 27 Likes on 12 Posts
I have fond memories of sitting in a field under the 09L approach with a BA Engineering colleague and a portable B&K recorder doing noise spectrum analyses soon after AFR started A300 ops to Heathrow in 1974.

I can't remember what we concluded, but I'm sure it wasn't the reason BA never bought them.
DaveReidUK is offline  
Old 2nd Nov 2022, 10:34
  #11 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: UK
Age: 65
Posts: 457
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I have added a load of updates to my earlier post above, plus a great Orion Airways video showing their A300 launch.
A combination of the lovely Cheryl Baker becoming a 'Stewardess for a day' enroute from Almeria, and the arrival of the Orion A300 Airbus.

my post #6
rog747 is offline  
Old 2nd Nov 2022, 11:04
  #12 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: UK
Age: 65
Posts: 457
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
OM 767-3T7ER and -33AER

Originally Posted by tubby linton View Post
The Monarch B767 order was delivered but went straight on lease.Mael did keep up the technical records for them.
Just had a sleuth Tubby Linton -

Monarch had ordered 2 GE-CF6 powered B767-3T7(ER) in 1989, for delivery in May 1991 to be used on long-haul charter routes.
They would have seated 318 passengers. Their delivery coincided with the recession of the early 1990s, Monarch having already had to lease out 2 A300s, and were expecting the next 2 at the same time as the new 767s.
In the end they were sold to EVA Air before delivery. (N601EV and N602EV)
The aircraft were never owned or leased by Monarch, the delivery slots being sold by Boeing before the aircraft were delivered in May 1991.

Is that correct >? 767-3T7ER

Incidentally, I read too that at around this time (1989) Monarch took options on A330s when it ordered it's 4 A300-600Rs only to reject the type as unsuitable a couple of years later.
Yet another change of heart came in 1997 when the Rolls Royce A330-200 was now available and Monarch did finally order the aircraft they couldn't make their mind up about for 8 years.

The Alitalia 767-300ER's I thought Monarch had ordered were totally different aircraft, and six were leased from 1994 from AWAS Ansett Worldwide to Alitalia.
They were -33As (denoting AWAS Ansett ownership) rather than -3T7s (denoting Monarch ownership)
They were initially crewed by Ansett FD crews until October 1994.
I gather from a pal at Air 2000 they thenprovided the crews for Winter 1994/5, but did not have sufficient crews for the summer season, so Monarch got the contract, with the aircraft being placed on the UK register in the series G-OITA/TB/TC G-OITF/TG and G-OITL for the duration.
For obvious reasons Alitalia didn't publicise the fact it was crewing it's 767s with lower paid UK/Australian crews!
These aircraft were then re registered in Italy, and crewed by Italians as TEAM Alitalia in 1996.

MONARCH AIRLINES is on the verge of taking over the contentious wet-leased Boeing 767-300ER operation

Here is the non-paywall article from July 1995 Source: Flight International

MONARCH AIRLINES is on the verge of taking over the contentious wet-leased Boeing 767-300ER operation, now provided by Ansett Worldwide Aviation Services on behalf of Alitalia.
The new deal is an extension of a long-standing agreement between Monarch and Ansett, under which the UK airline will manage and operate the aircraft on its own Air Operators' Certificate. Monarch is already providing maintenance for the first two aircraft, which have been flying several of the Italian flag carriers' transatlantic services from Rome and Milan since February.
The two aircraft, plus two more, are expected to join the UK register in late July, and will be flown with UK crews, according to Monarch's operations director, Captain Mike Poole. Another four will be added by early in 1996.
The operator change meets a European Commission directive stipulating that wet-lease of aircraft and crew from outside the European Union will only be granted on a temporary or extraordinary basis.
The aircraft are being used in a bid by loss-making Alitalia to restructure its intercontinental network with more suitable aircraft, at a time when its own crew are not qualified for ETOPS operations. The wet-lease serves as a bridge until its own crew are qualified, and towards the introduction of bigger twins in its longer-term fleet plan, says Michael Harrington, Alitalia's senior vice-president, network and fleet development.
Alitalia, which has run into difficulties with its pilot and cabin crew unions over the scheme, is planning to extend the services between Rome/Milan and Boston, Chicago, New York, Newark and Miami.

rog747 is offline  
Old 2nd Nov 2022, 15:45
  #13 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: under the sea
Posts: 2,738
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Given the rather clandestine way the original owners ran the company anything is possible. It was rumoured that they owned up to fifty aircraft..
tubby linton is offline  
Old 2nd Nov 2022, 17:53
  #14 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: There and here
Posts: 2,630
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
I have fond memories of sitting in a field under the 09L approach with a BA Engineering colleague and a portable B&K recorder doing noise spectrum analyses soon after AFR started A300 ops to Heathrow in 1974.
I, like many others went to LHR to see the inaugural flight land from Paris on 28R (if memory serves) very excited to see this new beast, only to be brought down to earth by some nonchalant spectator up on the Queens Building who didn't see the fuss "as it had landed yesterday on a test flight" to make sure all went smoothly on the day.

I always found the A300 a nice aircraft to fly on and due to chance and circumstance flew on most of the airlines that operated them save a few. Air Afrique was my favourite C/S on the A300.
SpringHeeledJack is online now  
Old 2nd Nov 2022, 18:08
  #15 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Ferrara
Posts: 5,438
Received 22 Likes on 12 Posts
"Not that popular in UK "

yeah the UK market tended to go for smaller planes - BAC11, 737 of course - possibly operating out of more airports
Asturias56 is offline  
Old 2nd Nov 2022, 23:51
  #16 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Dorset UK
Age: 69
Posts: 1,571
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Trivia question - Who was the biggest operator of the A300 on the UK register?
dixi188 is online now  
Old 3rd Nov 2022, 04:45
  #17 (permalink)  
Gnome de PPRuNe
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Too close to Croydon for comfort
Age: 58
Posts: 10,923
Received 4 Likes on 4 Posts
I'm assuming DHL?

No... Channel Express?
treadigraph is online now  
Old 3rd Nov 2022, 09:16
  #18 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Essex
Posts: 662
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by treadigraph View Post
I'm assuming DHL?

No... Channel Express?
The DHL A300B4’s were Belgium registered, or Irish (Air Contractors). Channex had six I think? HeavyLift had four including a former Laker pax aircraft.

The A300 is still the nicest airliner I’ve flown……
Double Hydco is offline  
Old 3rd Nov 2022, 09:33
  #19 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Bonvoy Marriott
Posts: 400
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Flew both the B4 and the -600. Although I did miss the FE the -600 is by far the best airliner I flew. Now I am demoted to inferior Boeing products for the rest of my career . The -600 cockpit was so ahead of it’s time.

the problem of the A300 was it’s limited range. For the operators the 767-300 made more sense. At least until the A330 arrived
SaulGoodman is offline  
Old 3rd Nov 2022, 10:26
  #20 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Ferrara
Posts: 5,438
Received 22 Likes on 12 Posts
"the problem of the A300 was it’s limited range. For the operators the 767-300 made more sense."

But the A300 was 10 years ahead of even the basic 767 in service. One of the reasons for the slow take-up of course was a lot of the '70's airlines and economies were in recession - especially in the UK. Shelling out for a big new airliner when you could keep that BAC111 running wasn't attractive
Asturias56 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information

Copyright © 2023 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.