Terrain Following Radar and the Buccaneer
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 452
Terrain Following Radar and the Buccaneer
From a little research it seems that this radar was designed for the TSR2 but that development continued after the TSR2 was cancelled.
You'll note that the main trials aircraft is a Buccaneer (S1 - XK 487) which begs the question why wasn't this TFR fitted to the Buccaneers the RAF later operated?
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: There and here
Posts: 2,495
Bearing in mind just how low some sorties were, at least the RAF Buccaneers, would the terrain following radar have been much use if below 500feet ? It just seems that you'd need very cool blood to trust your life to such a wondrous invention.
, though I bet there are times when the TFR folk wish they hadn't.
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Bournemouth
Posts: 43
Originally Posted by SpringHeeledJack
Bearing in mind just how low some sorties were, at least the RAF Buccaneers, would the terrain following radar have been much use if below 500feet ? It just seems that you'd need very cool blood to trust your life to such a wondrous invention.
Join Date: May 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 1,134
If you're looking for a more in depth treatment then there is:
TSR2 Precision Attack to Tornado
by John Forbat
ISBN 978 0 7524 3919 8
pub Tempus 2006
It covers considerably more than the title implies. Available from the South American River but cheaper on AbeBooks
YS
TSR2 Precision Attack to Tornado
by John Forbat
ISBN 978 0 7524 3919 8
pub Tempus 2006
It covers considerably more than the title implies. Available from the South American River but cheaper on AbeBooks
YS
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 452
Originally Posted by Yellow Sun
If you're looking for a more in depth treatment then there is:
TSR2 Precision Attack to Tornado
by John Forbat
ISBN 978 0 7524 3919 8
pub Tempus 2006
It covers considerably more than the title implies. Available from the South American River but cheaper on AbeBooks
YS
TSR2 Precision Attack to Tornado
by John Forbat
ISBN 978 0 7524 3919 8
pub Tempus 2006
It covers considerably more than the title implies. Available from the South American River but cheaper on AbeBooks
YS
One aircraft that did get a retrofit of a TFR was the Vulcan in the 1960s. The set selected was American though it had a lower speed restriction than the Ferranti TFR.
I understand that the Ferranti TFR was proposed for the Phantom and the ground attack version of the Tornado. In the latter case it lost out to a cheaper American radar.
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Crawley
Posts: 143
The American TFR on the Vulcan had a habit of every now and again of indicating a "fly down" instead of "fly up". It was very unreliable and the pod was changed so often even engine fitters were experienced with the task. It also had the silliest cooling system. The air from outside was passed over the electronics straight from the cooling vents. This was OK when the air was dry but if the aircraft flew through cloud or rain we used to remove the pod and tip it up to let the water run out.
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Peripatetic
Posts: 12,645
The Buccaneer also did the trials for the Tornado radar and TFR of course.
I remember visiting some of the crews chatting with them in their crew room. According to them it was a more stable platform at low level than the Tornado with far greater legs - but they weren’t allowed to say so publicly.
I remember visiting some of the crews chatting with them in their crew room. According to them it was a more stable platform at low level than the Tornado with far greater legs - but they weren’t allowed to say so publicly.
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: There and here
Posts: 2,495
It clearly was, it says 30-50 metres was the norm for this TFR and by my reckoning, 30 metres is about 100ft. So why not 500ft?
As an aside does anyone remember a UK based flying group that had some ex-RAF jets back in the 70's/80's, painted black ? Did they have a Bucc ? I have a vague memory of sitting in one at Mildenhall or Duxford. They did have a hunter and something with torpedo wing tanks (perhaps a Canadian something ??). What ever happened to Mike Beachey-Head's Buccs when his company was wound up ?
Gnome de PPRuNe
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Too close to Croydon for comfort
Age: 58
Posts: 9,845
Ormond Haydon-Baillie had a pair of T-33s, one painted black which he flew as The Black Knight, the other red I think. He also had a Avro CF-100 Canuck at Duxford, though beyond delivery I don't think it flew. It's still at Duxford. One of the T-33s was at Duxford again until a take off accident a few years ago - one of our fellow PPRuNers was at the helm, fortunately he and his pax escaped; very sadly he died from an illness just a few months ago.
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Oxford
Age: 83
Posts: 407
As a so called TFR training officer on the Vulcan (many years ago!!) I have to confess (now!) that I had little faith in the system! Yes, it worked (up to a point) but, if it came to the crunch, I would have had some serious misgivings in it at night, IMC, at a few hundred feet and with a "bucket of sunshine" in the bomb bay! However, that was what we had in those days so we did our best, rightly or wrongly! (Sorry guys, for all the b**l that I passed on !!!
Bill
Bill
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 452
Originally Posted by pmills575
The American TFR on the Vulcan had a habit of every now and again of indicating a "fly down" instead of "fly up". It was very unreliable and the pod was changed so often even engine fitters were experienced with the task. It also had the silliest cooling system. The air from outside was passed over the electronics straight from the cooling vents. This was OK when the air was dry but if the aircraft flew through cloud or rain we used to remove the pod and tip it up to let the water run out.
Vulcan TFR at the top of the picture - compare the size to the Ferranti TFR! Don't know if the electronics below it are part of that system or something else...
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: moraira,spain-Norfolk, UK
Age: 80
Posts: 387
Worked with a chap who was involved in the TSR2 radar. According to him it was
tested on a Meteor, test flights always went to height before testing the terrain
following capability.
tested on a Meteor, test flights always went to height before testing the terrain
following capability.
