Who is the most iconic RAF figure of World War Two?
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Sid, what edition of the OED do you have? Because mine defines icon as "a person regarded with particular admiration". I would hold that Bader is probably held thus, rightly or wrongly, by many more people.
As a jazz musician, it galls me that Benny Goodman is hailed as a great, if not the greatest jazz clarinettist. Or Stephan Grapelli the greatest jazz fiddle player. Both are eclipsed in spades, but nothing will change the public's perceptions of them, or of Bader.
As a jazz musician, it galls me that Benny Goodman is hailed as a great, if not the greatest jazz clarinettist. Or Stephan Grapelli the greatest jazz fiddle player. Both are eclipsed in spades, but nothing will change the public's perceptions of them, or of Bader.
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I'm sorry but it's bomber Harris. He remains the most famous, most controversial and probably the person who had the most influence on how the war was won of all the RAF figures including Park and Dowding.
Bader was never more than a good fighter pilot with an eye for publicity. Legs or no legs, he would have been famously outspoken and a good fighter pilot. But he was never someone to rise too high up the ranks.
Gibson was famous because of the dams raid but was much disliked by his own men.
Having movies made about you does not an icon make.
Bader was never more than a good fighter pilot with an eye for publicity. Legs or no legs, he would have been famously outspoken and a good fighter pilot. But he was never someone to rise too high up the ranks.
Gibson was famous because of the dams raid but was much disliked by his own men.
Having movies made about you does not an icon make.
"Having movies made about you does not an icon make''.
But it certainly helps! Being an icon is as much about public perception as anything else. I would say that the most ''iconic'' figure was Bader. If they were all up stage on a reality TV show called "Pilot Idol" then he would probably win.
Now if they had asked "who was the most singnificant'' it would mean something else completely. I believe they had actually meant to ask us that, but due the the celebrity culture we now live in, they had to use a modern journalistic phrase.
I treated the question as "significant'' and voted for Dowding. Because without his insight and organisation, we would have lost the Battle of Britain and would all be speaking German now.
But it certainly helps! Being an icon is as much about public perception as anything else. I would say that the most ''iconic'' figure was Bader. If they were all up stage on a reality TV show called "Pilot Idol" then he would probably win.
Now if they had asked "who was the most singnificant'' it would mean something else completely. I believe they had actually meant to ask us that, but due the the celebrity culture we now live in, they had to use a modern journalistic phrase.
I treated the question as "significant'' and voted for Dowding. Because without his insight and organisation, we would have lost the Battle of Britain and would all be speaking German now.
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I treated the question as "significant'' and voted for Dowding. Because without his insight and organisation, we would have lost the Battle of Britain and would all be speaking German now.
If icon means "figure/object highest in the public eye" then it's a Spitfire.
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Dowding ahead
Many thanks for your votes in our poll to find the most iconic RAF figure of World War Two. At the moment Air Chief Marshal Dowding leads the pack, with Bader, Harris and Gibson following on close behind.
This poll has led to some great discussion about what constitutes an iconic figure, and plenty of debate about the merits of certain candidates, so we have decided to leave the poll open until the end of the year.
Please do cast your vote if you haven’t already, we would love to hear your views.
90 faces of the RAF Benevolent Fund
This poll has led to some great discussion about what constitutes an iconic figure, and plenty of debate about the merits of certain candidates, so we have decided to leave the poll open until the end of the year.
Please do cast your vote if you haven’t already, we would love to hear your views.
90 faces of the RAF Benevolent Fund
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Not a well known WW2 pilot , but Adrian Warburton was rather a special person, not an establishment figure, but certainly a hugely successfull and individual pilot. It is possible that his eccentric private life ensured that he wasn't a public relations success for the RAF, but his story certainly puts him above the more well known names of the time.
Adrian Warburton - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
BR om15.
Adrian Warburton - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
BR om15.
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The vote to find the most iconic RAF figure of World War Two is gathering pace. Air Marshal Dowding continues to lead but Bader is close behind, while Gibson and Harris are very nearly neck and neck.
However, the vote remains closely fought, so please do visit
www.rafbf90.org.uk
and make your choice if you haven’t already – every vote counts!
However, the vote remains closely fought, so please do visit
www.rafbf90.org.uk
and make your choice if you haven’t already – every vote counts!
Interesting thought prompted by the death of Richard Todd. The usual case in the cinema is that a great hero is played by an actor who is in real life nowhere near the stature of the character he or she is playing. Interesting that Kenneth More and Richard Todd, generally accepted as good guys, played characters who in reality were, shall we say, more "complex" than as portrayed. Then that's life rather than art, I suppose.
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There's still time to cast votes!
Thanks to all who have cast their votes on the most iconic RAF figure of World War Two. The online poll has been very popular so we are keeping it open until the end of January.
So there’s still time to give your opinion – every vote counts!
http://www.rafbf90.org.uk/
At the moment Air Chief Marshal Dowding leads the pack, with Bader, Harris and Gibson following on close behind.
The game is hosted on the RAF Benevolent Fund’s special 90th anniversary microsite, “90 Faces of the RAF Benevolent Fund”. The microsite is full of stories and anecdotes about the charity, the people we help and our supporters. Please do have a look around the site after placing your vote, and learn more about the RAF’s leading welfare charity.
So there’s still time to give your opinion – every vote counts!
http://www.rafbf90.org.uk/
At the moment Air Chief Marshal Dowding leads the pack, with Bader, Harris and Gibson following on close behind.
The game is hosted on the RAF Benevolent Fund’s special 90th anniversary microsite, “90 Faces of the RAF Benevolent Fund”. The microsite is full of stories and anecdotes about the charity, the people we help and our supporters. Please do have a look around the site after placing your vote, and learn more about the RAF’s leading welfare charity.
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Where is Sir Basil Embry?? How many Air Vice Marshalls regularly flew on operations?? Look at his tally of decorations, and his outstanding record in No 2 Group, Bomber Command?? I can't believe he doesn't rate a mention. DB was an arrogant prick, whose own stupidity led to the loss of his legs. There are plenty of people who will say he was an expert pilot, but suffered from serious personality flaws. He looked for, and got, more publicity than others, and that's why his name is on peoples lips.
Basil Embry - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Basil Embry - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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It has to be Dowding; my personal preference would be Adrian Warburton but not many will have even heard of him.
As for DB, apart from lying about being shot down etc, he treated everyone - especially his 'batman' at Colditz - like crap, and only lost his legs through bufoonery; I used to work with a chap who'd been young groundcrew at Tangmere, they held a party the night he didn't return !
I also met a Spitfire pilot shot down and imprisoned early on in the B of B; for a while he was in the same camp as DB. He remarked that while he had a good fighting spirit, " yes, we all had a good word for Bader, but I can't say it in front of your wife "...
As for DB, apart from lying about being shot down etc, he treated everyone - especially his 'batman' at Colditz - like crap, and only lost his legs through bufoonery; I used to work with a chap who'd been young groundcrew at Tangmere, they held a party the night he didn't return !
I also met a Spitfire pilot shot down and imprisoned early on in the B of B; for a while he was in the same camp as DB. He remarked that while he had a good fighting spirit, " yes, we all had a good word for Bader, but I can't say it in front of your wife "...
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Icon figure
I may be biassed but Sir Arthur Harris is the one for me. During the years he was in command of Bomber Command, he was involved every day in viewing the previous night's bombing photographs to decide whether we would have to go back the next night. It is not surprising that he did not manage to visit many bomber stations, he was so involved in assessing and planning. He was 'Butch@ Harris because he was determined and forthright in his actions.
Absolutely.
Large testicles, which would not go amiss today. Maybe it's part of evolution...............sadly......
I have have had the dubious 'honour' of meeting Douglas Bader.
Within minutes of the presentation by the Officer Commanding we all left the officers' mess bar and went to to the local pub, where people were at least friendly.
Large testicles, which would not go amiss today. Maybe it's part of evolution...............sadly......
I have have had the dubious 'honour' of meeting Douglas Bader.
Within minutes of the presentation by the Officer Commanding we all left the officers' mess bar and went to to the local pub, where people were at least friendly.