Victor Airborne (Merged)
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 28
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Croqueteer,
Whatever. I'm not contributing to this to convince you of whether or not i'm a pilot. If you are seriously suggesting that it is sensible to get an aircraft that size into the air with no option but to land it back on the same runway, and that that is ok, then fill your boots. I just can't be bothered arguing about it. When I say this was not an 'accident', I agree with what you've said. I don't believe the stated intention was to become airborne.
spekesoftly,
I don't think that is speculation. I would have said that was perfectly clear to anyone that was there. The speculation would come as to why it was pushed so far...
Whatever. I'm not contributing to this to convince you of whether or not i'm a pilot. If you are seriously suggesting that it is sensible to get an aircraft that size into the air with no option but to land it back on the same runway, and that that is ok, then fill your boots. I just can't be bothered arguing about it. When I say this was not an 'accident', I agree with what you've said. I don't believe the stated intention was to become airborne.
spekesoftly,
I don't think that is speculation. I would have said that was perfectly clear to anyone that was there. The speculation would come as to why it was pushed so far...
Last edited by coldplayer; 8th May 2009 at 19:46.
Cool Mod
Join Date: Apr 1998
Location: 18nm N of LGW
Posts: 6,185
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Don't go speculating folks. The pictures tell all and in that context the aircraft got airborne and its not for us to decide what action will be taken - if any. So please cool it.
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 28
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Noted Pop.
Just to say that it was a 'fast taxi run'. An aircraft which is not airworthy became airborne. In my eyes that is a cock up and as I was there, and saw it close to the limit of control, the pictures above don't paint anything like the full picture. The second one gives you a clue, in that it is entirely over the grass.
There may well have been a technical fault and at no point have I ruled one out. How the hell could I?! That said, there are very few technical faults on an aircraft that would result in it becoming inadvertantly airborne, particularly on an aircraft where that option is not an option.
Just to say that it was a 'fast taxi run'. An aircraft which is not airworthy became airborne. In my eyes that is a cock up and as I was there, and saw it close to the limit of control, the pictures above don't paint anything like the full picture. The second one gives you a clue, in that it is entirely over the grass.
There may well have been a technical fault and at no point have I ruled one out. How the hell could I?! That said, there are very few technical faults on an aircraft that would result in it becoming inadvertantly airborne, particularly on an aircraft where that option is not an option.
Last edited by coldplayer; 4th May 2009 at 21:26.
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: U.K.
Posts: 459
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Coldplay, My point is, it is acceptable to lift to nose wheel on a fast taxi, and if the a/c is empty of load and fuel, it will get airborne when you don't think it possible. I think it relevant to say you can't possibly be a pilot, also, "can't be bothered to argue" usually means you have no case. wait till we hear what the crew has to say.
I have been watching this thread all day....
It would seem to me that something amiss DID occur at Bruntingthorpe yesterday, and that Somebody didn't want it getting out into the public domain!
Well it has, hasn't it?
So it's natural that people will speculate about all the whys and wherefores, especially in a forum such as this....
After all, what is RUMOUR, if it isn't SPECULATION?
It would seem to me that something amiss DID occur at Bruntingthorpe yesterday, and that Somebody didn't want it getting out into the public domain!
Well it has, hasn't it?
So it's natural that people will speculate about all the whys and wherefores, especially in a forum such as this....
After all, what is RUMOUR, if it isn't SPECULATION?
Again I was present and can note (not speculatively) that the left main gear practically touched down on the grass, before the she swerved over back towards the centerline.
That the pilot got an a/c stopped in time without a brake chute is amazing.
It was a hell of a lot closer call than the pics show.
That the pilot got an a/c stopped in time without a brake chute is amazing.
It was a hell of a lot closer call than the pics show.
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 28
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Croqueteer,
no, 'can't be bothered to argue' means just that.
I can only assume you're talking about something you didn't see, have not seen footage of and are, therefore, talking from a position of ignorance on this particular incident. If you had seen it, given your experience, I suspect you might well be coming at this from a different angle.
Again, noted. My point is that in an aircraft such as this, under conditions such as this (i.e the damn thing is not airworthy), then that is no excuse. I've ferried empty jet aircraft with very little fuel on board and yes, they do come off the runway with considerable ease but surely one is to expect that.
no, 'can't be bothered to argue' means just that.
I can only assume you're talking about something you didn't see, have not seen footage of and are, therefore, talking from a position of ignorance on this particular incident. If you had seen it, given your experience, I suspect you might well be coming at this from a different angle.
My point is, it is acceptable to lift to nose wheel on a fast taxi, and if the a/c is empty of load and fuel, it will get airborne when you don't think it possible.
Last edited by coldplayer; 4th May 2009 at 19:12.
I accept the relevant point that I did not see the event.
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 28
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Croqueteer,
Cool. I'm not looking to argue with you. Please be assured I am what I say I am.
The last photo that shaft has posted gives a better indication of exactly why I think this warrants more than just a passing glance.
Cool. I'm not looking to argue with you. Please be assured I am what I say I am.
The last photo that shaft has posted gives a better indication of exactly why I think this warrants more than just a passing glance.
Last edited by coldplayer; 4th May 2009 at 19:32.
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 28
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Fair question.
You would need directional control firstly (i.e rudder), but more so any element of a x-wind requires working flying controls so as to prevent the into-wind wing from lifting during the takeoff run. The aircraft wants to turn into the direction the wind is coming from, which has to be countered with rudder and you would need to use into-wind aileron to prevent the wing from lifting.
Hope that helps.
You would need directional control firstly (i.e rudder), but more so any element of a x-wind requires working flying controls so as to prevent the into-wind wing from lifting during the takeoff run. The aircraft wants to turn into the direction the wind is coming from, which has to be countered with rudder and you would need to use into-wind aileron to prevent the wing from lifting.
Hope that helps.