TAA and the DC-9
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My memories are also of a great little italian LAME who loved her with a passion. First flight of the day out of MEL, you would get Guido on the end of the rope, speaking his own lingo, which consisted of English (sort of) Italian, and some sort of pidgeon. No pushback could commence without him inquiring about your (1) wife (2) bambinos, (3) telling you about his "Rosa" and numerous bambino's which seemed to increase yearly. Then you would get in some sort of jabba, a rundown of the state of the aircraft. "She hadda a bad day yesty Capitan, some silly bastardo bounced her, you treat her ok today she only a liddle girlie Ok Capitan?" Ok Capitan nbr ouno sounda ok, yabba dabba doo you canna starta nbr two" we loved the bloke. Few "Capitans" could resist if they had a new shiny F/O sitting beside them, letting the poor bugger have a chat with Guido. The bloke was already trying to look like he knew what he was doing, but to be confronted with this lingo, you could see the look of bewilderment, and then the sweat starting on the brow, as he realised he had not even left the arm, and he had not the faintest idea of what was going on and after about six "say agains" you put him out of his misery (after just about pis$ing yourself with laughter) and finally Guido always waved a set of Rosary Beads at you (thank God the Pax couldn't see him) and never sent you off without a God Bless you Capitan. I can never think about a 9 without thinking about him.
Man on the Ground
The photo you mention of the two nines nose to nose, was taken from the old apron tower [SMC(A)] and was under glass in the apron tower as a reminder to the SMC(A) controllers of how not to do it!
Of course the apron tower got the blame as they had jurisdiction out to taxyway Tango from the apron but I suspect there may have been a lack of coordination between the two towers that was the basic cause.
Blackburn
The photo you mention of the two nines nose to nose, was taken from the old apron tower [SMC(A)] and was under glass in the apron tower as a reminder to the SMC(A) controllers of how not to do it!
Of course the apron tower got the blame as they had jurisdiction out to taxyway Tango from the apron but I suspect there may have been a lack of coordination between the two towers that was the basic cause.
Blackburn
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The photo you mention of the two nines nose to nose, was taken from the old apron tower [SMC(A)] and was under glass in the apron tower as a reminder to the SMC(A) controllers of how not to do it!
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I know that this is a thread about 9er's but does anyone have that footage of the TAA advertisement that was shot from the tail of the '72' as it flew up the quensland coast?
My First Flying instructor was an ex AN 9'er Capt., used to tell me that if you had nothing to do between Canberra & Sydney............you'd forgotten something!
You know who you are......
My First Flying instructor was an ex AN 9'er Capt., used to tell me that if you had nothing to do between Canberra & Sydney............you'd forgotten something!
You know who you are......
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Coming off the 'maiden aunt'-like F27, for a new trainee FO, those first few line flights on the -9 were a bit like a callow youth meeting a fast and loose, very rakish woman of decidely loose morals for the very first time. It was said they reserved a seat for the trainee FO in row 20 (last row in Economy) for the first few sectors - for that was about how far behind the aircraft most of us were.
However, when you managed to keep up with her, the -9 became a real joy. Five sectors SY-CB-SY-CB-SY, resulting, often as not, in not much more than two hours to add to the log book, could be quite a workout. You knew you'd mastered the beast when both pilots managed to eat their breakfast - separately - on the same sector, with a 35 departure from CB and a straight in aproach (R/W 07) in to SY. (I only ever managed this once, and remember the captain's name to this day, and I have to admit, it involved scoffing my meal down at a very ungentlemanly rate! The captain handed the hostie his tray at about 5,000' on finals for 07 at Sydney.)
Someone's already mentioned the 'duopoly race' that went on daily between the AN and TN -9's virtually all over Australia, for the schedules were exactly the same almost everywhere. On more than one occasion, I recall sweating on getting that last door closed so we could start the second engine and so beat the opposition with the vital taxi call (first to make the call got to be first to the holding point) - only to hear the TN -9, with his front integral stairs still down, call for taxi clearance, be given it, and watch him move off the blocks with his stairs still at full stretch retracting, looking, for all the world like the stairs were a long arm out a window signalling the turn.
A bit of bragging now. Anyone else remember the speedbrake 'chatter' when you'd pulled off a really good landing? (For the uninitiated, the autospeedbrake handle would 'chatter', not quite deploying, as it was unable to decide whether you were on the ground or not, if you managed to really grease it on.) [A bit like the two breakfasts on one CB-SY sector, I may only have done that once too!!!
]
However, when you managed to keep up with her, the -9 became a real joy. Five sectors SY-CB-SY-CB-SY, resulting, often as not, in not much more than two hours to add to the log book, could be quite a workout. You knew you'd mastered the beast when both pilots managed to eat their breakfast - separately - on the same sector, with a 35 departure from CB and a straight in aproach (R/W 07) in to SY. (I only ever managed this once, and remember the captain's name to this day, and I have to admit, it involved scoffing my meal down at a very ungentlemanly rate! The captain handed the hostie his tray at about 5,000' on finals for 07 at Sydney.)
Someone's already mentioned the 'duopoly race' that went on daily between the AN and TN -9's virtually all over Australia, for the schedules were exactly the same almost everywhere. On more than one occasion, I recall sweating on getting that last door closed so we could start the second engine and so beat the opposition with the vital taxi call (first to make the call got to be first to the holding point) - only to hear the TN -9, with his front integral stairs still down, call for taxi clearance, be given it, and watch him move off the blocks with his stairs still at full stretch retracting, looking, for all the world like the stairs were a long arm out a window signalling the turn.
A bit of bragging now. Anyone else remember the speedbrake 'chatter' when you'd pulled off a really good landing? (For the uninitiated, the autospeedbrake handle would 'chatter', not quite deploying, as it was unable to decide whether you were on the ground or not, if you managed to really grease it on.) [A bit like the two breakfasts on one CB-SY sector, I may only have done that once too!!!
]
Last edited by Wiley; 29th Dec 2008 at 12:59.
I've been trying for ages to get a photo of the 9's tailplane showing one elevator up and the other down. It was a very common sight, but unfortunately I never took a photo of it. 
Ditto the comments on this thread. No unpleasantries. A pleasure to read.
Short sectors - takeoff rwy 26 EN, right turn, land rwy 34 ML.
Ditto the comments on this thread. No unpleasantries. A pleasure to read.
Short sectors - takeoff rwy 26 EN, right turn, land rwy 34 ML.
I know that this is a thread about 9er's but does anyone have that footage of the TAA advertisement that was shot from the tail of the '72' as it flew up the quensland coast?
To get back to the original question, the Australian DC-9 fleets were built up, side-by-side, in the 1960s-70s era of the Two-Airline policy between TAA and Ansett. The DC-9 came in 1967 when the 737 was not around and other options, such as the One-Eleven, not what was required.
The rollover by Ansett from the DC-9 to the 737-200 was the result of steady Boeing sales pressure, they had more than one serious go at both carriers (you find an earlier attempt documented in Brogden's book on the Two-Airline policy). The difference was marginal, the two aircraft were fairly comparable, in the end one went for the trade-in and one didn't. You could probably draw up a long list of the advantages both of doing it and not doing it. Boeing passed the DC-9s on to a dealer who disposed of them quitequickly in the USA.
The rollover by Ansett from the DC-9 to the 737-200 was the result of steady Boeing sales pressure, they had more than one serious go at both carriers (you find an earlier attempt documented in Brogden's book on the Two-Airline policy). The difference was marginal, the two aircraft were fairly comparable, in the end one went for the trade-in and one didn't. You could probably draw up a long list of the advantages both of doing it and not doing it. Boeing passed the DC-9s on to a dealer who disposed of them quitequickly in the USA.
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There was talk....don't know if it ever happened....that the then hotshot marketing boss at AN (think it was Tom Dury or somesuch) was going to send a DC-9 rivet encased in glass around to all of AN's major clients to say "This is the last you'll ever see of a DC-9".
Interesting tho that the market surveys showed people did prefer the '9 with the 5 abreast seating and the very quiet premium section. That preference extended to the MD-80 which TAA was on the verge of buying (and which was in every way superior to the 737-300/400) but the TAA marketing folks were scared that the public would be told by AN...."its just a tarted up DC-9".
Apology...I did twice for a while each time betray my beloved '9 for the joys that will never come again of the 727. Sigh........
Interesting tho that the market surveys showed people did prefer the '9 with the 5 abreast seating and the very quiet premium section. That preference extended to the MD-80 which TAA was on the verge of buying (and which was in every way superior to the 737-300/400) but the TAA marketing folks were scared that the public would be told by AN...."its just a tarted up DC-9".
Apology...I did twice for a while each time betray my beloved '9 for the joys that will never come again of the 727. Sigh........
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I remember a TN F27 Capt was doing his conversion on the 9 ..he arrived in a lather of sweat with a towel wrapped around his shoulders .."she`s too bloody fast for me" was his comment..I dont think he made it..this chap was quite a character ,someone may remember him ..he often told the story when he was flying a group around he would play a prank by tying two pieces of string to the steering yolk and proceed backwards through the cabin pretending he was controlling the aircraft!!
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tinpis,
nothing is wrong with the 717! From the drivers who have gone onto the A320 or B737, they all say the 717 is a lot better than either of those 2 types.
And remember, the heritage comes from the -9!
nothing is wrong with the 717! From the drivers who have gone onto the A320 or B737, they all say the 717 is a lot better than either of those 2 types.
And remember, the heritage comes from the -9!
Taxy behind a 717 and you'll see one elevator up, the other one down.
Taxy REAL close and you'll see how to remove the tailcone in case of an emergency!!!
Taxy REAL close and you'll see how to remove the tailcone in case of an emergency!!!
I reckon the 717 is a DC9 for computer nerds 
. Flying the aircraft is secondary to pressing buttons and heaven forbid anyone thinking they could maintain 300kts to 10nm. 
Not having flown a DC9 (unfortunately) I suspect that boeing have designed the character out of it
.
. Flying the aircraft is secondary to pressing buttons and heaven forbid anyone thinking they could maintain 300kts to 10nm. Not having flown a DC9 (unfortunately) I suspect that boeing have designed the character out of it
.