Smiths electric pilot Sep.1
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: WOOTTON BASSETT, WILTS
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Interested to see the negative comments regarding the ergonomics of the beam compass display. Always remember what a pain in the butt it was to change it on the Vulcan. Perhaps this explains the reason MFS wasnt fitted to the herc when Mk10b autopilot was installed. The sperrys C12 system seemed to be cheaply made but it worked, took up alot less space and was very easy to read and still had a "track" facility. I suppose the older hercs must be the last carriers of Mk10.
Just a final thought, I was once told the the rate/rate gyro technology was "liberated" from the germans post WW11 and handed to Smiths for development
Just a final thought, I was once told the the rate/rate gyro technology was "liberated" from the germans post WW11 and handed to Smiths for development
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: London
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I did a lot of research into this a while ago, and dug up all kinds of articles and evidence. I distilled the research into a few pages, including a simplified schematic of the differences between SEP1 and SEP2, and posted them here:
Smiths Electronic Pilot
Guy.
Smiths Electronic Pilot
Guy.
I flew the Smiths MFS/SFS as fitted to the Argosy and the Viscount 802/806 for 10 years and I thought it worked pretty well.
Mind you, it is now quite hard to remember the days before V Bars and Cross Hairs were invented.
Mind you, it is now quite hard to remember the days before V Bars and Cross Hairs were invented.
Join Date: Oct 2008
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I should also answer the question ...
The rate/rate principle had been identified very early on. It was an ideal that many people working on automatic servo control were heading towards, but was effectively blocked until the advent of modern electronics. From that point of view, it's quite difficult to identify who thought of it first, but the first design is attributed to Andreas Minorsky in Russia. He emigrated to America in 1918, with his designs, and continued work with the U.S. Navy. The first sea trial was in 1923. It was not successful, and development was abandoned.
The German system, developed by Askania, Patin and Siemens, produced the first all-electric system in 1932. It was also the first use of the term, "autopilot". It was very comprehensive in what it did, very "modern", but too slow to respond. Trials were conducted with limited success.
The first successful rate/rate system was based on research by F. W. Meredith at the R.A.E., who commissioned Smiths Instruments to develop it. This became the Mk 9 for the military, and S.E.P. 1 for civil aviation, which was released in 1947.
Guy.
The rate/rate principle had been identified very early on. It was an ideal that many people working on automatic servo control were heading towards, but was effectively blocked until the advent of modern electronics. From that point of view, it's quite difficult to identify who thought of it first, but the first design is attributed to Andreas Minorsky in Russia. He emigrated to America in 1918, with his designs, and continued work with the U.S. Navy. The first sea trial was in 1923. It was not successful, and development was abandoned.
The German system, developed by Askania, Patin and Siemens, produced the first all-electric system in 1932. It was also the first use of the term, "autopilot". It was very comprehensive in what it did, very "modern", but too slow to respond. Trials were conducted with limited success.
The first successful rate/rate system was based on research by F. W. Meredith at the R.A.E., who commissioned Smiths Instruments to develop it. This became the Mk 9 for the military, and S.E.P. 1 for civil aviation, which was released in 1947.
Guy.
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I certainly found there was a love/hate schism during my research. R.A.F. and B.O.A.C. pilots had an input into how it evolved, and how it relayed information. By and large, ex-R.A.F. pilots flying B.O.A.C. aircraft thought it was eminently logical and efficient, while pilots converting from other systems, for example Sperry, absolutely loathed it. That situation became worse as Comets, Britannias, Viscounts and Vanguards were taken up by other operators with a broader mix of people.
Guy.
Guy.
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Slight history to Smith auto pilot system
The Smith Automatic Pilot was one of the most widely used first auto pilot systems, especially in the Royal Air Force - RAF, during WWII. "The used of this system enables an aircraft to be flown in almost any weather condition, thus relieving the human pilot an immense amount of physical and mental strain." The guiding principle of the auto pilot system is an air-driven gyroscope. This system was manufactured by the Messrs. Kelvin, Bottomley & Baird Limited, many of the instruments used, designated the K.B.B.-Kollsman type, were designed by the American genius inventor Paul Kollsman and his Kollsman Instrument Company.
The system was not just a gadget or just a night or 'blind-flying' instrument, but was a mechanism of the highest reliability and precision, and was "used exclusively throughout the RAF for eight years" by the year 1941. The unique and reliability of the Smith automatic pilot enable it to withstand the "most arduous conditions" encounter in the RAF. Mark III and Type II were available in 1940.
Ernest M. H Appleby, an Instrument Maker, wrote : "I had the privilege of briefly assisting Paul Kollsman when he spent some time in England at the (K.B.B.-Kollsman) Basingstoke plant, which was running up to full production in 1938-39, 24 hours a day, in preparation for the coming war. ..... Paul Kollsman was, to my mind, the most outstanding aeronautical instrument designer of the 1930’s.
"An example of his design genius was the British-produced MK X1V 3-pointer altimeter, which, in one giant step, took aviation instrumentation from the fusée chain barometer / altimeter to a precision instrument. The Kollsman designed altimeter also incorporated a unique temperature compensation system which has never been bettered... It corrected the temperature change effect on the aneroid capsule sensor with changes in altitude, a non-linear function; the design was brilliant in its simplicity. These instruments equipped a great proportion of the Trainers, Fighters(Rate of climb indicator Mk.3P as used in Vampire, Hunter etc. Mk.XIV altimeter as fitted to late Spitfires, Meteor, Vampire etc), Bombers, Reconnaissance, Meteorological and Transport aircraft of the Royal Air Force, the Royal Navy Fleet Air Arm, the Army Air Corp. and the Air Forces of the Commonwealth of Nations."
Kollsman went on to be a premier inventor with fundamental discoveries in jet engine technology; medical syringes; water purification and desalination methods; and ground breaking inventions for Electrode-deionization and electrodialysis. Perhaps one of the most unknown top 20th Century Inventors with over 200 useful patents.
Take a look at this recent patent: US patent 8051655, and who do they cite as the key inventor?...the first 13 fundamental jet engine patents citations refer to one man - Paul Kollsman! (US patent 8051655 - a modern "method and system for mechanical and electrical power generation".) Kollsman was known as the shy brilliant genius.
The system was not just a gadget or just a night or 'blind-flying' instrument, but was a mechanism of the highest reliability and precision, and was "used exclusively throughout the RAF for eight years" by the year 1941. The unique and reliability of the Smith automatic pilot enable it to withstand the "most arduous conditions" encounter in the RAF. Mark III and Type II were available in 1940.
Ernest M. H Appleby, an Instrument Maker, wrote : "I had the privilege of briefly assisting Paul Kollsman when he spent some time in England at the (K.B.B.-Kollsman) Basingstoke plant, which was running up to full production in 1938-39, 24 hours a day, in preparation for the coming war. ..... Paul Kollsman was, to my mind, the most outstanding aeronautical instrument designer of the 1930’s.
"An example of his design genius was the British-produced MK X1V 3-pointer altimeter, which, in one giant step, took aviation instrumentation from the fusée chain barometer / altimeter to a precision instrument. The Kollsman designed altimeter also incorporated a unique temperature compensation system which has never been bettered... It corrected the temperature change effect on the aneroid capsule sensor with changes in altitude, a non-linear function; the design was brilliant in its simplicity. These instruments equipped a great proportion of the Trainers, Fighters(Rate of climb indicator Mk.3P as used in Vampire, Hunter etc. Mk.XIV altimeter as fitted to late Spitfires, Meteor, Vampire etc), Bombers, Reconnaissance, Meteorological and Transport aircraft of the Royal Air Force, the Royal Navy Fleet Air Arm, the Army Air Corp. and the Air Forces of the Commonwealth of Nations."
Kollsman went on to be a premier inventor with fundamental discoveries in jet engine technology; medical syringes; water purification and desalination methods; and ground breaking inventions for Electrode-deionization and electrodialysis. Perhaps one of the most unknown top 20th Century Inventors with over 200 useful patents.
Take a look at this recent patent: US patent 8051655, and who do they cite as the key inventor?...the first 13 fundamental jet engine patents citations refer to one man - Paul Kollsman! (US patent 8051655 - a modern "method and system for mechanical and electrical power generation".) Kollsman was known as the shy brilliant genius.
Cunning Artificer
Join Date: Jun 2001
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Aah! Temperature compensation of the altimeter aneroid capsule. Many a cup of tea went stone cold at Epsom Square as victims, er, candidates, struggled to describe its operation to their Airworthiness Surveyor inquisitors.
The problem was, different books described two different versions and one of them was wrong - the one written by an Airworthiness Surveyor [whose name sounds like a device used by artists]!
The problem was, different books described two different versions and one of them was wrong - the one written by an Airworthiness Surveyor [whose name sounds like a device used by artists]!
