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Originally Posted by Inspired
(Post 10565216)
If you have anything above a PPL you are overqualified.
Originally Posted by Sparrows.
(Post 10565221)
And no conditional employment contract. Conditional offer of employment with nothing in writing. Does anyone know what they are actually looking for in the application? Obviously passion and grit is a baseline so just trying to get a better idea of what I can do to better represent myself. |
Originally Posted by Sparrows.
(Post 10565221)
And no conditional employment contract. Conditional offer of employment with nothing in writing. Put yourself in the shoes of an 18 yo kid straight out of high school. An opportunity to do an 18 month course to then be flying all over Asia as a jet SO by the time they’re 20. And if they get sick of that, they have first dibs at positions within QF. |
Has any cadets been upgraded command on the bus yet? Must have been 7 or 8 years since they started the program |
Originally Posted by wheels_down
(Post 10565270)
Has any cadets been upgraded command on the bus yet? Must have been 7 or 8 years since they started the program |
Yep, lot's of them.
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Put yourself in the shoes of an 18 yo kid straight out of high school. An opportunity to do an 18 month course to then be flying all over Asia as a jet SO by the time they’re 20. And if they get sick of that, they have first dibs at positions within QF. |
Originally Posted by Lookleft
(Post 10566042)
From what I have observed there are not that many 18 yo straight out of school cadets and the ones that are, are immature in the way they conduct themselves. The best cadets I have flown with are those with some previous work experience. I do agree with you that they get sick of being a Jetstar pilot because they start to realise that airline flying is not all glamour and cool sunglasses. I'm not sure though why you think they won't eventually feel the same way after the excitement of being a QF SO wears off. I'm also not sure why you think that they get "first dibs" within QF. They get the same opportunity as any other QF Group pilot. In fact they get less opportunity until they achieve the minimum PIC requirements.
I joined the airline as a cadet, straight out of high school and have loved the experience. |
Originally Posted by ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE
(Post 10566079)
I joined the airline as a cadet, straight out of high school and have loved the experience. |
Originally Posted by ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE
(Post 10566079)
They get first dibs at QF mainline jobs, given the groups preference to internal applications. Dozens have gone/are going. It’s not hard to go and hire a Cessna for 50 hours and get the required PIC. Its a great fork in the road to have. Stay at JQ and get an early command (for most cadets by the time they’re in their early 30’s) or go to QF and enjoy the benefits of working for a legacy carrier. I joined the airline as a cadet, straight out of high school and have loved the experience. |
By the time they leave school and go through Oxford by the time they are checked online with the Airbus they would be 21/22? Which would put the new cadet captains at 28-30yrs old. What about those who went right onto the 787. 787 SO to 320 FO to 320 CPT would be 15 years. Most probably leave for Emirates before it reaches that far. I dont think Jetstar is a long term career airline for the cadets. Chances of staying 40 or 50 years? |
Jetstar can be a great place to work. When you’re young, energetic and keen. But it’s not a ‘for your entire career’ airline. Unfortunately, the only career airline in Australia is Qantas. And you’ll be waiting most of your career to achieve your career goals. When I was a G.A./regional airline pilot the mere thought of cadets invoked a passionate response. It wasn’t pure. It wasn’t how you’re supposed to do it. Queue jumpers. Selfish little wart faced gits. all that talk. But - if you haven’t had a look around the boondocks recently, GA is a shadow of what it was when my contemporaries went up norf (sic). So cadets are the future. And I’d be a million ahead and in a far better career position than I am currently. So if you’re considering a career in aviation. Join the QF group as a cadet and see where it takes you. |
I joined the airline as a cadet, straight out of high school and have loved the experience. |
Originally Posted by Lookleft
(Post 10566138)
Your assertion however that Jetstar cadets have any greater chance or opportunity of moving to mainline than other QF group pilots is wrong.
Group pilots in general have a better chance at joining QF mainline than external applicants (JQ, QLink, EFA) |
Originally Posted by retardeduck
(Post 10566085)
ECAM would you mind if I sent you a PM?
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Originally Posted by ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE
(Post 10566144)
I never said that. Group pilots in general have a better chance at joining QF mainline than external applicants (JQ, QLink, EFA) Group pilots get the first interview and entry to the hold. However they are released from the hold on a commercial basis. So if you’re a link Pilot, some folk are still waiting from the first round of recruitment. You’re better off being external and a 737 driver from the opposition. Having said that, it’s good to see the company still recruit from within. There is a lot of experience now across the various divisions (and I mean divisions). |
So have many cadets left in the last decade? I’d imagine turnover will be high once they are 5 years into a 10 year potential command upgrade wait. The problem with cadets and I’ve seen this attitude as mentioned above is it’s not a career airline. This will bite in the future and they will get caught out with lack of people in the right seat because they don’t have anyone suitable left to upgrade. Or they can’t upgrade fast enough. The ex GA guy or girl that has worked for half dozen operators in the past will probably stay longer having seen a lot, and end up in management roles. |
Originally Posted by The Green Goblin
(Post 10566168)
That’s not true either. Group pilots get the first interview and entry to the hold. However they are released from the hold on a commercial basis. So if you’re a link Pilot, some folk are still waiting from the first round of recruitment. You’re better off being external and a 737 driver from the opposition. Having said that, it’s good to see the company still recruitment from within. There is a lot of experience now across the various divisions (and I mean divisions). I havent been through the QF recruitment process myself so I’m definitely not an expert. |
Originally Posted by wheels_down
(Post 10566129)
Which would put the new cadet captains at 28-30yrs old. What about those who went right onto the 787. 787 SO to 320 FO to 320 CPT would be 15 years. How does being a 787 SO for 3 years cost you 7-8 years in getting your command? Approximately 7 years for a command, doesn’t mean 7 years as a 320 FO, means 7 years from the date you join. |
But you’re right, once on the hold file externals don’t have the problem of being held back by a subsidiary. It has always been an advantage to apply from a non-group subsidiary or to advise QF recruitment that another airline is going to interview you. The problem with cadets and I’ve seen this attitude as mentioned above is it’s not a career airline. This will bite in the future and they will get caught out with lack of people in the right seat because they don’t have anyone suitable left to upgrade. Or they can’t upgrade fast enough. |
Originally Posted by Sparrows.
(Post 10566195)
Why? How does being a 787 SO for 3 years cost you 7-8 years in getting your command? Approximately 7 years for a command, doesn’t mean 7 years as a 320 FO, means 7 years from the date you join. |
Originally Posted by The Green Goblin
(Post 10566198)
Probably because they’re not logging ICUS for their ATPL requirements in the back seat. |
Hold on. So 5 years as a SO 787 back seat then your telling me they only need to log a year or two on the 320 FO before getting an upgrade? Essentially only two years of real domestic stick experience before getting the LHS? Sounds dangerous. |
Originally Posted by wheels_down
(Post 10566284)
Hold on. So 5 years as a SO 787 back seat then your telling me they only need to log a year or two on the 320 FO before getting an upgrade? Essentially only two years of real domestic stick experience before getting the LHS? Sounds dangerous. |
For anyone who is interested in the cadetship, as long as PPL hasn't been acquired there is no limit on hours allowed (my 200TT is fine).
Secondarily, according to the lady I spoke with at CAE, 'you will be served very well if you have past experience such as flight hours, so please make sure you put it down, it'll be really good'. So I guess the majority of applicants apply with very little or no prior aviation experience (as would be expected for an ab-initio cadetship). Good to keep in mind though. |
Originally Posted by wheels_down
(Post 10566284)
Hold on. So 5 years as a SO 787 back seat then your telling me they only need to log a year or two on the 320 FO before getting an upgrade? Essentially only two years of real domestic stick experience before getting the LHS? Sounds dangerous. But thats not too far off the minima in other parts of the world. I believe Ryanair are upgrading F/O’s after 3000hrs/3.5 years in company. This of course is cadets who were selected and trained for the role and were put on formal command preparation course for a few years prior to the upgrade. They’re flying more than 400 aircraft around a continent that is probably more challenging than this one and aren’t losing aircraft. In the US some of their regional carriers using CRJ/E-Jets are currently upgrading FO’s after 1000 airline hours (after 1500hrs of mostly instructing) and just over a year in the airline. I’d argue that this isn’t as safe as a mentored Cadetship but they still aren’t losing aircraft. With good selection and focused training, plus development of skills as an FO there’s no reason why a command upgrade can’t be done within 4-5 years, as other airlines have proved. |
Originally Posted by dr dre
(Post 10566420)
Realistically it’d be far more than two years to command.
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Originally Posted by das Uber Soldat
(Post 10566443)
You reckon? Everyones favorite youtube personality/Music popstar sensation/male model just got onto the 320 from the 787. Looking at the numbers, there is every chance he'll hit the seniority before he hits the min hours requirement.
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Originally Posted by The Green Goblin
(Post 10566490)
I look forward to the VLOG. Or does it start with an F? |
Originally Posted by dr dre
(Post 10566420)
Realistically it’d be far more than two years to command. There was an article about a JQ Pacific FO upgrading after about 5 years in the company and for Australian bases it’d be more. But thats not too far off the minima in other parts of the world. I believe Ryanair are upgrading F/O’s after 3000hrs/3.5 years in company. This of course is cadets who were selected and trained for the role and were put on formal command preparation course for a few years prior to the upgrade. They’re flying more than 400 aircraft around a continent that is probably more challenging than this one and aren’t losing aircraft. In the US some of their regional carriers using CRJ/E-Jets are currently upgrading FO’s after 1000 airline hours (after 1500hrs of mostly instructing) and just over a year in the airline. I’d argue that this isn’t as safe as a mentored Cadetship but they still aren’t losing aircraft. With good selection and focused training, plus development of skills as an FO there’s no reason why a command upgrade can’t be done within 4-5 years, as other airlines have proved. What is is happening here is we have C172 200 hours, 5 years back seat watching on the 787, then as little as 18 months A320 FO before the command course. There isn’t a lot of stick time in there. Forget the long haul 787 back seat time. That’s 18-24 months of domestic slogging. And its happening. Early 787 SOs are now on the Airbus right now. Some are claiming they are getting upgraded Christmas of next year. Don’t be surprised to see no more than a few thousand hours of TOTAL time BETWEEN both up front in years to come. Commonly seen in Air Asia and Vietjet and Bamboo Airways. |
If they hold an ATPL and pass the checks like everybody else, then good on them.
Theres only one way to gain experience. |
Originally Posted by PoppaJo
(Post 10566767)
Your missing the point. What is is happening here is we have C172 200 hours, 5 years back seat watching on the 787, then as little as 18 months A320 FO before the command course. There isn’t a lot of stick time in there. Forget the long haul 787 back seat time. That’s 18-24 months of domestic slogging. And its happening. Early 787 SOs are now on the Airbus right now. Some are claiming they are getting upgraded Christmas of next year. Don’t be surprised to see no more than a few thousand hours of TOTAL time BETWEEN both up front in years to come. Commonly seen in Air Asia and Vietjet and Bamboo Airways. Bamboo Airways hasn’t even been operating for 12 months yet Poppa. I don’t believe they even have an upgrade program yet, so your assertions on them I think are wrong |
US regionals can upgrade an FO with only 1000 hours in the right seat. This is subject to you passing upgrade training of course. I have only seen one upgrade with the min hours. Most had between 1600 and 3000 hours as an FO.
They don't give out Capt bars in corn flakes packets. |
Achieving a command has a lot more to do with the attitude of the candidate than just the flying skills. People fail command checks usually because of a lack of preparation and/or the failure to change the mindset from support pilot to PIC. Plenty of people with lots of hours have failed command checks. If they are not up to the hands on skills then they won't get through the sim component but in my experience the younger pilots are good at flying the simulator. If they put the work in and understand that they are now the person responsible for the entire operation of that aircraft from stepping in to stepping off it then they should be fine. If they still think they are the head prefect of senior school then they will have difficulties.
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US regionals are not upgrading FOs with 2000 hours onto a 100 tonne A321. I’m aware of these pilots existing in Vietnam and that’s about it. Easyjet will get you to at least 5000. I never claimed Bamboo had an upgrade program, but I’m well aware they have low hours in both seats. |
Jetstar
Hi everyone , Need some information please 1) How are Jetstar rosters? is their any roster pattern you can opt for ? 2) I am a newly released A320 Captain . Is their any possibility that i can join Directly on a320 as a Captain (direct entry) or if not how much time to come on the left seat from right after having 1000 hours as PIC on the same aircraft . thank you |
Jet star
2 quick question:- 1) Can a A320 Captain get direct entry on A320 fleet on the left seat? 2) If not how much time to come from right seat to the left if you have 1000 hours as PIC ? i am talking about Jetstar Thanks |
Lol, that's gold.
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Originally Posted by Livelife09
(Post 10567055)
2 quick question:- 1) Can a A320 Captain get direct entry on A320 fleet on the left seat? 2) If not how much time to come from right seat to the left if you have 1000 hours as PIC ? i am talking about Jetstar Thanks Just no |
Current time to command at Jetstar NZ seems to be sitting at roughly 6-7 years. Hope that answers your question. |
Originally Posted by Livelife09
(Post 10567055)
2 quick question:- 1) Can a A320 Captain get direct entry on A320 fleet on the left seat? 2) If not how much time to come from right seat to the left if you have 1000 hours as PIC ? i am talking about Jetstar Thanks |
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