Quite the contrary.

As a few thread contributers have alluded to previous, the boys and girls at SSA/EAA are getting B717's, even though Cobham have been publicly announced as the prefered operator. Which means the little boys and girls at SSA/EAA are a certainty to get the C-Series, even though QANTAS haven't mentioned any intention to buy or lease any.

So it goes without saying, anyone can clearly see that once Sh*tstar have enough 787's for the boys at the top, SSA/EAA will be the next in line for the aircraft to operate on those ideal routes like SY-CB, SY-MQ, SY-CH, etc.. all ex SY of course, because as we all know, if it's not happening in SY, then it just isn't happening.

On a serious note though, I did hear rumours if Cobham can't get enough applicants to meet their expansion needs, then positions will be offered to SSA/EAA Q400 crews. I'm wondering how that would work. As Cobham is not a QANTAS Group company, can a MOU be put in place? Would the Q400 crews have to resign from SSA/EAA and start at the bottom of Cobhams seniority list or would their DOJ @ SSA/EAA be intergrated into Cobhams seniority list?

Anyway not my problem, just interesting to see how it all pans out.

Sids old son, some one's having a lend of you. Big time. :8

The jets will stay at Cobham, the props will stay at SSA/EAA. Don't delude yourself, introducing glass jets into a turbo prop operation is too hard, history is working against you. The B717 is established, the C series will just try and replicate what the 717 has been established on. Give it another 10 years then there might be a need for a new technology aeroplane.

Time to move on.

I was taking the piss Kaboy. The day SSA/EAA get jets (787s to Coffs Harbour??) will be the day I take both Helen Clarke and Julia Gillard over the steps of parliament house and do to them what they've done to us !!

What if QLink got jets and mainline wanted integration to feed their excess junior crew to . That would be funny .

It's fact that Q400 crew will be sent to Cobham to fly the 717.

Something is in the making.

Err...reference? Company/Union Letter? Tea Leaves? You can't make such broad declarations Green Goblin without coughing up some evidence. :ugh:

Fuel-Off :ok:

It's in the pipeline.

You'll see something shortly :cool:

Why is introducing a glass jet into a turbo prop operation hard? The Q400 is all glass, and has similar performance to a jet.

However I highly doubt SSA/EAA crew will fly the B717. We are having trouble crewing flights already and pilots are leaving to fly elsewhere.

Unless they a) pay us a lot more to stay on the prop or b) give us jets and jet pay, people will just continue to leave.

Qantas might have ordered the c series already and keeping it tight lipped for commercial benefits. Looking at their order books, there are a few undisclosed orders and press releases. There are hints here and there that matches the characteristic of Qantas as one of the undisclosed purchasers.

The problem will be with CASA and the subsequent regulatory/paperwork/systems that ensues. Easier to just subby it out or get mainline to do it.
It can be done but its not the easiest option.

bubble.head, you are a classic! :D

Well gentlemen, things could certainly be getting more interesting than anyone could of imagined.

I have it on good authority that a couple of very senior EAA C&T Captains, along with some others from flight ops were seen to be touring the Boeing Dreamliner production line last month.

I've heard from a friend of mine in the states also that there was a 787 tech course run not so long ago with a couple of aussie guys from same said organization.

Watch this space, very interesting times indeed :eek:

Yep 50t, 0.79 FL390. That Q400 just needs to lose the props and there will be no difference. That's why airlines worldwide are putting these guys straight into the left seat.

Nice windup there. CASA will never let you have heavy jets on a AOC with a bunch of checkers with no jet experience, and no Boeing experience.

If that was to happen you would have import a bunch of check captains with heavy Boeing experience and a whole bunch of DE captains with Heavy Boeing jet experience.

Yes it could happen but none of the current crew will be flying it thats for sure.

787s will be on the mainline AOC, or Jetstar and they will then be advertising for DE Boeing experienced guys.

bubble.head that sounds like the qlink ad to convince the public - "jet like speed" are you Mr N Kumar?

All this speculation. The direction of Qantas is like a bumper car. The guys driving have no idea where they're going, but wherever it is, they're going at full speed. Then they hit something (the law/competition/etc), bounce off, and fly off in another direction at top speed. At the end of the ride they get off and say, "that was fun", and some poor schmuck has to come in and repair all the carnage.

And before Qlink gets the Dreamliner they should think about getting a bus-liner to and from the carpark. It's getting worse and worse. But that's another matter....

Why not? CASA have done it before!

How long are you guys going to speculate the same stuff over and over and over again....

Working for Qantas is like working for Jay Gatsby. Every weekend you get to watch another fabulous party. All these people not even Jay knows turn up on some flimsy excuse [what was the last one? New Perth menus, or something].

You don't get to party, of course, but you do get to spend all week cleaning the rubbish out of the pool.

Ah well, at least when they are writing the obituaries, they'll be able to say 'they had no clue how to run an airline - but they gave the BEST parties!'.

Hi Neville_nobody,

My source, who also happens to be a very senior C&T Captain with heavy turboprop experience (he has substantial Tu-95 time) has told me that at least one of the fellows on said course does actually have Boeing heavy widebody experience.

Not only that but he also has Airbus heavy widebody and ultra long haul experience with a very large overseas middle east carrier and has only just recently returned to Australia for the lifestyle (after failing to get an interview with Tiger).

So you could say that this guy is a Senior management heavy turboprop (with glass cockpit and near jet like speeds) Check and Training Captain with ultra long haul heavy Boeing and Airbus widebody experience.

I think that such a gentleman would more than meet the requirements of CASA for such a proposed operation and one can only wonder what he would be doing on a Dreamliner tech course.

Interesting times, watch this space!

Just my two cents worth :ok:

What, the 4 walls of the loony bin you are in? BTW, where's my neck rub?

Whether or not QLink will ever operate jets is a commercial decision that I am sure the honchos at QF will make without our advice or opinions.

Whether pilots could transition direct from the Q400 to LHS jet is a no-brainer. ANYONE who is a competent pilot on a turbo-prop can do it, and not take very long to do it, either. Even from older generation analogue turbo-prop to glass jet is do-able for anyone of normal intelligence and ability.

As for CASA: Where, in their old or proposed new rules, does it say an ATPL must have prior jet-experience to fly a jet? Plenty of pilots have gone from turbo-prop to jet commands, having done just the minimum required line training - and lived to tell the tale.

IF it were to happen, it would be the insurers who would insist on a core of type-experienced check and training people to kick it off. Unless the incumbent Chief Pilot had appropriate jet time, CASA would probably insist on a type-experienced 'Fleet Captain' in the interim and would of course have to approve the checkies. So CASA could make it hard for a few, but not really for QF in the grand scheme of things. Other than that, CASA would be on thin ice if they tried to dictate that all Captains had to have prior jet time over and above the ICUS requirements in the regulations.

IF the pilots union had any teeth it would allow a very limited number of direct-entry checkies in, perhaps on fixed-term contracts, then see them off with a nice thank-you party after a couple of years.

Sadly - if history is anything to go by - should it happen, pilots will fall over themselves to accept whatever terms are on offer.

If they could recruit experienced guys into RHS it would help . Qantas mainline would be logical place to source this experience but hard to see them happy to sit in RHS with a younger Qlink cpt . Plenty of pilots would consider coming back from O/S , they have nothing to prove and bags of cash so pressure off , just enjoy the A/C and Aussie lifestyle .

Yes, no idea how I managed to transition from a small turboprop (5T) to the LHS of a large corporate jet. (45T) Perhaps it was the training? Just how do those bograts like Bloggs (sorry former bograt) manage to go from pimpley faced kids to fighter pilots in Mirages (showing my age)! and FA-18's etc?

Cessna 152 is still harder than Boeing Jets because they are such a light bugger, forget the speed its same **** different plane, take your hands of it! Cant believe children of the magenta crap on like this....

Sure, Impuse did it, AOC for HC RPT, crews trained, deal done
Many others I could mention too, but the point here is why would QANTAS want to do it, when their current trend seems to be one of dividing the company's activitys into small disposable packages

Well Skywest/Tiger/Network/Voz/Virgin all required people with time on type. Skywest to the point where they imported labour. So I very much highly doubt Easterns will be given some special exemption. And it isnt just one guy either you will need experience in the checking ranks and then a percentage of your captains will need to be experienced on type.
But who knows maybe QF group have some special deal where they can do whatever they like.

Or NM could just call more of his mates. Problem solved... :E

Impulse (Air Crews Control to be correct) employed external pilots with jet time as Captains when the 717's arrived. Only a select few of the 1900 pilots were given commands on the 717 at start up.

And after 10 pages of standard pprune crap & speculation in this thread, I bet in 3 years time nothing will have changed at all.

Time for some to take a cold shower.

...... Anyway it ain't gonna happen
That company is set up to fly turboprops to turboprop destinations
If AJ wants jets to fly somewhere, he'll get his other 4 or 5 companies to do it.... That's why he set it up like that

It would make no sense for Qantas to do it , so no chance !

You forgot the Bex & a good lie down! :}

If it made no sense, they would do it. Remember the quality of the management you are dealing with here. Financial and common sense are not part of the big picture.

I hope you're not comparing the RAAF training and development system to the airlines. The time, effort and energy put into the training and ongoing development of a boggie pilot of any type in the RAAF so far exceeds the way the airlines 'train' that the only commonality is aeroplanes and the use of the word 'training'.

(Note: I've no first hand experience of the RAAF training system but I do have some knowledge of it. I do have first hand experience of airline training systems from cadet, to initial type rating and then promotional). :ok:

We're just running around in circles here. Mods, I think this thread has run its course. :hmm:

Fuel-Off :ok:

Keg I am referring to the way that airlines used to train people and the way that good corporate flight departments still do.

Not the pay for training, throw them online, let the line captains deal with it kind of approach that we see in a lot of airlines these days.

Agreed. Chalk and cheese. Of course, one method takes, time, effort, energy and therefore money. The modern way is devoid of all of those things.

The way I see it, all the new management positions for "jet pilots" was purely a matter of cronyism - creating a PD that only their mates (wanting to come back from overseas) could meet - excluding the existing staff from qualifying, because they "did not have the qualifications to fit the PD".

It goes on all the time in airlines, and not just the missing link.

I can't believe all you guys getting hardons over jets. When I joined Eastern in 1994 there were rumours of it happening. Almost 20 years later, still nothing had happened because COBHAM is the Qantaslink jet operator. (Yes, Southern had 146's for a little while).

Best get over it and fight the good fight in your next EBA without the distractions of the Furphy that is jets. They're only doing this to soften you up.

Agreed. Chalk and cheese. Of course, one method takes, time, effort, energy and therefore money. The modern way is devoid of all of those things.

Education is slow, expensive and works.

Legislation is quick, cheap and doesn't work.

Clearly, legislation is the winner! :ugh::{